Peter_n_Margaret wrote:

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HandyWalter wrote:

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Peter_n_Margaret wrote:

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Black top is a different matter.
I have never heard of air bags being designed into a 4WD vehicle designed for off road use.
Cheers,
Peter

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 Obviously have not heard of Discovery, Range Rover or Defender? All now have air suspensions with bags in each corner. And yes I am biased, but straight off the showroom floor, they perform better as tow tugs (except defender as its so new) and as 4WD's, than any other wagon type vehicle. 

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 Maybe, maybe not. You might know therefore that the Range Rover was the first 4WD ever to be declared "un fit to drive across the Simpson Desert" by the Mount Dare workshop. That was mostly to do with the low profile tyres fitted, but it does clearly demonstrate that off road performance is a long way down from the design priority of these vehicles. 

Cheers,

Peter

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 Hi Peter

neither my Range rover classic or my p38 had low profile tyres, both on bags with very few problems in the time I owned them, Certainly less problems then earlier leaf springs with broken leaves or bloody center bolts. Thinking about it, maybe my coil sprung vehicles have been the most reliable. I do like the common old rocker system on a trailer of any sort though

cheers

blaze

Peter_n_Margaret wrote:

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 Maybe, maybe not. You might know therefore that the Range Rover was the first 4WD ever to be declared "un fit to drive across the Simpson Desert" by the Mount Dare workshop. That was mostly to do with the low profile tyres fitted, but it does clearly demonstrate that off road performance is a long way down from the design priority of these vehicles. 

Cheers,

Peter

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 And obviously never driven or been in one. There are options for tyre profiles if you want them, but many dont bother and I have been over the Simpson with Range Rovers and Discoveries, plus a lot of other tracks. Your comments seem to show that you stick to the roads well traveled, not the oft beaten track less well traveled and I can understand that looking at your Avtar. So you have no idea of the cars I mentioned capabilities. Perhaps you should google them, especially the new Defender, which just might change your view on how capable they are, straight off the showroom floor with no mods whatsoever.

Oh, I have been around a bit .

The Defender used to be a good off road choice (pre the current wheel and tyre options especially), but they are doing their best to stop that, along with the other vehicles in the range. Simply too many compromises to black top travel.

So what are the tyre options for the current Defender and Discovery?

And I have seen what that design philosophy is doing to the Simpson and other tracks as they are slowly and surely wrecked.

Cheers,

Peter 

HandyWalter wrote:

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Peter_n_Margaret wrote:

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 Maybe, maybe not. You might know therefore that the Range Rover was the first 4WD ever to be declared "un fit to drive across the Simpson Desert" by the Mount Dare workshop. That was mostly to do with the low profile tyres fitted, but it does clearly demonstrate that off road performance is a long way down from the design priority of these vehicles. 

Cheers,

Peter

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 Your comments seem to show that you stick to the roads well traveled, not the oft beaten track less well traveled and I can understand that looking at your Avtar.

Surely you jest? There would be few,if any,members of this forum who have been further off the beaten track than have Peter-n-Margaret. 

So you have no idea of the cars I mentioned capabilities. Perhaps you should google them, especially the new Defender, which just might change your view on how capable they are, straight off the showroom floor with no mods whatsoever.

Or,if you are willing to add your name to the current 6 month waiting list,you could simply buy a 79? Nothing compares or competes.Cheers

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yobarr wrote:

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HandyWalter wrote:

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Peter_n_Margaret wrote:

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 Maybe, maybe not. You might know therefore that the Range Rover was the first 4WD ever to be declared "un fit to drive across the Simpson Desert" by the Mount Dare workshop. That was mostly to do with the low profile tyres fitted, but it does clearly demonstrate that off road performance is a long way down from the design priority of these vehicles. 

Cheers,

Peter

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 Your comments seem to show that you stick to the roads well traveled, not the oft beaten track less well traveled and I can understand that looking at your Avtar.

Surely you jest? There would be few,if any,members of this forum who have been further off the beaten track than have Peter-n-Margaret. 

So you have no idea of the cars I mentioned capabilities. Perhaps you should google them, especially the new Defender, which just might change your view on how capable they are, straight off the showroom floor with no mods whatsoever.

Or,if you are willing to add your name to the current 6 month waiting list,you could simply buy a 79? Nothing compares or competes.Cheers

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 Yobbar, surely you jest. I bought a 76 wagon at the same time as the Disco, spent a fortune modifying it with an Auto, decent sound system, air con, fixing up the rear track alignment etc and spent more than I did on the New Disco that I bought as well. My reasoning was the Tojo for serious 4wding, towing and outback remote trips. It was horrible on a trip, and towing it was thirsty, noisy and plain uncomfortable. I think you will find when the new defender is readily available the Defender will be as good as the Disco as many think it is what the Disco 5 should have been. In regards to my comments about road less travelled. I am talking about Balfour track, Canning stock route, Telegraph track, Vic high country, Simpson Desert. I have been with Discos,  Range Rovers even Great Walls, but I have never seen a RV on any of them. I have seen/been with all  those cars on all those tracks. There have been very few issues with the air suspension on any of the Landrovers and because it can be lowered when travelling on Bitumen and then raised when off road, it is far better than other $%wd's that you almost need a ladder to climb into them. I agree a lot of Range Rovers only see the bitumen in Toorak but there many who take them for serious 4WDing. In regards to tyres, Discovery and Range Rover Sport can come with 17,18,19, or 20" Rims, maybe more sizes. My 2016 disco has 18" rims. I Think the new Defender comes out in 18 to 20 rims. I also think you will find there is a decent wait on some series of the 70's Toyotas. And before people talk about cost to run, In the 1st 12 months the Toyota had 3 recalls, and service costs that were twice what the Disco cost. In the end I sold the Tojo to my son as I valued my back, ears, and what little money I have to run the vehicle. As this post is about suspension I wont comment further other than to say, air suspension does work and even Toyota and VW have it in their 4WD's.

-- Edited by yobarr on Monday 10th of August 2020 08:40:45 PM

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HandyWalter wrote:

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 In regards to my comments about road less travelled. I am talking about Balfour track, Canning stock route, Telegraph track, Vic high country, Simpson Desert. I have been with Discos,  Range Rovers even Great Walls, but I have never seen a RV on any of them.

 

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Well just to fill a gap or 2 in your education, here are a few short vids of an "RV" on a couple of those tracks. 

Gunshot on the OTT. 

A bit of the QAA line. This clip demonstrates a good suspension and adequate travel.

Climbing Big Red from the West. 

....and up the top.  Notice, no screaming engines and no spinning wheels.

And one you might never have heard of - the Carson Track. Probably tougher than any of the others? More suspension performance.

Enjoy 

Cheers,

Peter

HandyWalter wrote:

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yobarr wrote:

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HandyWalter wrote:

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Peter_n_Margaret wrote:

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 Maybe, maybe not. You might know therefore that the Range Rover was the first 4WD ever to be declared "un fit to drive across the Simpson Desert" by the Mount Dare workshop. That was mostly to do with the low profile tyres fitted, but it does clearly demonstrate that off road performance is a long way down from the design priority of these vehicles. 

Cheers,

Peter

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 Your comments seem to show that you stick to the roads well traveled, not the oft beaten track less well traveled and I can understand that looking at your Avtar.

Surely you jest? There would be few,if any,members of this forum who have been further off the beaten track than have Peter-n-Margaret. 

So you have no idea of the cars I mentioned capabilities. Perhaps you should google them, especially the new Defender, which just might change your view on how capable they are, straight off the showroom floor with no mods whatsoever.

Or,if you are willing to add your name to the current 6 month waiting list,you could simply buy a 79? Nothing compares or competes.Cheers

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 Yobbar, surely you jest. I bought a 76 wagon at the same time as the Disco, spent a fortune modifying it with an Auto, decent sound system, air con, fixing up the rear track alignment etc and spent more than I did on the New Disco that I bought as well. My reasoning was the Tojo for serious 4wding, towing and outback remote trips. It was horrible on a trip, and towing it was thirsty, noisy and plain uncomfortable. I think you will find when the new defender is readily available the Defender will be as good as the Disco as many think it is what the Disco 5 should have been. In regards to my comments about road less travelled. I am talking about Balfour track, Canning stock route, Telegraph track, Vic high country, Simpson Desert. I have been with Discos,  Range Rovers even Great Walls, but I have never seen a RV on any of them. I have seen/been with all  those cars on all those tracks. There have been very few issues with the air suspension on any of the Landrovers and because it can be lowered when travelling on Bitumen and then raised when off road, it is far better than other $%wd's that you almost need a ladder to climb into them. I agree a lot of Range Rovers only see the bitumen in Toorak but there many who take them for serious 4WDing. In regards to tyres, Discovery and Range Rover Sport can come with 17,18,19, or 20" Rims, maybe more sizes. My 2016 disco has 18" rims. I Think the new Defender comes out in 18 to 20 rims. I also think you will find there is a decent wait on some series of the 70's Toyotas. And before people talk about cost to run, In the 1st 12 months the Toyota had 3 recalls, and service costs that were twice what the Disco cost. In the end I sold the Tojo to my son as I valued my back, ears, and what little money I have to run the vehicle. As this post is about suspension I wont comment further other than to say, air suspension does work and even Toyota and VW have it in their 4WD's.

 

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Firstly, I would like to thank you for imitating my use of the term "surely you jest",as imitation is generally regarded as the sincerest form of flattery.Thank you. However,your detailed 'explanation' of the alleged shortcomings of your 76 have little relevance to any discussion about a 79.Anybody with ANY knowledge of these vehicles would know that comparing a 76 with a 79 is about as smart as comparing a Great Wall with your beloved Land Rovers...I will let you decide which is inferior!   In an effort to enlighten you,I would like to advise that the  76 has a GVM  rating of around 3000kg,significantly less than the 79's 3300kg.This 3300kg GVM is easily,and cheaply,increased to 3780kg,this being the combined standard factory axle ratings.(1480kg front and 2300kg rear)Secondly,the 2730mm wheelbase of the 76 is significantly...450mm.... less than than that of a 79,so the 76 is a lot less 'stable' on the road than is a 79,particularly when towing.Thirdly,this pretend vehicle has coil springs! Spare me.A 76 is more of a 4wd family station wagon than it is a serious towing vehicle...behave!. And lastly,the 79 has a GCM of 6800kg,compared with 6500kg for the 76.As an aside,running at 6800kg GCM, I achieve fuel consumption figures of 15 litres/100km,or 18.9 mpg in the old language.I am more than happy with that.Landrovers for Toorak,79s for the bush.Cheers

-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 11th of August 2020 06:53:40 PM

Thanks Peter...fantastic videos! Cheers

Well I agree that is a 1st for telegraph, but then again its the chicken tracks taken. Same with Big Red. And also I might add ripping upo and damaging the tracks because of the unsuitability of the vehicle. But no Balfour or Canning which are regarded as the ultimate in remote and extreeme 4WD travelling. And thank god they ban big vehicles on the Canning now to stop the damage they do churning up the track like you did at Gunshot! The Cape is not hard anymore as chicken tracks can be taken on all the hard parts.  But I must say i am impressed even so! Just for the record I was a camera man for a very popular 4Wd show that had a lady as the front person, so i have been on many tracks, and Carson is not as hard as the two I have mentioned. There are others in Arnhem Land and off the Gibb far harder and far remote, which I have done in the vehicles I have mentioned.
And Yobar a 79 is in many ways the same as a 76. Narrower track at rear, noisy, high revving motor (although improved with a auto) and a harsh ride compared to my cars mentioned with air suspension. As i said the 70 series are a beast of a vehicle, but because of that it has many shortcommings for the more aged of us, who value our health and wellbeing.