Where should one put complaints, poor service instances on the forum? Have just done an Advanced Search & found several in various sections. And I'm aware that some people, companies can take offence & threaten legal proceedings.
In Townsville, there is quite a few "Word of mouth networks" - some of these are so good that the person, company never has to advertise! And everyone else knows the opposite - a bad job, poor service - word gets around & that company suffers. Mind you there are others who take your details & say we'll call you when it arrives. A few do but most don't!
So as we are in Toowoomba at the moment, I thought I would get a minor job done on a part of my caravan. Some members told me recently they had the same done to their van(s).
At a guess, I thought it would take around 30 minutes, especially as I marked it out for this company. Took the item in last Tuesday, to be told "That won't be a problem, it will be finished on Friday." So Friday came, I called them - "No we haven't had a chance to do it yet, will Monday (today) be ok?" Just called them - "Nick, who you were dealing with is off sick today - it will be done tomorrow morning." I said we are leaving on Wednesday, so I need it done by tomorrow morning."
Well this was The first time I heard "Nick" mentioned - all of my other conversations have been with "B" - the manager!!!
Now yes I might be old(er) but not that old to recognise that my job is too small & they probably don't want to do it! If it's not done, they certainly won't be getting a recommendation from me. They might even see a text to the negative in the Toowoomba Chronicle!
Have other members had similar experiences? What do you do about them?
Whenarewethere said
04:03 PM Jul 13, 2020
You really need problems with companies in writing to cover your backside. If it is he said she said it's not worth the paper it's written on.
Dougwe said
04:32 PM Jul 13, 2020
G'day Warren, sounds familiar for sure mate. Just a small thing but big to me as I am one for very good service, I ordered two re-usable masks from a big company in Melbourne last Monday and I still have not heard back and the masks obviously haven't left yet. Mine is not a Government order so I have been put on the back burner I reckon, even though I paid extra for Xpress Post. It's only going from Melbourne to North East VIC. Strait up the Hume Hwy in fact.
I remember in a previous life I worked for just on 30 years in Local government and learnt very very quickly to have everything in writing from any interested parties. Paid off a couple of times when the knife was out and about with those I had to speak to about not doing a good enough job etc.
One thing I notice a lot these days and before CV19, good service is hard to find.
Keep Safe out there.
travelyounger said
05:23 PM Jul 13, 2020
Have you got a couple of days spare
Southern Cruizer said
06:30 PM Jul 13, 2020
Dougwe at the start of the 1st lockdown in NSW I ordered medical gloves to keep hands from touching maybe infected things, use them mainly for re-fueling etc. Took 3 weeks exactly to come from Brisbane to Wagga, wasn't evil bays fault or sender, I was notified they were posted same day as ordered before 2pm by Aus post, but trying to track them after that was a lot of fun. Believe they sat in Sydney for most of that time
Possum3 said
06:58 PM Jul 13, 2020
Unfortunately nearly all the larger manufacturers and dealers monitor sites like this to stop (all but the minor complaints) by threat of legal actions. We have become a litigious Nation and it seems that nowadays it is preferable lie and cheat and threat the aggrieved rather than provide service and honour warranties.
Morality as we knew it, is in the main no longer deemed a desirable trait.
When you have had bad or dishonest service the only place you can complain is CHOICE and the ACCC , they actually do compile lists of Company's that consumers have written to them about and occasionally take action/s against them.
An effective way to help other consumers is to compliment and praise those we find doing the right thing and honestly filling in surveys that utilise a scoring system such as (percentage of approval rating or stars). The large Company's are well aware of this and try to hide their malfeasance/s by paying for positive reviews in Caravan and Camping magazines and ensuing bad reviews never see the light of day by threats on advertising revenues.
montie said
07:55 PM Jul 13, 2020
Conspiracy theories abound!
If any consumer has a grievance with a manufacturer or supplier, Australian law provides the mechanism for their case to be heard fairly and an unbiased judgement to be found, sometimes in their favour, sometimes not.
It's called the ACA...Australian Consumer Act which entitles alleged aggrieved consumers, at minimal cost, to take their case to a Tribunal where all the argument and evidence is presented and a decision is made.
We have recently seen some consumer "advocates" who decided to take the law into their own hands by defaming manufacturers on the kangaroo court of social media and it cost them dearly when a manufacturer took offence.
The moral of that story...if you have a grievance talk to the supplier in good faith to try to find a resolution, if that fails use the proper legal avenues.
Defamation can be expensive!
Possum3 said
09:18 PM Jul 13, 2020
montie wrote:
Conspiracy theories abound!
Defamation can be expensive!
My point exactly.
Montie, You have reiterated my advice/s regarding availability of Australian Consumer Law as a means of holding Dealers and Manufacturers to account. I also assume you are aware that some Company's have lost their cases in Tribunals and Courts.
Was the purpose of your reply; just for information? or was it to dissuade complaints on social media ??????????????????
the rocket said
09:37 PM Jul 13, 2020
Warren-Pat_01 wrote:
G'day member's,
Where should one put complaints, poor service instances on the forum? Have just done an Advanced Search & found several in various sections. And I'm aware that some people, companies can take offence & threaten legal proceedings.
In Townsville, there is quite a few "Word of mouth networks" - some of these are so good that the person, company never has to advertise! And everyone else knows the opposite - a bad job, poor service - word gets around & that company suffers. Mind you there are others who take your details & say we'll call you when it arrives. A few do but most don't!
So as we are in Toowoomba at the moment, I thought I would get a minor job done on a part of my caravan. Some members told me recently they had the same done to their van(s).
At a guess, I thought it would take around 30 minutes, especially as I marked it out for this company. Took the item in last Tuesday, to be told "That won't be a problem, it will be finished on Friday." So Friday came, I called them - "No we haven't had a chance to do it yet, will Monday (today) be ok?" Just called them - "Nick, who you were dealing with is off sick today - it will be done tomorrow morning." I said we are leaving on Wednesday, so I need it done by tomorrow morning."
Well this was The first time I heard "Nick" mentioned - all of my other conversations have been with "B" - the manager!!!
Now yes I might be old(er) but not that old to recognise that my job is too small & they probably don't want to do it! If it's not done, they certainly won't be getting a recommendation from me. They might even see a text to the negative in the Toowoomba Chronicle!
Have other members had similar experiences? What do you do about them?
I hate turd service. Highly recommend jacks caravans brisbane it is a mobile service also. Always seen us right. Recently had our caravan for a month (replaced both sides of van and smaller things as well) and originally said one month and true to his word it was Done. Good job. Top bloke. And he does not rip you off. Good luck with your van
montie said
10:47 PM Jul 13, 2020
Possum3 wrote:
montie wrote:
Conspiracy theories abound!
Defamation can be expensive!
My point exactly.
Montie, You have reiterated my advice/s regarding availability of Australian Consumer Law as a means of holding Dealers and Manufacturers to account. I also assume you are aware that some Company's have lost their cases in Tribunals and Courts.
Was the purpose of your reply; just for information? or was it to dissuade complaints on social media ??????????????????
The Tribunal is there to ensure the rights of both the Consumer and Seller are fairly upheld in which case of course there will always be winners and losers.
What people post on social media is entirely up to them and any attempt to dissuade them in most cases would fall on deaf ears. It is, however, important to remember that defaming a product or person may have legal consequences. Complain all you wish so long as you understand your legal boundaries..and that applies to both consumers and sellers.
Mike Harding said
07:39 AM Jul 14, 2020
There are others here far better placed that I to comment upon this but...
Reporting the facts of poor service is not defamation - that would be ridiculous and mean if a company took my money and totally failed to do the work I could not report such!
What people should refrain from is wild, angry opinion eg "Blogs Caravans are thieves and always ripping people off" is probably pushing your luck but "Blogs Caravans charged me $500 and failed to changed all four wheel bearings as agreed" is fine providing it's a truthful statement.
The fear of litigation thing is seriously overblown currently.
Possum3 said
07:49 AM Jul 14, 2020
Mike Harding wrote:
The fear of litigation thing is seriously overblown currently.
Mike I assure you there are a couple of RV Manufacturers and Dealers, spending big money on Barristers, that are sending what could be described as Threats to persons stating on social media how they have been treated
Whenarewethere said
07:57 AM Jul 14, 2020
Mike Harding wrote:
but "Blogs Caravans charged me $500 and failed to changed all four wheel bearings as agreed" is fine providing it's a truthful statement.
But write in a diary the date, time, name & position of person you had the interaction with & what action you took to try & solve the problem & their response. If you had brought to their attention that X was not done you have given them the opportunity to respond. Also take photographs of the parts not changed or fixed. You need tangible accurate records of the issues & process of trying to fix the problem.
montie said
08:39 AM Jul 14, 2020
If a consumer has a grievance with a product or service surely the sensible approach to resolve the issue would be to do so through the channels that are available by firstly talking to the supplier and as a last resort through the legal option provided by the ACA.
Posting on social media about your grievance, which of course you are free to do, is unlikely to find a resolution and in fact in many instances can aggravate the situation. It also only presents one side of the story which in many cases prompts a trial by media and heightens the risk of a supplier taking defamation action.
If it comes to a choice between resolution and aggravation I think the answer is obvious.
travelyounger said
09:31 AM Jul 14, 2020
This is my view on the ops post
If you take your van or motorhome to have a service or something fixed or added and you ring to pick up on the day and its not ready and you have not received a call from them or the work that they have done is below average and you complain and they give you all the exuses and usually no apology these are the ones that deserve to be badmouthed to deter others having bad service.
Having said that I would not put any thing on social media and would only tell people who would ask in conversation and it undermines the companies or businesses which are many that take pride in there work as usually they are ones who fix up the dodgy work.
Cheers
Warren-Pat_01 said
09:54 AM Jul 14, 2020
G'day chaps,
Well I started this chat & I'll finish it.
No I don't plan on legal action - the job as I said was minor. Just a modification to my spare wheel cover to ease the broken finger nails (in this cold weather, which I hate) so I can check the air pressure quickly.
The govt has been urging us to give local companies work - I would have been better waiting until I got back home where at least it's a bit warmer (15 degrees this morning, not the 3 it was here). The company that I'm dealing with has lots of flash advertising, I assume that smaller is best.
And the only social media I have used is here - the other common one, I use only for family contacts. I learned at work that if there was a grievance, that you never attacked the person - just the system to gain improvements.
oldbloke said
10:03 PM Jul 14, 2020
Dougwe wrote:
One thing I notice a lot these days and before CV19, good service is hard to find.
G'day member's,
Where should one put complaints, poor service instances on the forum? Have just done an Advanced Search & found several in various sections. And I'm aware that some people, companies can take offence & threaten legal proceedings.
In Townsville, there is quite a few "Word of mouth networks" - some of these are so good that the person, company never has to advertise! And everyone else knows the opposite - a bad job, poor service - word gets around & that company suffers. Mind you there are others who take your details & say we'll call you when it arrives. A few do but most don't!
So as we are in Toowoomba at the moment, I thought I would get a minor job done on a part of my caravan. Some members told me recently they had the same done to their van(s).
At a guess, I thought it would take around 30 minutes, especially as I marked it out for this company. Took the item in last Tuesday, to be told "That won't be a problem, it will be finished on Friday." So Friday came, I called them - "No we haven't had a chance to do it yet, will Monday (today) be ok?" Just called them - "Nick, who you were dealing with is off sick today - it will be done tomorrow morning." I said we are leaving on Wednesday, so I need it done by tomorrow morning."
Well this was The first time I heard "Nick" mentioned - all of my other conversations have been with "B" - the manager!!!
Now yes I might be old(er) but not that old to recognise that my job is too small & they probably don't want to do it! If it's not done, they certainly won't be getting a recommendation from me. They might even see a text to the negative in the Toowoomba Chronicle!
Have other members had similar experiences? What do you do about them?
You really need problems with companies in writing to cover your backside. If it is he said she said it's not worth the paper it's written on.
I remember in a previous life I worked for just on 30 years in Local government and learnt very very quickly to have everything in writing from any interested parties. Paid off a couple of times when the knife was out and about with those I had to speak to about not doing a good enough job etc.
One thing I notice a lot these days and before CV19, good service is hard to find.
Keep Safe out there.
Morality as we knew it, is in the main no longer deemed a desirable trait.
When you have had bad or dishonest service the only place you can complain is CHOICE and the ACCC , they actually do compile lists of Company's that consumers have written to them about and occasionally take action/s against them.
An effective way to help other consumers is to compliment and praise those we find doing the right thing and honestly filling in surveys that utilise a scoring system such as (percentage of approval rating or stars). The large Company's are well aware of this and try to hide their malfeasance/s by paying for positive reviews in Caravan and Camping magazines and ensuing bad reviews never see the light of day by threats on advertising revenues.
Conspiracy theories abound!
If any consumer has a grievance with a manufacturer or supplier, Australian law provides the mechanism for their case to be heard fairly and an unbiased judgement to be found, sometimes in their favour, sometimes not.
It's called the ACA...Australian Consumer Act which entitles alleged aggrieved consumers, at minimal cost, to take their case to a Tribunal where all the argument and evidence is presented and a decision is made.
We have recently seen some consumer "advocates" who decided to take the law into their own hands by defaming manufacturers on the kangaroo court of social media and it cost them dearly when a manufacturer took offence.
The moral of that story...if you have a grievance talk to the supplier in good faith to try to find a resolution, if that fails use the proper legal avenues.
Defamation can be expensive!
My point exactly.
Montie, You have reiterated my advice/s regarding availability of Australian Consumer Law as a means of holding Dealers and Manufacturers to account. I also assume you are aware that some Company's have lost their cases in Tribunals and Courts.
Was the purpose of your reply; just for information? or was it to dissuade complaints on social media ??????????????????
I hate turd service. Highly recommend jacks caravans brisbane it is a mobile service also. Always seen us right. Recently had our caravan for a month (replaced both sides of van and smaller things as well) and originally said one month and true to his word it was Done. Good job. Top bloke. And he does not rip you off. Good luck with your van
The Tribunal is there to ensure the rights of both the Consumer and Seller are fairly upheld in which case of course there will always be winners and losers.
What people post on social media is entirely up to them and any attempt to dissuade them in most cases would fall on deaf ears. It is, however, important to remember that defaming a product or person may have legal consequences. Complain all you wish so long as you understand your legal boundaries..and that applies to both consumers and sellers.
There are others here far better placed that I to comment upon this but...
https://www.slatergordon.com.au/dispute-resolution/defamation
Reporting the facts of poor service is not defamation - that would be ridiculous and mean if a company took my money and totally failed to do the work I could not report such!
What people should refrain from is wild, angry opinion eg "Blogs Caravans are thieves and always ripping people off" is probably pushing your luck but "Blogs Caravans charged me $500 and failed to changed all four wheel bearings as agreed" is fine providing it's a truthful statement.
The fear of litigation thing is seriously overblown currently.
Mike I assure you there are a couple of RV Manufacturers and Dealers, spending big money on Barristers, that are sending what could be described as Threats to persons stating on social media how they have been treated
But write in a diary the date, time, name & position of person you had the interaction with & what action you took to try & solve the problem & their response. If you had brought to their attention that X was not done you have given them the opportunity to respond. Also take photographs of the parts not changed or fixed. You need tangible accurate records of the issues & process of trying to fix the problem.
If a consumer has a grievance with a product or service surely the sensible approach to resolve the issue would be to do so through the channels that are available by firstly talking to the supplier and as a last resort through the legal option provided by the ACA.
Posting on social media about your grievance, which of course you are free to do, is unlikely to find a resolution and in fact in many instances can aggravate the situation. It also only presents one side of the story which in many cases prompts a trial by media and heightens the risk of a supplier taking defamation action.
If it comes to a choice between resolution and aggravation I think the answer is obvious.
Well I started this chat & I'll finish it.
No I don't plan on legal action - the job as I said was minor. Just a modification to my spare wheel cover to ease the broken finger nails (in this cold weather, which I hate) so I can check the air pressure quickly.
The govt has been urging us to give local companies work - I would have been better waiting until I got back home where at least it's a bit warmer (15 degrees this morning, not the 3 it was here). The company that I'm dealing with has lots of flash advertising, I assume that smaller is best.
And the only social media I have used is here - the other common one, I use only for family contacts. I learned at work that if there was a grievance, that you never attacked the person - just the system to gain improvements.
Your dead right about that mate.