I certainly dont believe that travellers spend anywhere near as much as some like to believe they do. I even see them on Wiki state they didnt make a donation, as they bought what they needed in the shop!
Most people spend only what they need, with an occasional special purchase of a coffee or meal.
I went to the Yunta Hotel one night for a meal while camped in their nice little free camp across the road. This was during the peak travel season. The publican estimated he saw 1 in 20 in the pub. That equated to 1 every 4 or 5 nights. Good job he didnt rely on that to keep him open! I have stayed there several times, and many also seem allergic to the donation box.
bgt said
09:43 AM Feb 8, 2021
TheHeaths your close to the mark. We are guilty of doing the same. We pay any donation camps and try out any promising bakery. But apart from that we don't change our spending habits. I always fill up with diesel in a large town because I 'think' I'm getting fresh fuel. We shop in the big towns because we like the Coles and Woolies. I think most grey nomads are the same. But. But even if they get a single dollar from the campers that's a dollar more than they wold have gotten without the campsite. That dollar is usually spent several times in the same town. So that dollar become the same as ten dollars. It's that ten dollars that folks use to promote the benefits of 'free' camping.
But it's more than that even. If the small out of the way towns didn't offer 'free' camping then they would be bypassed by the majority of campers. Pulling into a little dust old town is why we travel. The bonus is if they have a campsite other than a caravan park.
yobarr said
09:51 AM Feb 8, 2021
Brodie Allen wrote:
Poor old van park. The not-so-well-off nomads will stay elsewhere or stay home because they can't afford the $40 to $75 dollars that the park charges.Nomads have only two choices - stay at the park and park benefits,or stay at the freecamp and go up town for a meal, a coffee, a cake, etc. and varied shops benefit generally.Which is better for the town? As it is, nobody will get the spend!!
Brodie,what you have written above is simply common sense,and indesputable.For some,however,there is too much thinking involved.When I visit that area,I certainly will be contacting Bob and Jayne,not necessarily to camp at their place,but simply to show that I will not be bullied by some self-centred caravan park owner who has only her (checked that) interests at heart,with no apparent interest in the common good.Your analogy to the library etc certainly is relevant.Cheers
Dougwe said
10:29 AM Feb 8, 2021
Brodie Allen wrote:
travelyounger wrote:
I should also mention the free camp at Bulahdelah NSW. There has been a new caravan park recently built at this town and previously there was talk of the free camp closing but never heard anything more.I drove in to the free camp the other day and was not surprised to see all gates locked with closed signs blaming it on the virus.Seems a bit strange as all the other free camps and rest areas are open maybe that town deserves the big drive by as well.
Cheers (but to the council)not
The Vanparks Association are busy at work lobbying councils to protect the Parks.
Councils have no concept of the part that the nomads play in the tourism spend outside
of holiday parks. The nomads will never be bullied into parks and will go to other destinations
to the detriment of the towns generally.
Get vocal - speak up at info offices, web sites, Councils . . . . .
Some Council's/Shires are proactive in this area. A couple if years back Home Hill, south of Townsville, Nth QLD did a sort of survey. They asked the travellers staying at the rest area at back if shops and beside railway line to get a receipt for anything they bought in the town and put it in a box. After a month the box was full and 1,000'S of $ spent in that town. I can't remember the exact amount sorry but it was a big surprise to them and to me.
Needless to say, the 48hr stop over with toilets and hot showers is still there. It is actually a donation spot but not everyone knows. The Stainless Steel box is on the back of the ladies toilets Facing the railway line.
A GREAT SPOT BY THE WAY!
oldbloke said
10:07 PM Feb 8, 2021
Greg 1 wrote:
The park rates in the south West of WA can be astronomic particularly at holiday season. It is little wonder grey nomads seak cheaper alternatives. As mentioned, what councils fail to consider is that these travellers still spend money in their town, but if they are having to pay exorbitant fees to a park operator then the money is not going to be spread around the other businesses in town or the nomads will just move on to where they are more appreciated. Even if the councils put a nominal fee on some of these camps to cover maintenance, it would still encourage nomads who don't need playgrounds, bouncey castles and other facilities aimed at young families.
Never had a problem with that. If there is a donation box I always make use of it unlike many.
PeterX said
09:12 PM Feb 12, 2021
If you google the phrase
no-more-free-caravan-parking-in-plantagenet-shire
will get lots of media articles.
One which claims the owner has introduced a $15 a night option
PeterX said
09:13 PM Feb 12, 2021
And every time I tried to post a link I get a message like post refused - classified as spam .....
PeterX said
09:30 PM Feb 12, 2021
Here is a Facebook link where it was being discussed - when it was intended to be closed for just 6 months - on the Shire of Plantagenet facebook page
I have just read the facebook link, so thanks for putting it up, PeterX
From what I understand, it was a site for self contained travellers, and other travellers had been doing their ablutions, in the bushes
I can therefore now understand, why the council did not resist, the closure
Perhaps a sign saying that fines will apply, if you are not self contained
The facebook did point out that not that far out of town, at Kendenup (about 20 kilometres north), there is a campsite, were you do not have to be self contained
Nevd said
12:05 AM Feb 14, 2021
"Just a general comment 're free parks. There are "Competitive Neutrallity " laws that any government body must consider. However within those laws is a section that enables local councils to act in the best interest of the residents. In a nut she'll it means a council can open up a camp area despite objections from caravan parks if they deem it a benefit to the residents as a whole. It gets complicated though. It's a federal "law" but a "law" that allows each state to make variations. If they charge a fee, as in a council owned show grounds, there are caps on how much they can earn in a 12 month period."
So how does that apply to places like Hervey Bay, Sunshine Coast, Bundaberg and Gold Coast where all the prime beachside caravan parks are owned & run by the council at great profit, in competition with other commercial parks in the area?
bgt said
09:18 AM Feb 14, 2021
Nevd the Competitive Neutrality laws are full of holes you could drive any thing through. I don't recall the dollar amounts but each state set a maximum amount that the site could make before they became an issue. In some states it was only $500,000.00. I other states it it was $2 million. Now I cant remember if that was a net or gross figure. At the time I was working on this issue I was only concerned with the private sector stopping the public sector. No doubt there are exceptions.
the rocket said
04:48 PM Feb 14, 2021
Dougwe wrote:
Brodie Allen wrote:
travelyounger wrote:
I should also mention the free camp at Bulahdelah NSW. There has been a new caravan park recently built at this town and previously there was talk of the free camp closing but never heard anything more.I drove in to the free camp the other day and was not surprised to see all gates locked with closed signs blaming it on the virus.Seems a bit strange as all the other free camps and rest areas are open maybe that town deserves the big drive by as well.
Cheers (but to the council)not
The Vanparks Association are busy at work lobbying councils to protect the Parks.
Councils have no concept of the part that the nomads play in the tourism spend outside
of holiday parks. The nomads will never be bullied into parks and will go to other destinations
to the detriment of the towns generally.
Get vocal - speak up at info offices, web sites, Councils . . . . .
Some Council's/Shires are proactive in this area. A couple if years back Home Hill, south of Townsville, Nth QLD did a sort of survey. They asked the travellers staying at the rest area at back if shops and beside railway line to get a receipt for anything they bought in the town and put it in a box. After a month the box was full and 1,000'S of $ spent in that town. I can't remember the exact amount sorry but it was a big surprise to them and to me.
Needless to say, the 48hr stop over with toilets and hot showers is still there. It is actually a donation spot but not everyone knows. The Stainless Steel box is on the back of the ladies toilets Facing the railway line.
A GREAT SPOT BY THE WAY!
I recall murgon doing same thing. We werefree camped for 2 days. Spent over $800 . Shopped at iga, bakery, newsagent, petrol station, betta electrical and of course wine from the bottle shop. Tv broke, bought from betta electrical and top service , car would not start, new battery. They were doing theresurvey for 6 months. Got told they stopped survey early cos overwhelmingly they found this camp brings in heaps of money to their town. Well done murgon. Qld
the rocket said
04:52 PM Feb 14, 2021
oldbloke wrote:
Greg 1 wrote:
The park rates in the south West of WA can be astronomic particularly at holiday season. It is little wonder grey nomads seak cheaper alternatives. As mentioned, what councils fail to consider is that these travellers still spend money in their town, but if they are having to pay exorbitant fees to a park operator then the money is not going to be spread around the other businesses in town or the nomads will just move on to where they are more appreciated. Even if the councils put a nominal fee on some of these camps to cover maintenance, it would still encourage nomads who don't need playgrounds, bouncey castles and other facilities aimed at young families.
Never had a problem with that. If there is a donation box I always make use of it unlike many.
Yes, we aways put money in a donation box. and yes, there r scabs who do not.
oldbloke said
03:33 PM Feb 15, 2021
Not long before xmas i swagged in a donation camp for 3 nights. So I put $15 in the box. Yes, I'm tight. Lol. When the woman rocked up to top up toilet paper etc she was very surprised i put it in. Its Just maintained by a few locals. Her comment was that very few do. She was obviously surprised.
Tony LEE said
01:04 PM Feb 18, 2021
As promised, a bit of factual information on Bulahdelah situation.
Seems as if the council is taking its Covid-19 responsibilities very seriously and the Lions Club, Bulahdelah showgrounds, Stroud showgrounds, Copeland Common, and at least one other free or paid BUT UNSUPERVISED campgrounds within the council area are closed for the duration. (see wikicamps) I see that the golf club one has been deleted, possibly for the same reason.
Bulahdelah Bowling Club is supervised checkin complying with covid requirements so is still open. Not entirely free but near enough.
No evidence that the new caravan park is in any way responsible one way or the other. So still plenty of choice between an expensive new park, a budget long established park, and the Bowling Club.
So did <travel younger> jump to some unwarranted conclusions?
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 18th of February 2021 01:11:23 PM
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 18th of February 2021 01:12:56 PM
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 18th of February 2021 01:26:08 PM
Nevd said
12:22 PM Feb 19, 2021
Therocket said -
"Some Council's/Shires are proactive in this area. A couple if years back Home Hill, south of Townsville, Nth QLD did a sort of survey. They asked the travellers staying at the rest area at back if shops and beside railway line to get a receipt for anything they bought in the town and put it in a box. After a month the box was full and 1,000'S of $ spent in that town. I can't remember the exact amount sorry but it was a big surprise to them and to me."
Local council here did the same shortly after they opened the low cost camp near Maryborough (Q) airport. After a few weeks they found that tens of thousands of dollars had come into the community. At look at Julia Creek. I bet none of the businesses there want the free camp closed down.
We travel with a mixture of free/low cost camping and caravan parks & showgrounds. Without the low cost stuff, we'd spend less time on the road with less diverse spending - too much of the budget would go into site fees.
Tony LEE said
12:32 PM Feb 19, 2021
I know Bulahdelah will be missing the free campgrounds even though the bowling club will take up some of the slack.
Counted 40 RVs down by the river one night which would be good for the town - although I was told not long after it first opened that estimates were that less than 15% actually left a donation in the box
Tony LEE said
08:56 AM Feb 20, 2021
"There is brighter news though in the famously grey nomad friendly town of Bulahdelah on the NSW mid north coast, where the campsite at Lions Park has yet to re-open.
We are fully committed to reopening the site when the appropriate approval framework is in place, MidCoast Councils Director of Liveable Communities, Paul De Szell, told the GNT."
Tony LEE said
10:14 PM Feb 26, 2021
https://www.thegreynomads.com.au/bulahdelah-5/
FEBRUARY 20, 2021
Grey nomads have been assured that the popular Lions Park campsite in the NSW mid north coast town of Bulahdelah will be re-opening.
With some other areas announcing that their free camps that closed temporarily because of Covid would in fact never welcome campers again, concerns were growing that the gold coin donation camp at Bulahdelah might suffer the same fate.
However, a spokesperson for MidCoast Council said it was fully intending on reopening the site for travellers in the future.
Doubt whether Bulahdelah will lose its reputation for being a good place to stop for a couple of days
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Friday 26th of February 2021 10:16:29 PM
Bobdown said
03:38 PM Mar 4, 2021
From the Plantagenet News (Mt Barker WA) this week..............There has been quite a bit of comment both local and elsewhere, fingers crossed sanity will prevail.
Although I believe that one of the problems (in general), of closing of free campsites, are caravan park owners, thinking that they have lost customers to free camps
But also on the other hand, if a site is marked as you must be self contained, then locals do not like to see, the remains of ablutions in the bushes
We all know that any rig not self contained, is a potential ablution abuser
I have previously said, I parked at the Mt Barker free campsite, for a few hours one day
For any who have never been there, it is a fairly high traffic area, for the locals If I lived in Mt Barker, I would not want any rigs which were not self contained, to stay there overnight
I speak only for myself here Perhaps one answer could be
Do not have a campsite in the middle of the town
Have toilets and bins at the campsite
Display a receipt from one of the shops, or get towed away by the shire grader
If it becomes a rubbish dump, close it down
I appreciate each and every free/donation campsite, I stop at I look upon them as a gift, and not something which I have a right to use
TheHeaths said
05:48 PM Mar 4, 2021
Well done David Rickertt.
You have successfully shown most Grey Nomads, according to you, to be self centred, self entitled, free loading brats. Letters such as yours, and the last couple of sentences in particular, are the reason many towns now dont worry whether we visit or not. Now not content with free camps close to town, if its not in prime position in town, we threaten not to come! Looking at the letter makes me wonder re another thread in this place. I dont think its just kids who are feral, and perhaps with this type of letter, I see where they may comes from!
You do not speak for me David, in fact with luck Kathy and I wont ever meet you. As with Tony, I appreciate free camps when provided, but do not put my visit, stay or spend contingent on the provision of such sites. We visit for what a town and area has, not what it gives us!
I think this is a sad thing to see, and hope it doesnt happen to other towns in the future.
Farmhat said
10:48 PM Mar 5, 2021
As far as I know, Charters Towers itself is quite anti free camping.
Where is David Rickerts big unlimited stay in Charters worth 4 million to the town a year?
The closest I know is about 40 odd ks out of town towards Greenvale, at Fletcher Creek.
Joe.
-- Edited by Farmhat on Friday 5th of March 2021 11:42:47 PM
Bill B said
11:23 PM Mar 5, 2021
I assume he is referring to Macrossan Park which is 20 klms east of Charters Towers.
Farmhat said
11:37 PM Mar 5, 2021
Bill B wrote:
I assume he is referring to Macrossan Park which is 20 klms east of Charters Towers.
Thanks Bill. next time I may try that one.
I came from the west then went north from Charters.
Anyway, for anyone interested here is a photo I took of Fletcher Creek camp when I was there.
Must have been a bit sideways when I took it, lol.
I certainly dont believe that travellers spend anywhere near as much as some like to believe they do. I even see them on Wiki state they didnt make a donation, as they bought what they needed in the shop!
Most people spend only what they need, with an occasional special purchase of a coffee or meal.
I went to the Yunta Hotel one night for a meal while camped in their nice little free camp across the road. This was during the peak travel season. The publican estimated he saw 1 in 20 in the pub. That equated to 1 every 4 or 5 nights. Good job he didnt rely on that to keep him open! I have stayed there several times, and many also seem allergic to the donation box.
But it's more than that even. If the small out of the way towns didn't offer 'free' camping then they would be bypassed by the majority of campers. Pulling into a little dust old town is why we travel. The bonus is if they have a campsite other than a caravan park.
Brodie,what you have written above is simply common sense,and indesputable.For some,however,there is too much thinking involved.When I visit that area,I certainly will be contacting Bob and Jayne,not necessarily to camp at their place,but simply to show that I will not be bullied by some self-centred caravan park owner who has only her (checked that) interests at heart,with no apparent interest in the common good.Your analogy to the library etc certainly is relevant.Cheers
Some Council's/Shires are proactive in this area. A couple if years back Home Hill, south of Townsville, Nth QLD did a sort of survey. They asked the travellers staying at the rest area at back if shops and beside railway line to get a receipt for anything they bought in the town and put it in a box. After a month the box was full and 1,000'S of $ spent in that town. I can't remember the exact amount sorry but it was a big surprise to them and to me.
Needless to say, the 48hr stop over with toilets and hot showers is still there. It is actually a donation spot but not everyone knows. The Stainless Steel box is on the back of the ladies toilets Facing the railway line.
A GREAT SPOT BY THE WAY!
Never had a problem with that. If there is a donation box I always make use of it unlike many.
no-more-free-caravan-parking-in-plantagenet-shire
will get lots of media articles.
One which claims the owner has introduced a $15 a night option
www.facebook.com/permalink.php
I have just read the facebook link, so thanks for putting it up, PeterX
From what I understand, it was a site for self contained travellers, and other travellers had been doing their ablutions, in the bushes
I can therefore now understand, why the council did not resist, the closure
Perhaps a sign saying that fines will apply, if you are not self contained
The facebook did point out that not that far out of town, at Kendenup (about 20 kilometres north), there is a campsite, were you do not have to be self contained
"Just a general comment 're free parks. There are "Competitive Neutrallity " laws that any government body must consider. However within those laws is a section that enables local councils to act in the best interest of the residents. In a nut she'll it means a council can open up a camp area despite objections from caravan parks if they deem it a benefit to the residents as a whole. It gets complicated though. It's a federal "law" but a "law" that allows each state to make variations. If they charge a fee, as in a council owned show grounds, there are caps on how much they can earn in a 12 month period."
So how does that apply to places like Hervey Bay, Sunshine Coast, Bundaberg and Gold Coast where all the prime beachside caravan parks are owned & run by the council at great profit, in competition with other commercial parks in the area?
I recall murgon doing same thing. We werefree camped for 2 days. Spent over $800 . Shopped at iga, bakery, newsagent, petrol station, betta electrical and of course wine from the bottle shop. Tv broke, bought from betta electrical and top service , car would not start, new battery. They were doing theresurvey for 6 months. Got told they stopped survey early cos overwhelmingly they found this camp brings in heaps of money to their town. Well done murgon. Qld
Yes, we aways put money in a donation box. and yes, there r scabs who do not.
As promised, a bit of factual information on Bulahdelah situation.
Seems as if the council is taking its Covid-19 responsibilities very seriously and the Lions Club, Bulahdelah showgrounds, Stroud showgrounds, Copeland Common, and at least one other free or paid BUT UNSUPERVISED campgrounds within the council area are closed for the duration. (see wikicamps) I see that the golf club one has been deleted, possibly for the same reason.
Bulahdelah Bowling Club is supervised checkin complying with covid requirements so is still open. Not entirely free but near enough.
No evidence that the new caravan park is in any way responsible one way or the other. So still plenty of choice between an expensive new park, a budget long established park, and the Bowling Club.
So did <travel younger> jump to some unwarranted conclusions?
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 18th of February 2021 01:11:23 PM
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 18th of February 2021 01:12:56 PM
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 18th of February 2021 01:26:08 PM
Therocket said -
"Some Council's/Shires are proactive in this area. A couple if years back Home Hill, south of Townsville, Nth QLD did a sort of survey. They asked the travellers staying at the rest area at back if shops and beside railway line to get a receipt for anything they bought in the town and put it in a box. After a month the box was full and 1,000'S of $ spent in that town. I can't remember the exact amount sorry but it was a big surprise to them and to me."
Local council here did the same shortly after they opened the low cost camp near Maryborough (Q) airport. After a few weeks they found that tens of thousands of dollars had come into the community. At look at Julia Creek. I bet none of the businesses there want the free camp closed down.
We travel with a mixture of free/low cost camping and caravan parks & showgrounds. Without the low cost stuff, we'd spend less time on the road with less diverse spending - too much of the budget would go into site fees.
https://www.thegreynomads.com.au/bulahdelah-5/
FEBRUARY 20, 2021
Grey nomads have been assured that the popular Lions Park campsite in the NSW mid north coast town of Bulahdelah will be re-opening.
With some other areas announcing that their free camps that closed temporarily because of Covid would in fact never welcome campers again, concerns were growing that the gold coin donation camp at Bulahdelah might suffer the same fate.
However, a spokesperson for MidCoast Council said it was fully intending on reopening the site for travellers in the future.
Doubt whether Bulahdelah will lose its reputation for being a good place to stop for a couple of days
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Friday 26th of February 2021 10:16:29 PM
From the Plantagenet News (Mt Barker WA) this week..............There has been quite a bit of comment both local and elsewhere, fingers crossed sanity will prevail.
Cheers Bob
Although I believe that one of the problems (in general), of closing of free campsites, are caravan park owners, thinking that they have lost customers to free camps
But also on the other hand, if a site is marked as you must be self contained, then locals do not like to see, the remains of ablutions in the bushes
We all know that any rig not self contained, is a potential ablution abuser
I have previously said, I parked at the Mt Barker free campsite, for a few hours one day
For any who have never been there, it is a fairly high traffic area, for the locals
If I lived in Mt Barker, I would not want any rigs which were not self contained, to stay there overnight
I speak only for myself here
Perhaps one answer could be
I appreciate each and every free/donation campsite, I stop at
I look upon them as a gift, and not something which I have a right to use
You have successfully shown most Grey Nomads, according to you, to be self centred, self entitled, free loading brats. Letters such as yours, and the last couple of sentences in particular, are the reason many towns now dont worry whether we visit or not. Now not content with free camps close to town, if its not in prime position in town, we threaten not to come! Looking at the letter makes me wonder re another thread in this place. I dont think its just kids who are feral, and perhaps with this type of letter, I see where they may comes from!
You do not speak for me David, in fact with luck Kathy and I wont ever meet you. As with Tony, I appreciate free camps when provided, but do not put my visit, stay or spend contingent on the provision of such sites. We visit for what a town and area has, not what it gives us!
I think this is a sad thing to see, and hope it doesnt happen to other towns in the future.
As far as I know, Charters Towers itself is quite anti free camping.
Where is David Rickerts big unlimited stay in Charters worth 4 million to the town a year?
The closest I know is about 40 odd ks out of town towards Greenvale, at Fletcher Creek.
Joe.
-- Edited by Farmhat on Friday 5th of March 2021 11:42:47 PM
Thanks Bill. next time I may try that one.
I came from the west then went north from Charters.
Anyway, for anyone interested here is a photo I took of Fletcher Creek camp when I was there.
Must have been a bit sideways when I took it, lol.
Joe.