Do we need to ask council, if we wanted to use our registered van, as accommodation for a family member who has been displaced.
We tried MR. Google just now .
Any knowledge on this would be helpful. Before approaching our local Council.
Old & Grey
Peter_n_Margaret said
08:27 AM Sep 30, 2020
Yes. They may not allow it. Give them a sob story and tell them it is just for a short time. Also tell them they will be using the "facilities" in the house.
Cheers,
Peter
yobarr said
09:12 AM Sep 30, 2020
Old and Grey wrote:
Morning everyone,
Do we need to ask council, if we wanted to use our registered van, as accommodation for a family member who has been displaced.
We tried MR. Google just now .
Any knowledge on this would be helpful. Before approaching our local Council.
Old & Grey
Personally,I wouldn't worry about asking anyone,but if some busy body goes crying to the council,do as Peter suggests. Over the years I have known of many families using a van in the backyard as another source of income,or for teenager accomodation. Cheers
Hetho said
10:33 AM Sep 30, 2020
Thats exactly what I am doing at the moment while we are building our new home.
We listed our home, 3 days latter we had a cash offer which was $15K over our list, plus a 30 day cash settlement.
So we are in our van behind our friends shed, and we have their back laundry, bathroom/wc to use.
However, our local council DO NOT allow it. Local council rules are: 3 days if fine, 30 days if an application is made for special circumstances.
After that - NO
So, fingers crossed no one "Dobs" us in.
Regards.
Hetho
Inland_Sailor said
10:37 AM Sep 30, 2020
Yes, much easier to seek forgiveness, [if it ever comes to that] than seek permission. The authorities will have to follow the regulations if you ask!
bilbo said
11:03 AM Sep 30, 2020
Old & Grey,
I read your post and SMILE and think "I'll just add that to a very L O N G list of reasons of why I live where I do"
If it is of any interest to you ......"we" would NEVER NEVER EVER even THINK to ask a council about such a subject!
cheers Bilbo
Greg 1 said
11:39 AM Sep 30, 2020
Our council is much the same. For a couple of days it's OK but longer it's a no.
But my parents were building a new house and had to move out of their old property and we just parked their van in the backyard for 6 months.
They used the facilities in the house and no one said anything. Didn't seek permission, just decided to suck it and see.
Whenarewethere said
02:08 PM Sep 30, 2020
I spent a few months installing insulation in my car & would hate to think how long it would take to do the same with a caravan.
Not to forget that cleaning up is part of the job, not something you do if you have time. I found cleaning up to be at least half the job.
When you have finished no one ever sees the work you have done. It's not a bling job! Simply a lot of work & absolutely nothing to show for it. Night in night out when you have the time & help from others!
I'm still at it 2 years on, the other day ripping the car appart again!
I spent a few months installing insulation in my car & would hate to think how long it would take to do the same with a caravan.
Not to forget that cleaning up is part of the job, not something you do if you have time. I found cleaning up to be at least half the job.
When you have finished no one ever sees the work you have done. It's not a bling job! Simply a lot of work & absolutely nothing to show for it. Night in night out when you have the time & help from others!
I'm still at it 2 years on, the other day ripping the car appart again!
Not sure what that has to do with living in a caravan in the back yard .
Whenarewethere said
02:48 PM Sep 30, 2020
Thought is was obvious.
A lot of "unseen work" in the caravan.
No one can prove it wasn't done & you may otherwise be living in it!
dogbox said
04:30 PM Sep 30, 2020
Inland_Sailor wrote:
Yes, much easier to seek forgiveness, [if it ever comes to that] than seek permission. The authorities will have to follow the regulations if you ask!
x2
sneaky is always best, then plead ignorance , then beg for forgiveness
Wizardofoz said
05:09 PM Sep 30, 2020
Councils like all government instrumentalities are staffed by people who just read the rule books and act like 'little hitlers', they just love their authority and flaunt it when the actions they ruling on are completely a non event...yes just ignore them and they will be none the wiser.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Wednesday 30th of September 2020 05:10:18 PM
vince56 said
05:13 PM Sep 30, 2020
My theory is that councils deserve as little as possible, they just get in the way of Australians trying to go about their lives. If it was me I would not tell them, they would just make it needlessly hard, that is just what I would do and not advice for you.
But you must do what you feel comfortable with, up to your judgement.
My Soap Box: We are over-governed in Oz, we should have State Government OR Councils NOT BOTH!
-- Edited by vince56 on Wednesday 30th of September 2020 05:15:08 PM
Hetho said
05:57 PM Sep 30, 2020
I'm with Outlaw40. I feel sorry for the overstuffed car.
Old and Grey said
06:47 PM Sep 30, 2020
Hi all,
Thanks for your replies. We have a nosy neighbour who runs to the council, every time I let my wind go free so to speak . Total A ...... hole.
We will give it a go. Can only get warning notices and drag it out. Then appeal, and drag it out, till we head out next year.
The system. We will use the system .
Thanks for your replies.
Old & Grey
Bicyclecamper said
06:54 PM Sep 30, 2020
You will have to put in a DA, will cost min $550, this is what they told me, I let it blow over, Teenage Daughter was in there for 4 years in an older van with a shower and toilet, all flushed down my septic. Stuff them!.
Bicyclecamper said
06:56 PM Sep 30, 2020
Old and Grey, his name wouldn't be Rodney would it?
yobarr said
06:58 PM Sep 30, 2020
Wizardofoz wrote:
Councils like all government instrumentalities are staffed by people who just read the rule books and act like 'little hitlers', they just love their authority and flaunt it when the actions they ruling on are completely a non event...yes just ignore them and they will be none the wiser.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Wednesday 30th of September 2020 05:10:18 PM
Absolutely! Yes,Councils often are populated by people who are not bright enough to get a 'real' job.Anything that requires thought,or logic,is side-stepped.Cheers
Izabarack said
07:16 AM Oct 1, 2020
Depends on Council, in my experience. Where I am, permit costs a fair bit and must be renewed pretty often. However, Compliance Officer contact tells me she only checks people's backyard after a tip off. A local "friend" has a family member living in a caravan in the yard for over a year without issue. Depending on the situation, I would recommend a Stealth installation and efforts to not draw any attention to the arrangement. A Local Law that exists in my area is that Council Officers must obtain permission to enter your property. My Compliance Officer contact also tells me that the law makes it really difficult for her to establish if someone is actually living in the van stored in the backyard. My contact tells me she has resolved tip offs by reporting that no breach of council rules has been established. Old and Grey, your nosey neighbour can report as much as they like but if a breach of council rules cannot be established by a compliance officer, no orders can be issued.
Iza
-- Edited by Izabarack on Thursday 1st of October 2020 07:23:22 AM
Peter_n_Margaret said
10:11 AM Oct 1, 2020
So it has degenerated from "what are the rules?" to "will I get caught?" or "how can I avoid getting caught?" and denigrating those whose job it is to uphold the rules.
What a wonderful society we live in?
Does anyone for a moment consider what some of our communities would be like without these rules?
Cheers,
Peter
Whenarewethere said
10:46 AM Oct 1, 2020
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Does anyone for a moment consider what some of our communities would be like without these rules?
Council development applications, that's a joke at the best of times & that ends up a permanent structure.
I have been involved in architectural work for decades.
Mike Harding said
11:19 AM Oct 1, 2020
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Does anyone for a moment consider what some of our communities would be like without these rules?
Quite right Peter! They're a disgrace, the lot of them, encouraging people to ignore and flout bylaws next thing you know people will be walking on the grass *despite* clear signage not to! It'll be total anarchy, the breakdown of law and order.
You have to be tough with these people Peter, no mamby pambing them, got to be taught to obey the rules. I mean... why have rules if people won't obey them!? And we do have one hell of a lot of rules to be obeyed. I'd horse whip them and then jail them for five years at their *own* expense!
I warn you; give these types an inch and they'll take a mile or as we're now metric give them a centimeter and they'll take a kilometer... hang on... give them 2cm and they'll take 1km... no... wait a minute.. got it now... give them 1.5783cm and they'll take 1km.
Now: what was the question...?
Tony LEE said
11:30 AM Oct 1, 2020
Wait until you get a nasty letter from the council - which will take several months even if your neighbours have hated you for years. Then give the sob story and that will delay it for another few months. If you seek permission and get knocked back, you have run out of options straight away
In NSW there is a local goverment regulation allowing an owner to live in an RV out the back and when a neighbour dobbed me in to the council - because I kept asking him to train his yappy rat-dogs instead of them training him - I pointed it out to the council and that was the end of the matter.
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 1st of October 2020 11:37:25 AM
Tony LEE said
11:43 AM Oct 1, 2020
NSW Planning
Circular PS 10-019 regarding what constitutes illegal camping and most important, the section dealing
with conditional exemptions which specifies what camping is allowed without council approval under the
LG Regulation 2005.
Izabarack said
12:40 PM Oct 1, 2020
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Does anyone for a moment consider what some of our communities would be like without these rules?
I guess you get this kind of problem https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/home/inside-the-house-of-horrors-the-nations-most-notorious-hoarders-the-bobolas-family-of-bondi-reveals-they-are-really-neat-freaks/news-story/78eefb60693a79178a07bbe985a6f5c6
I think the problem occurs as to the dimensions of the problem. Someone keeping to themselves and not causing issues that leak outside the boundary fences, is entitled to a little Civil Disobedience; its the Australian way. An alternative question could examine the cost to our communities when people are rendered homeless, for example, after Bushfires. There are many more discussion points available, especially at this time when Rental Arrears evictions are about to be commonplace. Intransigent and uncaring Councils are to be actively resisted.
Iza
Tony Bev said
01:09 PM Oct 1, 2020
Old and Grey wrote:
Morning everyone,
Do we need to ask council, if we wanted to use our registered van, as accommodation for a family member who has been displaced.
We tried MR. Google just now .
Any knowledge on this would be helpful. Before approaching our local Council.
Old & Grey
Hi Old and Grey
I have no idea which council area you are in
But if they do not allow you to have anyone living in a caravan, then they will only be doing their job, by upholding their rules
So in this case it will probably be better if you do not ask them, to allow you to break their rules, as they are probably not allowed to say yes
If as you say (in another post) We have a nosy neighbour who runs to the council, every time I let my wind go free so to speak . Total A ...... hole
Then you would expect them to dob you in, just to keep up the status quo/one one-upmanship etc
If it was my family member, I would probably (out of respect for my family member), make my peace with my neighbour
ps I have no idea, how to make peace with a neighbour, as I have never had (what others may call), a bad neighbour
Whatever happens, I hope that there is a good outcome, for your family member, and they can live in your caravan, for as long as they want
Mike Harding said
02:22 PM Oct 1, 2020
Izabarack wrote:a little Civil Disobedience; its the Australian way.
One hundred years ago? Yes.
These days...? Ah, how I wish it were....
Dick0 said
04:01 PM Oct 1, 2020
There is far too much red and green tape these days...it's called easy revenue raising.
Who will know if a friend or family member is living in a caravan in your back yard?
What's the difference whether they live in the caravan or in the house to anybody?
A rental may perhaps be another matter.
hufnpuf said
10:14 PM Oct 1, 2020
I think regulations about making use of property to put people up might be changed or relaxed when the full consequences of the pandemic hit after the government assistance is withdrawn or reduced. I think there's a big difference between helping out somebody in need, especially family, and setting up a caravan park for profit in your backyard.
They have these ads on tv about homeless people and buying them swags. I reckon if they could find a backyard instead of under a bridge they'd be much safer. I wouldn't mind helping somebody out by letting them pitch a tent in my (huge) backyard.
Morning everyone,
Do we need to ask council, if we wanted to use our registered van, as accommodation for a family member who has been displaced.
We tried MR. Google just now
.
Any knowledge on this would be helpful. Before approaching our local Council.
Old & Grey
Cheers,
Peter
Personally,I wouldn't worry about asking anyone,but if some busy body goes crying to the council,do as Peter suggests. Over the years I have known of many families using a van in the backyard as another source of income,or for teenager accomodation. Cheers
Thats exactly what I am doing at the moment while we are building our new home.
We listed our home, 3 days latter we had a cash offer which was $15K over our list, plus a 30 day cash settlement.
So we are in our van behind our friends shed, and we have their back laundry, bathroom/wc to use.
However, our local council DO NOT allow it. Local council rules are: 3 days if fine, 30 days if an application is made for special circumstances.
After that - NO
So, fingers crossed no one "Dobs" us in.
Regards.
Hetho
Old & Grey,
I read your post and SMILE and think "I'll just add that to a very L O N G list of reasons of why I live where I do"
If it is of any interest to you ......"we" would NEVER NEVER EVER even THINK to ask a council about such a subject!
cheers Bilbo
I spent a few months installing insulation in my car & would hate to think how long it would take to do the same with a caravan.
Not to forget that cleaning up is part of the job, not something you do if you have time. I found cleaning up to be at least half the job.
When you have finished no one ever sees the work you have done. It's not a bling job! Simply a lot of work & absolutely nothing to show for it. Night in night out when you have the time & help from others!
I'm still at it 2 years on, the other day ripping the car appart again!
Don't tell them anything you don't have to....
Not sure what that has to do with living in a caravan in the back yard .
Thought is was obvious.
A lot of "unseen work" in the caravan.
No one can prove it wasn't done & you may otherwise be living in it!
x2
sneaky is always best, then plead ignorance , then beg for forgiveness
Councils like all government instrumentalities are staffed by people who just read the rule books and act like 'little hitlers', they just love their authority and flaunt it when the actions they ruling on are completely a non event...yes just ignore them and they will be none the wiser.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Wednesday 30th of September 2020 05:10:18 PM
My theory is that councils deserve as little as possible, they just get in the way of Australians trying to go about their lives.
If it was me I would not tell them, they would just make it needlessly hard, that is just what I would do and not advice for you.
But you must do what you feel comfortable with, up to your judgement.
My Soap Box: We are over-governed in Oz, we should have State Government OR Councils NOT BOTH!
-- Edited by vince56 on Wednesday 30th of September 2020 05:15:08 PM
I'm with Outlaw40. I feel sorry for the overstuffed car.
Hi all,
Thanks for your replies. We have a nosy neighbour who runs to the council, every time I let my wind go free so to speak
. Total A ...... hole.
We will give it a go. Can only get warning notices and drag it out. Then appeal, and drag it out, till we head out next year.
The system. We will use the system
.
Thanks for your replies.
Old & Grey
Absolutely! Yes,Councils often are populated by people who are not bright enough to get a 'real' job.Anything that requires thought,or logic,is side-stepped.Cheers
Depends on Council, in my experience. Where I am, permit costs a fair bit and must be renewed pretty often. However, Compliance Officer contact tells me she only checks people's backyard after a tip off. A local "friend" has a family member living in a caravan in the yard for over a year without issue. Depending on the situation, I would recommend a Stealth installation and efforts to not draw any attention to the arrangement. A Local Law that exists in my area is that Council Officers must obtain permission to enter your property. My Compliance Officer contact also tells me that the law makes it really difficult for her to establish if someone is actually living in the van stored in the backyard. My contact tells me she has resolved tip offs by reporting that no breach of council rules has been established. Old and Grey, your nosey neighbour can report as much as they like but if a breach of council rules cannot be established by a compliance officer, no orders can be issued.
Iza
-- Edited by Izabarack on Thursday 1st of October 2020 07:23:22 AM
What a wonderful society we live in?
Does anyone for a moment consider what some of our communities would be like without these rules?
Cheers,
Peter
Council development applications, that's a joke at the best of times & that ends up a permanent structure.
I have been involved in architectural work for decades.
Quite right Peter! They're a disgrace, the lot of them, encouraging
people to ignore and flout bylaws next thing you know people will be
walking on the grass *despite* clear signage not to! It'll be total
anarchy, the breakdown of law and order.
You have to be tough with these people Peter, no mamby pambing them,
got to be taught to obey the rules. I mean... why have rules if
people won't obey them!? And we do have one hell of a lot of rules
to be obeyed. I'd horse whip them and then jail them for five years
at their *own* expense!
I warn you; give these types an inch and they'll take a mile or as
we're now metric give them a centimeter and they'll take a
kilometer... hang on... give them 2cm and they'll take 1km... no...
wait a minute.. got it now... give them 1.5783cm and they'll take 1km.
Now: what was the question...?
Wait until you get a nasty letter from the council - which will take several months even if your neighbours have hated you for years.
Then give the sob story and that will delay it for another few months.
If you seek permission and get knocked back, you have run out of options straight away
In NSW there is a local goverment regulation allowing an owner to live in an RV out the back and when a neighbour dobbed me in to the council - because I kept asking him to train his yappy rat-dogs instead of them training him - I pointed it out to the council and that was the end of the matter.
-- Edited by Tony LEE on Thursday 1st of October 2020 11:37:25 AM
Circular PS 10-019 regarding what constitutes illegal camping and most important, the section dealing
with conditional exemptions which specifies what camping is allowed without council approval under the
LG Regulation 2005.
I guess you get this kind of problem https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/home/inside-the-house-of-horrors-the-nations-most-notorious-hoarders-the-bobolas-family-of-bondi-reveals-they-are-really-neat-freaks/news-story/78eefb60693a79178a07bbe985a6f5c6
I think the problem occurs as to the dimensions of the problem. Someone keeping to themselves and not causing issues that leak outside the boundary fences, is entitled to a little Civil Disobedience; its the Australian way. An alternative question could examine the cost to our communities when people are rendered homeless, for example, after Bushfires. There are many more discussion points available, especially at this time when Rental Arrears evictions are about to be commonplace. Intransigent and uncaring Councils are to be actively resisted.
Iza
Hi Old and Grey
I have no idea which council area you are in
But if they do not allow you to have anyone living in a caravan, then they will only be doing their job, by upholding their rules
So in this case it will probably be better if you do not ask them, to allow you to break their rules, as they are probably not allowed to say yes
If as you say (in another post)
Then you would expect them to dob you in, just to keep up the status quo/one one-upmanship etc
If it was my family member, I would probably (out of respect for my family member), make my peace with my neighbour
ps
I have no idea, how to make peace with a neighbour, as I have never had (what others may call), a bad neighbour
Whatever happens, I hope that there is a good outcome, for your family member, and they can live in your caravan, for as long as they want
One hundred years ago? Yes.
These days...? Ah, how I wish it were....
There is far too much red and green tape these days...it's called easy revenue raising.
Who will know if a friend or family member is living in a caravan in your back yard?
What's the difference whether they live in the caravan or in the house to anybody?
A rental may perhaps be another matter.
They have these ads on tv about homeless people and buying them swags. I reckon if they could find a backyard instead of under a bridge they'd be much safer. I wouldn't mind helping somebody out by letting them pitch a tent in my (huge) backyard.