SouthernComfort talking facts and common sense simply doesn't work. Folks have their minds made up. In all walks of life the person at the top is responsible. That's why they have the job. Be it politics, sport or business the buck stops at the top. Andrews has coached a very poor team that had/has no game plan. They are winging it and asking mates to help them out. They have ignored or knocked back offers of help from experienced sources. Sure there are idiot minorities but when the majority sees the leader turn a blind eye to a mass protest then they can only think it's ok for them to. Have rules. That's ok. But apply it evenly to EVERYONE. Don't make announcements without establishing the rules. Take more than a minute to consider the consequences of new rules. No knee jerk announcements. And finally take the politics out of the equation. And the mates in the unions.
I know some here will disagree with me. That's ok. We can all have opinions. But base those opinions on solid facts and not on fear and rumours.
Cupie said
05:23 PM Aug 6, 2020
bgt wrote:
SouthernComfort talking facts and common sense simply doesn't work. Folks have their minds made up. In all walks of life the person at the top is responsible. That's why they have the job. Be it politics, sport or business the buck stops at the top. Andrews has coached a very poor team that had/has no game plan. They are winging it and asking mates to help them out. They have ignored or knocked back offers of help from experienced sources. Sure there are idiot minorities but when the majority sees the leader turn a blind eye to a mass protest then they can only think it's ok for them to. Have rules. That's ok. But apply it evenly to EVERYONE. Don't make announcements without establishing the rules. Take more than a minute to consider the consequences of new rules. No knee jerk announcements. And finally take the politics out of the equation. And the mates in the unions. I know some here will disagree with me. That's ok. We can all have opinions. But base those opinions on solid facts and not on fear and rumours.
I find it difficult to respond to this post without resorting to arguments ad Hominem or ad Baculum.
Best I let it slide through to the Keeper & let others respond if the choose.
SouthernComfort said
05:44 PM Aug 6, 2020
bgt wrote:
SouthernComfort talking facts and common sense simply doesn't work. Folks have their minds made up. In all walks of life the person at the top is responsible. That's why they have the job. Be it politics, sport or business the buck stops at the top. Andrews has coached a very poor team that had/has no game plan. They are winging it and asking mates to help them out. They have ignored or knocked back offers of help from experienced sources. Sure there are idiot minorities but when the majority sees the leader turn a blind eye to a mass protest then they can only think it's ok for them to. Have rules. That's ok. But apply it evenly to EVERYONE. Don't make announcements without establishing the rules. Take more than a minute to consider the consequences of new rules. No knee jerk announcements. And finally take the politics out of the equation. And the mates in the unions. I know some here will disagree with me. That's ok. We can all have opinions. But base those opinions on solid facts and not on fear and rumours.
Thank you for understanding my point bgt. I know I'm flogging a dead horse, but that's the trouble with facts, they represent the inconvenient truth which often counters the popularist narrative. Some will indeed disagree with you, as they do with me, it worries me not. Whilst I respect that others have a right to their own opinions, mine will remain unchanged. As a former business leader and employer I would never have got away with some of the practices we've experienced from this govt. which has basically lurched from one bad decision to another. A good leader will consult widely, gather the facts, consolidate the best available resources and deploy his/her team to implement strategy that will assure the security, well being and prosperity of all stakeholders.
blaze said
05:50 PM Aug 6, 2020
SouthernComfort wrote:
bgt wrote:
SouthernComfort talking facts and common sense simply doesn't work. Folks have their minds made up. In all walks of life the person at the top is responsible. That's why they have the job. Be it politics, sport or business the buck stops at the top. Andrews has coached a very poor team that had/has no game plan. They are winging it and asking mates to help them out. They have ignored or knocked back offers of help from experienced sources. Sure there are idiot minorities but when the majority sees the leader turn a blind eye to a mass protest then they can only think it's ok for them to. Have rules. That's ok. But apply it evenly to EVERYONE. Don't make announcements without establishing the rules. Take more than a minute to consider the consequences of new rules. No knee jerk announcements. And finally take the politics out of the equation. And the mates in the unions. I know some here will disagree with me. That's ok. We can all have opinions. But base those opinions on solid facts and not on fear and rumours.
Thank you for understanding my point bgt. I know I'm flogging a dead horse, but that's the trouble with facts, they represent the inconvenient truth which often counters the popularist narrative. Some will indeed disagree with you, as they do with me, it worries me not. Whilst I respect that others have a right to their own opinions, mine will remain unchanged. As a former business leader and employer I would never have got away with some of the practices we've experienced from this govt. which has basically lurched from one bad decision to another. A good leader will consult widely, gather the facts, consolidate the best available resources and deploy his/her team to implement strategy that will assure the security, well being and prosperity of all stakeholders.
How long is it since you have seen any Government do the things you suggest, been a long time.
cheers
blaze
bgt said
06:19 PM Aug 6, 2020
TonyBev you failed to include one other point... "I can see the increase in suicides from loss of dignity and a life's work".
I'll bet the majority of those who dismiss the economy are financially secure and don't really understand what its like to lose everything you ever worked for. Imagine you are close to retirement and poof, everything has gone. Business, house, savings and dignity. But who cares? Who really cares? Not those who aren't capable of looking after themselves and need a government to tell them what to do, how often to do it and when to do it.
How about a bit of empathy and personal responsibility. How about a bit of balance. The world isn't black and white. Closing everything down won't fix everything. It's just not that simple. Although some may think it is. This is going to be a long slow grind. There never has been a covid vaccine. So we have to learn to live with it. Regardless of the consequences. Hiding under the bed simply won't work.
Australia was doing really well. Andrews stuffed it up. Fact. Undeniable fact. Throw all the dirt you like at me. No matter how much dirt you throw you will never change the facts.
Now I'm off to have a chat the Chicken Little.
Sarco Harris said
08:33 PM Aug 6, 2020
Tony Bev,
So when the economy tanks, where is the money going to come from to pay for the support measures needed to maintain the health system, the support payment systems and most importantly the pensions.
I would fully expect that all incomes of any descriptions will become heavily taxed, NO exemptions and NO deductions
Governments, regardless of their ilk will be looking for every cent they can get.
It is likely that we will kiss goodbye to the Future Fund,
Kiss goodbye to a substantial proportion of the $trillions in super funds,
SMSF will be stripped with taxation and next to 0% interest.
So you are placing YOUR health above the rest of the country, Good luck with your health.
So, like Vic, we borrow hugely from overseas (read China - Belt & Roads) and then to repay that debt when it is called in, how do we do that, we become another clone - business ALL owned/ran by foreigners, all manufacturing at the appropriate foreigners approved wage rates etc.
In the mean time we continue to have all decisions made and rules implemented un-elected public service "advisors" that have been appointed, not on ability, but gender, ethnic group, disability etc. making decisions and recommendation that are grabbed desperately by our "elected" representatives that also have absolutely no idea because they been nominated based on the same criteria. All while virtually all of both groups have only EVER been on the public teat.
SouthernComfort said
09:59 PM Aug 6, 2020
Well said Sarco Harris. Unfortunately there are those who still won't accept the facts. God help us, we need some broader awakening to take place whereupon the ideologues shift into reality. We live in hope.
Tony Bev said
10:11 PM Aug 6, 2020
bgt wrote:
TonyBev you failed to include one other point... "I can see the increase in suicides from loss of dignity and a life's work". I'll bet the majority of those who dismiss the economy are financially secure and don't really understand what its like to lose everything you ever worked for. Imagine you are close to retirement and poof, everything has gone. Business, house, savings and dignity. But who cares? Who really cares? Not those who aren't capable of looking after themselves and need a government to tell them what to do, how often to do it and when to do it. How about a bit of empathy and personal responsibility. How about a bit of balance. The world isn't black and white. Closing everything down won't fix everything. It's just not that simple. Although some may think it is. This is going to be a long slow grind. There never has been a covid vaccine. So we have to learn to live with it. Regardless of the consequences. Hiding under the bed simply won't work. Australia was doing really well. Andrews stuffed it up. Fact. Undeniable fact. Throw all the dirt you like at me. No matter how much dirt you throw you will never change the facts. Now I'm off to have a chat the Chicken Little.
Hi bgt
I shall answer the questions the best I can, in my uneducated layman speak I shall point out that when I left school at 15 years of age, my leaving certificate (like other boys of my era), was the footprint of the teacher, on our rear end We had no chance of carrying on to higher education, as there were not enough schools
TonyBev you failed to include one other point... "I can see the increase in suicides from loss of dignity and a life's work"
To try and answer the above question. In my opinion,
If there was one, and only one reason for suicide, then prevention would have been in place, long before today
I personally know of 4 suicides from 1966 to 1990, in each case the person were all male between the ages of 20 and 30 years Each person was also in the workforce, with secure jobs, 3 out of 4 used recreational drugs
I personally know of another 2 suicides, in more modern times, 2010 to 2016, both males, both working, 17 to 30 years of age, no drugs of which I am aware of
If there is going to be a trade off between business as usual, and some Coronavirus deaths, or lockdowns and some extra suicides, then I go for lockdowns/ring fence/border closure etc
I base my reasoning on two known factors
If you can see someone has suicidal thoughts, you may be able to help them
You will never know, if the person walking towards you has Coronavirus, as they look no different than anyone else, and then you will also unknowingly spread it
I'll bet the majority of those who dismiss the economy are financially secure and don't really understand what its like to lose everything you ever worked
To try and answer the above question, as I can only speak for myself, yes I have a few pennies in Superannuation, but not a lot, otherwise I would not have to plan my travelling, using free/donation camp
I do expect the share market to just about crash
I do expect returns from Superannuation to go downwards
I do expect cash interest from the banks, to go down to zero
I do expect the Government to raid, Superannuation accounts
I do expect the Government to tax all of us to the hilt
I do expect tax on fuel to be so high, that some of us will no longer be travelling
I do expect the Government to bring in very high death duties
I will accept all the above financial hardships, as I believe that it will happen, as up to date, we have borrowed from the future, to pay for the present I will not accept any leader worth their salt, placing economy before health
How about a bit of empathy and personal responsibility. How about a bit of balance. The world isn't black and white. Closing everything down won't fix everything.
To try and answer the above question
I agree that closing everything down, will fix nothing except to try and eliminate a pandemic, which mankind has no history of
I point out that trying to strike a balance, between health and economy, has not worked in other countries My understanding of reading the media is that in some countries, USA, UK etc, etc, both their economy and their health are in shambles, as they have tried to strike a balance
This is going to be a long slow grind. There never has been a covid vaccine. So we have to learn to live with it. Regardless of the consequences. Hiding under the bed simply won't work
I am afraid that this is where, I have to agree to disagree, and please remember I am answering the question, and not attacking the person putting it forward In my opinion, the consequences of living with Coronavirus, will be worse than hiding under the bed
We know that lockdowns (hiding under the bed) will give zero economic benefits
We do not know, what will happen in the future, if Australia can not eliminate Coronavirus
blaze said
10:30 PM Aug 6, 2020
well thought out tony IMO
cheers
blaze
Tony Bev said
10:45 PM Aug 6, 2020
Sarco Harris wrote:
Hi Sarco Harris I will try to answer this post, as it was directed to me, just remember that I am answering the question/s based on my opinion/s I am not attacking the person putting the question forward
Tony Bev,
So when the economy tanks, where is the money going to come from to pay for the support measures needed to maintain the health system, the support payment systems and most importantly the pensions. To answer the above, The Government is already using money from the future, to pay for today, (they have already borrowed some of it), as of about a fortnight ago, (23 July 2020) the budget deficit was about $86 Billion
I would fully expect that all incomes of any descriptions will become heavily taxed, NO exemptions and NO deductions
Governments, regardless of their ilk will be looking for every cent they can get. It is likely that we will kiss goodbye to the Future Fund, Kiss goodbye to a substantial proportion of the $trillions in super funds, SMSF will be stripped with taxation and next to 0% interest.
To answer the above, I agree with what you say, and I actually expect the Government, to hit us harder than that, such as death duties etc
So you are placing YOUR health above the rest of the country, Good luck with your health.
To answer the above, thank you for your concern about my health, and although I answer for no one else, I am sure that some of the other 25½ million Australians, also thank you
So, like Vic, we borrow hugely from overseas (read China - Belt & Roads) and then to repay that debt when it is called in, how do we do that, we become another clone - business ALL owned/ran by foreigners, all manufacturing at the appropriate foreigners approved wage rates etc.
To answer the above, there is another way of looking at this, Australia can be self sufficient, if we have to keep a hard external border, we will have to manufacture what we require, ourselves
In the mean time we continue to have all decisions made and rules implemented un-elected public service "advisors" that have been appointed, not on ability, but gender, ethnic group, disability etc. making decisions and recommendation that are grabbed desperately by our "elected" representatives that also have absolutely no idea because they been nominated based on the same criteria. All while virtually all of both groups have only EVER been on the public teat.
I am afraid that I am unable to answer the above, as I have no opinion/knowledge of how the Government actually operates What I do know, is that about the only job available for Australians, with absolutely no qualifications whatsoever, is to become a politition Perhaps the Government actually need advisors
Ger08 said
01:40 AM Aug 7, 2020
Hello from the COVID-19 free Republic of Westralia. Im so pleased we have had a hard border. These debates about who is going pay for this and that and should taxes go up are completely irrelevant. This situation that is been faced by not only our country but but the world hasnt been seen in over 100 years and because it was happening so fast decisions had to made fast. We as country have done remarkably well and now is NOT the time for finger pointing or blaming. We all need to come together and do the right thing and those that cant need to be dealt with severely.
One of the best things to come out of this was the national cabinet and the dropping of the whole right wing and left wing BS.
The greatest thing to come out of this is that we in WA had sense of what secession might be like, and yes we actually once voted in favour of it.
Long live the republic
-- Edited by Ger08 on Friday 7th of August 2020 01:41:42 AM
bgt said
08:35 AM Aug 7, 2020
All I can say Tony Bev you live one hell of a negative live. Your glass will always be half empty. And if stress doesn't get you in the end it will be because of your lack of empathy or understanding of how the real world works. You need to understand that utopia does exist, never has and never will.
Good luck.
SouthernComfort said
09:10 AM Aug 7, 2020
Ger08 wrote:
Hello from the COVID-19 free Republic of Westralia. Im so pleased we have had a hard border. These debates about who is going pay for this and that and should taxes go up are completely irrelevant. This situation that is been faced by not only our country but but the world hasnt been seen in over 100 years and because it was happening so fast decisions had to made fast. We as country have done remarkably well and now is NOT the time for finger pointing or blaming. We all need to come together and do the right thing and those that cant need to be dealt with severely.
One of the best things to come out of this was the national cabinet and the dropping of the whole right wing and left wing BS.Oh really??
The greatest thing to come out of this is that we in WA had sense of what secession might be like, and yes we actually once voted in favour of it.
Long live the republic
-- Edited by Ger08 on Friday 7th of August 2020 01:41:42 AM
Seriously Ger08? I almost envy that you can hold these blissfully simplistic views, but honestly, if you deeply believe all that there's no point in discussing reality. Indeed, in WA you are far removed from the rest of the country, in more ways than one. Good luck in your Utopian world.
SouthernComfort said
09:53 AM Aug 7, 2020
Some updates concerning the Socialist Republic of Victoria:
* Yesterday's estimate of 250,000 Victorian job losses arising over the next 6 weeks has now elevated to 300,000. Watch this space.
* Calls to Lifeline have reached one every 30 seconds.
* The PM grants an additional $7.5 million federal funding for mental health support in Victoria. $2.5 million is to help shore up Lifeline, a predominantly volunteer organisation.
* Yesterday, the premier finally declared that he is accountable for "any mistakes" his govt has made (ref. hotel quarantine catastrophe) when pressured for answers in his media conference. Still no answers however, and still refusing to explain how it happened or which department was responsible, yet he said openly that "he was made aware of the failures along the way". When asked if he knew who was responsible for training the guards he replied "multiple people had oversight, it's not clear". Continuing to use the quarantining 'enquiry' as an excuse for refusing to answer questions, the (ex) judge presiding over the enquiry has said there is nothing to stop premier commenting in the meantime.
* State electoral offices have been declared non-essential services and are closed, no one has access to representatives of the opposition. Meanwhile it is interesting that the premier retains more ministerial officers than the prime minister.
bgt said
10:33 AM Aug 7, 2020
Victoria has declared that meatworks will cut to 66%. The premier said that there would be no meat shortages. Well how does supply and demand work in Victoria? He went onto say that you may not get your favourite cut but meat will be available. So how does that work? Slaughter only 66% of the cow and leave the prime cuts eating grass in the paddock? Mr Andrews if you slaughter a cow you have no choice but to have all the cuts. You can't avoid the prime cuts. This is typical of how Victoria is being run. Tradies are only allowed 25% of their work. So does that include 24 hour emergency calls to your plumber or electrician? "Sorry Mr Jones I can't restore your power because I have already fixed X number today". And who determines how many clients a day a tradie can't services?
I could go on. But those with clear logic will get my point.
Greg 1 said
11:08 AM Aug 7, 2020
The fact remains that those States that had a hard lock down to start with, went early with restrictions and closed their borders have gotten on top of this virus.
WA is operating, at a basic level, almost normally.
Yes the economy and business has taken a hit but most are back trading and coming out of it.
There are some, such as the airlines and tourist industries, that are still hurting, although many in the tourist industry are doing ok, as West Australians are travelling within the state. A friend has just come back from Broome and said there are so many people travelling north, it's a zoo up there.
The States that have governments prepared to make those tough early decisions and stick to them are now starting to see the benefits.
It is not over yet by a long shot.
The Andrew's government certainly made some very silly decisions, did not lock the borders like other states and of course the debacle of the hotel quarantine.
I distinctly remember Andrew's berating the SA premier about not opening their borders and slamming SA saying it wasn't somewhere anyone would want to visit anyway. An inane comment particularly if you have spent time in SA seeing the great places on offer there.
Andrew's chickens have now come home to roost to the detriment of Victorians trying to do the right thing. I am just glad we have Mark McGowan as our Premier and he has had the intestinal fortitude to stick to his guns under what has been some enormous pressure from governments both Federal and State plus the ridiculous Clive Palmer affair.
SouthernComfort said
11:29 AM Aug 7, 2020
bgt wrote:
Victoria has declared that meatworks will cut to 66%. The premier said that there would be no meat shortages. Well how does supply and demand work in Victoria? He went onto say that you may not get your favourite cut but meat will be available. So how does that work? Slaughter only 66% of the cow and leave the prime cuts eating grass in the paddock? Mr Andrews if you slaughter a cow you have no choice but to have all the cuts. You can't avoid the prime cuts. This is typical of how Victoria is being run. Tradies are only allowed 25% of their work. So does that include 24 hour emergency calls to your plumber or electrician? "Sorry Mr Jones I can't restore your power because I have already fixed X number today". And who determines how many clients a day a tradie can't services? I could go on. But those with clear logic will get my point.
Now then bgt, you're getting as bad as me at falling into the common sense trap! The underlying assumption in all the Chairman's messages is that we're ALL idiots, not just a few. No thought process. These are just more typical examples of the BS put out by someone on a power trip without a rudder. Among the trades banned from working altogether include mowing businesses - how they can possibly pose a risk is anybody's guess - no need to see the guy, you pay into his bank or leave cash in the mail box. It's not about pretty lawns either, there are many large properties including agistment businesses in my area who can't get any clearing done, hazards will be created. As for home repairs, fingers crossed we don't have a burst pipe or failed hot water system as waiting for the plumber would be a joke, if it were funny.
Anyhow, the cracks are opening up now, it'll take more than a few buckets of builders bog to patch up this govt's antics.
Tony Bev said
01:14 PM Aug 7, 2020
bgt wrote:
All I can say Tony Bev you live one hell of a negative live. Your glass will always be half empty. And if stress doesn't get you in the end it will be because of your lack of empathy or understanding of how the real world works. You need to understand that utopia does exist, never has and never will. Good luck.
Bgt, as I am unsure if you are upset, have misinterpreted my reply, or are just trying to bait me.
I would just like to say that, I disagree with your written opinion of me, I know for a fact that I am exactly opposite, of (what I have interpreted) you have written
Tony Bev said
01:56 PM Aug 7, 2020
The topic of this post is about the closing of the Queensland border
My stance is that I agree with the Queensland, (and all other borders) closing, to stop the spread of Covid-19
I have yet to read (anywhere in the media), that keeping borders open, will assist in the eradication of Covid-19
For those who think that the future loss of monetary/property/business wealth, will be absolutely unbearable
I can only sympathize, and would help if I could
I point out that 75 years ago yesterday, a bomb was dropped on a city
In a few short minutes, that city was destroyed, and help was not immediately available to the survivors
It would have been a catastrophe, for those who lived in that city, they had lost everything
Some of them even lost the clothes, which had been burnt off their backs
They would have probably felt that all hope was lost, but those people who survived, lived through it
We can also live through this present pandemic, we are all in it together
For me, there is no, us or them, I am just fortunate to have a home base, in a State which has no internal restrictions, at the moment
Some of us, (including me), will eventually lose most of the wealth, we had spent a lifetime accumulating
The main reason is that the Government, has and will again, borrow/ed from others, and will require a lot of money in the foreseeable future
I am not COMplaining, I am just EXplaining, the way I see things through my own eyes
msg said
05:33 PM Aug 7, 2020
I am puzzled: If you look at the current crop of world leaders, especially, Australia, USA and Britain they do not appear to be of the same calibre as previous. Why is nobody putting their hands up? do we have no strong tough minded ambitious persons or are they afraid that if they won office they would have to deal with situations like the current ones. I just seems to me, everything you look at is falling apart. Health, education, lack of respect for the police and a hundred other issues. Or is it the abuse and disrespect they have to cope with?
Its even the same with our travelling. When I started out about 10yrs ago it was with a sense of lets get out there and discover this wonderful country, lets have a great time interacting with people doing the same things. Now, it is all too often, leave me alone I just want to get away from people, sit around and drink and take drugs. What happened?
SouthernComfort said
05:57 PM Aug 7, 2020
msg wrote:
I am puzzled: If you look at the current crop of world leaders, especially, Australia, USA and Britain they do not appear to be of the same calibre as previous. Why is nobody putting their hands up? do we have no strong tough minded ambitious persons or are they afraid that if they won office they would have to deal with situations like the current ones. I just seems to me, everything you look at is falling apart. Health, education, lack of respect for the police and a hundred other issues. Or is it the abuse and disrespect they have to cope with?
Its even the same with our travelling. When I started out about 10yrs ago it was with a sense of lets get out there and discover this wonderful country, lets have a great time interacting with people doing the same things. Now, it is all too often, leave me alone I just want to get away from people, sit around and drink and take drugs. What happened?
Yep, quite possibly the reason we don't have many good prospective leaders lining up, or even candidates for other roles of authority. The degradation of western society is hard for any of us to fathom at times. A combination of different 'standards' and behaviours in later generations, absurd levels of political correctness and highly organised anarchists intent on destroying what we have left is rife the world over. Now ISIS is trying to mobilise disciples once again to hit on Australia. Little wonder we can't get enough police, decent teachers or effective leaders. Sadly I think many people these days just retreat into a 'look after number syndrome' and try to hide from the rest.
blaze said
06:20 PM Aug 7, 2020
instead of moaning and complaining on a internet forum, put your hand up for the next election. You may find that less people have your views than you think. I dont think there are any here would get my vote.
cheers
blaze
yobarr said
06:40 PM Aug 7, 2020
msg wrote:
I am puzzled: If you look at the current crop of world leaders, especially, Australia, USA and Britain they do not appear to be of the same calibre as previous. Why is nobody putting their hands up? do we have no strong tough minded ambitious persons or are they afraid that if they won office they would have to deal with situations like the current ones. I just seems to me, everything you look at is falling apart. Health, education, lack of respect for the police and a hundred other issues. Or is it the abuse and disrespect they have to cope with?
Its even the same with our travelling. When I started out about 10yrs ago it was with a sense of lets get out there and discover this wonderful country, lets have a great time interacting with people doing the same things. Now, it is all too often, leave me alone I just want to get away from people, sit around and drink and take drugs. What happened?
Absolutely! We have an entire generation that knows all about its "rights",but nothing of responsibilities.And I read of bush fire victims who cannot rebuild their destroyed homes until they pay $5000 (?) for the Greenies to conduct research on how the local koalas will be affected.Spare me. As for "putting your hand up for the next election",I believe that this would be an exercise in futility because of the huge numbers of "gimmes" in our midst. Cheers
SouthernComfort said
07:00 PM Aug 7, 2020
blaze wrote:
instead of moaning and complaining on a internet forum, put your hand up for the next election. You may find that less people have your views than you think. I dont think there are any here would get my vote. cheers blaze
Great troll effort mate. You obviously have all the answers so we'll await your political candidacy campaign with interest. Or maybe not....
blaze said
07:11 PM Aug 7, 2020
SouthernComfort wrote:
blaze wrote:
instead of moaning and complaining on a internet forum, put your hand up for the next election. You may find that less people have your views than you think. I dont think there are any here would get my vote. cheers blaze
Great troll effort mate. You obviously have all the answers so we'll await your political candidacy campaign with interest. Or maybe not....
had a crack qt it about 30 years ago
cheers
blaze
ps you wont find me running down one or the other
Ger08 said
02:27 AM Aug 8, 2020
SouthernComfort wrote:
Ger08 wrote:
Hello from the COVID-19 free Republic of Westralia. Im so pleased we have had a hard border. These debates about who is going pay for this and that and should taxes go up are completely irrelevant. This situation that is been faced by not only our country but but the world hasnt been seen in over 100 years and because it was happening so fast decisions had to made fast. We as country have done remarkably well and now is NOT the time for finger pointing or blaming. We all need to come together and do the right thing and those that cant need to be dealt with severely.
One of the best things to come out of this was the national cabinet and the dropping of the whole right wing and left wing BS.Oh really??
The greatest thing to come out of this is that we in WA had sense of what secession might be like, and yes we actually once voted in favour of it.
Long live the republic
-- Edited by Ger08 on Friday 7th of August 2020 01:41:42 AM
Seriously Ger08? I almost envy that you can hold these blissfully simplistic views, but honestly, if you deeply believe all that there's no point in discussing reality. Indeed, in WA you are far removed from the rest of the country, in more ways than one. Good luck in your Utopian world.
Poor old SC - the reality is that the national cabinet did an excellent job of uniting and stabilising the country, and when asked the overwhelming majority of voters supported and welcomed it. You clearly have no idea of what the people actually wanted because you live in your on blinkered world.
-- Edited by Ger08 on Saturday 8th of August 2020 02:28:45 AM
Mike Harding said
07:03 AM Aug 8, 2020
blaze wrote:
instead of moaning and complaining on a internet forum, put your hand up for the next election. You may find that less people have your views than you think. I dont think there are any here would get my vote.
Well blaze, as you're a regular moaner and complainer I fully expect to see you standing next time.
A couple of issues with our (and most other) "democracies":
1 - Nowadays most (all?) politicians are career politicians and have little experience of the real world. They are compelled to follow the party line which usually seeks to satiate the loudest lobby group. The 24 hour news cycle, which mostly has nothing new, invents issues in order to harass politicians and get a story/headline. (un)Social media adds to this.
2 - Essentially, all the democracies offer voters a choice between two parties - *never* have I agreed with more than, maybe, 50% of the policies of the party for which I voted (swinging voter here) so invariably we're voting for the least worse party rather than one we actually *want*.
Webmaster said
09:10 AM Aug 8, 2020
Hi all, I think I will close this now. Just a reminder to please keep posts focused on the topic and not the person who is posting. We would like our forum to be a positive place for discussion. We welcome robust discussions; however personal attacks and comments have no place here.
-- Edited by Webmaster on Saturday 8th of August 2020 09:13:48 AM
I find it difficult to respond to this post without resorting to arguments ad Hominem or ad Baculum.
Best I let it slide through to the Keeper & let others respond if the choose.
Thank you for understanding my point bgt. I know I'm flogging a dead horse, but that's the trouble with facts, they represent the inconvenient truth which often counters the popularist narrative. Some will indeed disagree with you, as they do with me, it worries me not. Whilst I respect that others have a right to their own opinions, mine will remain unchanged. As a former business leader and employer I would never have got away with some of the practices we've experienced from this govt. which has basically lurched from one bad decision to another. A good leader will consult widely, gather the facts, consolidate the best available resources and deploy his/her team to implement strategy that will assure the security, well being and prosperity of all stakeholders.
How long is it since you have seen any Government do the things you suggest, been a long time.
cheers
blaze
So when the economy tanks, where is the money going to come from to pay for the support measures needed to maintain the health system, the support payment systems and most importantly the pensions.
I would fully expect that all incomes of any descriptions will become heavily taxed, NO exemptions and NO deductions
Governments, regardless of their ilk will be looking for every cent they can get.
It is likely that we will kiss goodbye to the Future Fund,
Kiss goodbye to a substantial proportion of the $trillions in super funds,
SMSF will be stripped with taxation and next to 0% interest.
So you are placing YOUR health above the rest of the country, Good luck with your health.
So, like Vic, we borrow hugely from overseas (read China - Belt & Roads) and then to repay that debt when it is called in, how do we do that, we become another clone - business ALL owned/ran by foreigners, all manufacturing at the appropriate foreigners approved wage rates etc.
In the mean time we continue to have all decisions made and rules implemented un-elected public service "advisors" that have been appointed, not on ability, but gender, ethnic group, disability etc. making decisions and recommendation that are grabbed desperately by our "elected" representatives that also have absolutely no idea because they been nominated based on the same criteria. All while virtually all of both groups have only EVER been on the public teat.
Hi bgt
I shall answer the questions the best I can, in my uneducated layman speak
I shall point out that when I left school at 15 years of age, my leaving certificate (like other boys of my era), was the footprint of the teacher, on our rear end
We had no chance of carrying on to higher education, as there were not enough schools
To try and answer the above question. In my opinion,
Each person was also in the workforce, with secure jobs, 3 out of 4 used recreational drugs
If there is going to be a trade off between business as usual, and some Coronavirus deaths, or lockdowns and some extra suicides, then I go for lockdowns/ring fence/border closure etc
I base my reasoning on two known factors
To try and answer the above question, as I can only speak for myself, yes I have a few pennies in Superannuation, but not a lot, otherwise I would not have to plan my travelling, using free/donation camp
I will accept all the above financial hardships, as I believe that it will happen, as up to date, we have borrowed from the future, to pay for the present
I will not accept any leader worth their salt, placing economy before health
To try and answer the above question
I agree that closing everything down, will fix nothing except to try and eliminate a pandemic, which mankind has no history of
I point out that trying to strike a balance, between health and economy, has not worked in other countries
My understanding of reading the media is that in some countries, USA, UK etc, etc, both their economy and their health are in shambles, as they have tried to strike a balance
I am afraid that this is where, I have to agree to disagree, and please remember I am answering the question, and not attacking the person putting it forward
In my opinion, the consequences of living with Coronavirus, will be worse than hiding under the bed
cheers
blaze
Hello from the COVID-19 free Republic of Westralia. Im so pleased we have had a hard border. These debates about who is going pay for this and that and should taxes go up are completely irrelevant. This situation that is been faced by not only our country but but the world hasnt been seen in over 100 years and because it was happening so fast decisions had to made fast. We as country have done remarkably well and now is NOT the time for finger pointing or blaming. We all need to come together and do the right thing and those that cant need to be dealt with severely.
One of the best things to come out of this was the national cabinet and the dropping of the whole right wing and left wing BS.
The greatest thing to come out of this is that we in WA had sense of what secession might be like, and yes we actually once voted in favour of it.
Long live the republic
-- Edited by Ger08 on Friday 7th of August 2020 01:41:42 AM
Seriously Ger08? I almost envy that you can hold these blissfully simplistic views, but honestly, if you deeply believe all that there's no point in discussing reality. Indeed, in WA you are far removed from the rest of the country, in more ways than one. Good luck in your Utopian world.
* Yesterday's estimate of 250,000 Victorian job losses arising over the next 6 weeks has now elevated to 300,000. Watch this space.
* Calls to Lifeline have reached one every 30 seconds.
* The PM grants an additional $7.5 million federal funding for mental health support in Victoria. $2.5 million is to help shore up Lifeline, a predominantly volunteer organisation.
* Yesterday, the premier finally declared that he is accountable for "any mistakes" his govt has made (ref. hotel quarantine catastrophe) when pressured for answers in his media conference. Still no answers however, and still refusing to explain how it happened or which department was responsible, yet he said openly that "he was made aware of the failures along the way". When asked if he knew who was responsible for training the guards he replied "multiple people had oversight, it's not clear". Continuing to use the quarantining 'enquiry' as an excuse for refusing to answer questions, the (ex) judge presiding over the enquiry has said there is nothing to stop premier commenting in the meantime.
* State electoral offices have been declared non-essential services and are closed, no one has access to representatives of the opposition. Meanwhile it is interesting that the premier retains more ministerial officers than the prime minister.
Now then bgt, you're getting as bad as me at falling into the common sense trap! The underlying assumption in all the Chairman's messages is that we're ALL idiots, not just a few. No thought process. These are just more typical examples of the BS put out by someone on a power trip without a rudder. Among the trades banned from working altogether include mowing businesses - how they can possibly pose a risk is anybody's guess - no need to see the guy, you pay into his bank or leave cash in the mail box. It's not about pretty lawns either, there are many large properties including agistment businesses in my area who can't get any clearing done, hazards will be created. As for home repairs, fingers crossed we don't have a burst pipe or failed hot water system as waiting for the plumber would be a joke, if it were funny.
Anyhow, the cracks are opening up now, it'll take more than a few buckets of builders bog to patch up this govt's antics.
Bgt, as I am unsure if you are upset, have misinterpreted my reply, or are just trying to bait me.
I would just like to say that, I disagree with your written opinion of me, I know for a fact that I am exactly opposite, of (what I have interpreted) you have written
My stance is that I agree with the Queensland, (and all other borders) closing, to stop the spread of Covid-19
I have yet to read (anywhere in the media), that keeping borders open, will assist in the eradication of Covid-19
For those who think that the future loss of monetary/property/business wealth, will be absolutely unbearable
I can only sympathize, and would help if I could
I point out that 75 years ago yesterday, a bomb was dropped on a city
In a few short minutes, that city was destroyed, and help was not immediately available to the survivors
It would have been a catastrophe, for those who lived in that city, they had lost everything
Some of them even lost the clothes, which had been burnt off their backs
They would have probably felt that all hope was lost, but those people who survived, lived through it
We can also live through this present pandemic, we are all in it together
For me, there is no, us or them, I am just fortunate to have a home base, in a State which has no internal restrictions, at the moment
Some of us, (including me), will eventually lose most of the wealth, we had spent a lifetime accumulating
The main reason is that the Government, has and will again, borrow/ed from others, and will require a lot of money in the foreseeable future
I am not COMplaining, I am just EXplaining, the way I see things through my own eyes
Its even the same with our travelling. When I started out about 10yrs ago it was with a sense of lets get out there and discover this wonderful country, lets have a great time interacting with people doing the same things. Now, it is all too often, leave me alone I just want to get away from people, sit around and drink and take drugs. What happened?
Yep, quite possibly the reason we don't have many good prospective leaders lining up, or even candidates for other roles of authority. The degradation of western society is hard for any of us to fathom at times. A combination of different 'standards' and behaviours in later generations, absurd levels of political correctness and highly organised anarchists intent on destroying what we have left is rife the world over. Now ISIS is trying to mobilise disciples once again to hit on Australia. Little wonder we can't get enough police, decent teachers or effective leaders. Sadly I think many people these days just retreat into a 'look after number syndrome' and try to hide from the rest.
cheers
blaze
Absolutely! We have an entire generation that knows all about its "rights",but nothing of responsibilities.And I read of bush fire victims who cannot rebuild their destroyed homes until they pay $5000 (?) for the Greenies to conduct research on how the local koalas will be affected.Spare me. As for "putting your hand up for the next election",I believe that this would be an exercise in futility because of the huge numbers of "gimmes" in our midst. Cheers
Great troll effort mate. You obviously have all the answers so we'll await your political candidacy campaign with interest. Or maybe not....
had a crack qt it about 30 years ago
cheers
blaze
ps you wont find me running down one or the other
Poor old SC - the reality is that the national cabinet did an excellent job of uniting and stabilising the country, and when asked the overwhelming majority of voters supported and welcomed it. You clearly have no idea of what the people actually wanted because you live in your on blinkered world.
-- Edited by Ger08 on Saturday 8th of August 2020 02:28:45 AM
Well blaze, as you're a regular moaner and complainer I fully expect to see you standing next time.
A couple of issues with our (and most other) "democracies":
1 - Nowadays most (all?) politicians are career politicians and have little experience of the real world. They are compelled to follow the party line which usually seeks to satiate the loudest lobby group. The 24 hour news cycle, which mostly has nothing new, invents issues in order to harass politicians and get a story/headline. (un)Social media adds to this.
2 - Essentially, all the democracies offer voters a choice between two parties - *never* have I agreed with more than, maybe, 50% of the policies of the party for which I voted (swinging voter here) so invariably we're voting for the least worse party rather than one we actually *want*.
Hi all,
I think I will close this now. Just a reminder to please keep posts focused on the topic and not the person who is posting. We would like our forum to be a positive place for discussion. We welcome robust discussions; however personal attacks and comments have no place here.
-- Edited by Webmaster on Saturday 8th of August 2020 09:13:48 AM