Cassowary Coast Regional Council Closure Free Camp Site
Big Gorilla said
05:10 PM Sep 16, 2012
This is the cheeky e-mail I sent to Council:
Below is a sample of a message running rampant on Forums utilized by RV travellers Australia wide. These Forums attract a lot of readers. For example CMCA has over 63,000 members in Australia:
We were intending to stop off at site number 29 ( Kennedy store) in Queensland tonight only to be told by the lady who runs the store that she has had to cancel the stopover due to council intervention. They accused her of running a caravan park which it's not but they would not listen and threatened to fine her if she continued. So there goes another one. May only be a small one but it's just another example.
You might also be interested in the attachment, an article I wrote for the Forums.
What I have written about lack of facilities for RV travellers, not only applies to myself, but those words are echoed time and again in Forums and various publications. Your Council is way out of touch with modern travellers. You have succumbed to the pressure of Caravan Park/s in your area to the detriment of other businesses that we frequent, petrol stations, supermarkets, coffee and souvenier shops and various other tourist attractions you may have to offer. It is noted from your web site that Council run a number of Caravan Parks. Is this the interest you are protecting ?
Im suggesting you not get too excited about building future tourist numbers. Your attitude has lost you the majority of RV travellers who will avoid your town, and others with similar archaic ideas, like the plague. Look at your statistical information on visitor numbers in 12 months, which will prove me right.... I wouldnt like to be your Caravan Park owner having to explain to other businesses in your town how they killed of a lucrative trade from RV travellers. You maybe understandably proud of your town, but to us RV travellers, its only another small town to pass through on the way to something better.
This is the reply I received from one Councillor this morning:
Thank you for your email. I would like to reply that I do not support free travel as nothing in life is free and ultimately someone is paying for the facilities being used by these travellers. I acknowledge that SOME travellers spend money in our town but would like to suggest that rate payers also buy food, fuel, support coffee shops etc yet they don't get free water, sewerage, rubbish removal or land for free or at a subsidised rate.
Caravan parks have to comply with over 85 laws and regulations which means huge costs are added to running these businesses. Information made available to me suggests that in 2003 the CMCA opened their own caravan park now called Casino RV Resort with basic sites rented at $8. Today however they charge $25-$37 for a site as they have discovered they could not cover costs.
It amazes me that some of these travellers travel around in $100,000, $200,000 and $500,000 motorhomes yet they can't afford $30 for a site in a park. Caravan park stayers mean economic flow on for our region. Park staff sell our region.
Rest areas are designed for travellers to have REST when they are tired. It is a safety initiative that I support. Longer stays of days and weeks is nothing more than RATEPAYER FUNDED CAMPING and there is a cost.
Cost of land, land tax, rates and regulations.
Cost of water.
Cost to treat sewerage.
Cost to treat sullage.
Cost to dispose of rubbish.
Cost to replace or maintain facilities.
Cost to clean facilities.
I will continue to support the best interests of our caravan park owners as they contribute 100's of 1000's of $ to our community and I will advise that they are not all council owned. They are business people doing it tough as a result of this new trend of expected free camping.
Yes the CMCA have 63,000 members but these numbers pale in comparison to the 480,000 members of BIG 4 Holiday Parks Chain and 260,000 Top Tourist Parks.
I have spoken to representatives from Cairns Regional Council, Hinchinbrook Regional Council and the Witsunday Regional Council and they have advised that they do not support free camping. I have also been advised that many other councils have taken steps to reduce the amount of free campers abusing their hospitality by implementing the CPAQ Overflow Policy. Councils such as Fraser Coast, Carpentaria, Murweh, Rockhamton and Blackall-Tambo Regional Councils.
It seems the pressure from this minority of travellers may be coming from the fear that they are losing more and more opportunities for free stays.
I understand that their argument is that they are self contained and don't need all the facilities on offer at caravan parks but imagine the reception an individual would get if they booked into the Hilton but asked for a discounted rate as they did not intend on using the pool, Internet facilities, air conditioning, etc. What a joke.
There are many people I know that would love to go on holiday but can't afford to so they don't go. They have to live within their means.
It is my opinion that if this minority of travellers don't wish to stop at our beautiful region because of our lack of free camping then so be it. I don't believe they are the ones spending here anyway and from reports I have received they are at times the very people walking away from our museums when they find the entry is not free. How long before the expectation of free camping develops into expectation of even more for free.
I feel the councillor's reply has some valid points - especially when you take into account that there IS a free camp at Bilyana - it is really a case of getting your facts straight before sending off letters of complaint.
I do see that the council and ratepayers are subsidising the travellers lifestyle, and we need to appreciate this, not abuse them. The Kennedy Store, by insisting on money be spent in store for staying, opens them up to all sorts of ramifications - i.e., insurance, OH&S rulings etc., all of which caravan parks have to take into account. Councils and ratepayers shoulder these responsibilities when they open a "free camp" - and I can also see that there have to be time limits on free stays, there are some out there who want to "sit" for a long time, not fair on other travellers who want to use the camp. . I love free camping, I love the camaraderie in these camps - but I can see where caravan parks are coming from as well. We need to see all sides of a story before criticising any party. I also like staying sometimes in caravan parks, but I prefer a smaller park, with none of the "bells and whistles" of the bigger ones, who cater to families.
My opinion, for what it is worth.
rockylizard said
05:38 PM Sep 16, 2012
Gday...
I have not met face-to-face any GNs from this forum. However, I am sure most know that, over the past four years of full-time travelling, I use van parks infrequently, preferring to camp. Forumites probably know that I also don't like the expression "free-camping" because I was taught as a little kid and throughout my life that there is "no such thing as a free lunch".
Those of us who travel into towns and expect to be provided with free access to areas for camping - especially should that be for more than overnight - should be mindful of exactly the response of the councillor above. I must admit, I have no difficulty in accepting the stance of that particular councillor's response - when I was a ratepayer, I certainly wanted to make sure my council spent my rates to the benefit of ALL our community. I do concede that "travellers spend money in the town" but $100 of fuel does not generate very much to the profit of the service station owner, $80 worth of basic grocery items similarly perhaps.
In my experience, the push to 'reduce/restrict' camping in rest areas is usually coming from the larger towns, whereas the smaller, inland towns, generally speaking, welcome visitors and offer their hospitality to attract us to their villages. They are really struggling because of their remoteness and small, dwindling and aging population.
At the risk of inflaming forumites, staying in rest areas is not camping, sorry . To me camping is staying in actual camping areas - which are usually away from towns.
A little while ago, I postured this as a "Food for thought" - offering, perhaps, a different perspective of what many towns feel about "we travellers".
Well said John - there is of course a big difference between "rest areas" and "free camps" - have stayed at both - overnight at a rest area, but can stay for designated number of hours or days at free camps.
Like camping on riverbanks etc., stayed at Boulia at the billabong just off the Donohue Highway - great spot, no time restrictions, no facilities apart from rubbish bins - that is indeed a "free camp" - or independent camping as some call it.
Dougwe said
06:00 PM Sep 16, 2012
Good debate point for sure. I can't comment much as I haven't done "Free" camping yet but slowly setting up to give it a go. I wonder though if I should still invest in Solar Power, are "Free" Camps on the way out?
I will still set up for "Free" camping so then I can give it a go when possible.
Those for and those against "Free" camping both have good and bad points.
I worked in Local Government Transport, Management level for 17 years so know how staff and councillors think and I will not go there. Let me just say, I'm glad to be out of it and have been now for 6 years.
It would be good though if as a GN looking for safe low cost CV parks some CV parks have a section for us that maybe a bit further away from the toot's and showers, just a bit of power to connect too. I must say that I like meeting people in CV parks and so far in my short travels I have met some really nice people and picked up a few tips along the way.
I go now as I am/will just be rambling on.
rockylizard said
06:34 PM Sep 16, 2012
Dougwe wrote:
--SNIPPED -- I wonder though if I should still invest in Solar Power, are "Free" Camps on the way out?
I will still set up for "Free" camping so then I can give it a go when possible. --SNIPPED --
Gday...
Actual camping areas will never be closed. Think about it. There is a complete difference between camp areas/campgrounds and rest areas that allow people to stop overnight (or sometimes longer if ya lucky).
There are hundreds of actual campgrounds/camp areas throughout this country. I (we) have been using them for a hundred years (well not personally ). Albeit, some of them are not free - eg National Parks - but they will never close those camp areas.
The issue of councils/authorities closing "free camp" rest areas that were originally put in place for just that, for weary travellers to stop and rest. It was not necessarily for travellers to stop, rest, sleep, roll out the awning, put out the chairs and expect to stay there for a couple (or more) nights.
So prepare for "independent camping", point the vehicle in the direction your heart takes you and enjoy the life.
Cheers - John
Dougwe said
06:55 PM Sep 16, 2012
Thanks John, until recently I did actually think "Free" and "independent" camping were the same thing but I have found different thanks to this great forum. I have always found your comments to be very good at all times. I will try to use "Independent" when referring to this type of lifestyle from now on. I might forget though occasionally.
I WILL be arranging alternative power source for my Avan Camper ASAP.
Thanks John and,
Gerty Dancer said
07:21 PM Sep 16, 2012
I found it very interesting in BG's original post that the Big 4 and Top Tourist Parks have such a huge membership. We rarely stay in Big 4's although recently spent a few nights in TT's and were amazed they are so popular considering they are often more expensive than other caravan parks. Obviously lots of people really like that type of park!
jetj said
07:46 PM Sep 16, 2012
The holidayers away for 2 to 3 weeks with the family once a year will usually afford the $30 a night to stay in a CP. The traveller or Nomad will try to save money and avoid CPs when they can. Bottom line!
brickies said
08:35 PM Sep 16, 2012
Well there sure is a good example of what to do if you want to get council offside , Hope you didn't mention this Forum in you email
Mr B2 said
09:16 PM Sep 16, 2012
Well I live in the shire of Yarra Ranges, My rates go to pay for parks, recreation area's, Etc Etc, Etc, The Dandenong Ranges, and the Yarra valley, A wine tourist area,
Do you think they will stop me paying my rates while I am away, Not bloody likely, People from all over the world come here, and they stay in all sorts of places, including free stop over places,
And a lot of it is at my expense, Rates Etc, So these councils dont really have a comeback, They come here and I get to subsidise them, Fairs fair, It does work both ways,
rockylizard said
09:33 PM Sep 16, 2012
Gday...
Not trying to begin a debate ... but just how many "free-camp rest areas" are there in the Yarra Ranges Shire ?? Perhaps the Powelltown Rest Area may qualify - given the boundaries of the Shire -
"Yarra Ranges Shire is located on metropolitan Melbourne's eastern fringe. It was formed in 1994 after the amalgamation of the former Healesville, Lilydale, Sherbrooke and Upper Yarra Shires"
Cheers - John
Sheba said
09:55 PM Sep 16, 2012
gordon_adl wrote:
They just plain don't have the staff nor the dollars to provide free clean areas for you.
I don't want them to "Provide free clean areas" for me. I just don't want to be forced to go into a Caravan Park, if I prefer to Freecamp.
I may be wrong, but I think most other Free-campers feel the same.
I am also a Rate-payer, as well.
Cheers,
Sheba.
-- Edited by Sheba on Sunday 16th of September 2012 09:57:22 PM
Big Gorilla said
10:21 PM Sep 16, 2012
brickies wrote:
Well there sure is a good example of what to do if you want to get council offside , Hope you didn't mention this Forum in you email
Read the post again. Do you see any Forums mentioned !
gordon_adl said
10:25 PM Sep 16, 2012
I think there tends to be an over estimation of power this forum has in regards to swaying major decisions for councils. In the grand scheme of things the overall amount of members on here pale in comparison to paying members of camping groups. Then take into effect that the actual amount of posting members on here is significantly even lower. Then the amounts of posters who even go so far as to send an email or letter are even smaller. We are but one small pea in a field of many pods.
glassies said
10:26 PM Sep 16, 2012
i hope to see lots of free campsites whilst im travelling the only time i ever used them before was when we needed a good decent shower and go for a pub meal other than that it was always a road side sleepout and im talking off the side of the road in the outback anywhere we could park and in them days it was different you were out in the middle of nowhere and nobody cared but that was about twelve years ago now since i last travelled like that.
I think that my hubby and i have paid enough taxes to expect to get something out of this life ,its a shame because all i keep hearing is things are getting tougher and tougher out there im wondering just how we are going to go i realy dislike the c/van park staying like tuna packed in .
gordon_adl said
10:50 PM Sep 16, 2012
'It is, I'm afraid, this exact attitude that gives gn's such a bad reputation. And if you don't think gn's have a bad rep, you're not really listening.
Everybody pays taxes. Just because you've paid doesn't mean you are entitled to any thing different than other tax payers. The very road that your travel on is paid for by taxes. I've said before these small councils in the country are doing it very tough. They just plain don't have the staff nor the dollars to provide free clean areas for you. It is also their responsibility to provide safey for you in these free camps. If they can't afford to do this then they may have no alternative to close them.
I think there is a misconception that I'm anti gn. I'm not. I'm very much for it. But times have changed. Whether one likes it or not. I do though try to point out different points of views and it seems when I do people instead send me flaming pm's.
glassies wrote:
I think that my hubby and i have paid enough taxes to expect to get something out of this life
Bosshog said
04:02 AM Sep 17, 2012
Take this up with any council on the east coast and you are on a hiding to nothing as if you spoke to the ratepayers there would be an overwhelming majority who would support the councillors reply.
Inland in some of the remote parts yes you might stand a chance but on the coast forget it.
brickies said
04:53 AM Sep 17, 2012
Bosshog you are spot on , I has a rate payer fund my own travels so why has a rate payer fund someone else . If anybody should fund free camps it should be State governments , and if they start doing that may require more rego for caravans
jetj said
05:07 AM Sep 17, 2012
I don't think responsible nomads need anyone to clean up after them, unfortunately some do leave a mess spoiling it for all.
I don't want to be forced into a CP either.
gordon_adl said
05:27 AM Sep 17, 2012
But there are 100's free camps available. Nobody is forcing anyone to camp in a cp. If a person wants to visit a particular place, abide by the law. If the law states no free camping than that's that. If you don't like it don't stay. But to expect that just because you pay taxes you should be allowed to free camp, well that's just nothing more than a sense of entitlement. By all means anyone has the right to disagree and write a letter to complain. But just because you don't get the response you'd like don't make them horrible people.
Sheba wrote:
I just don't want to be forced to go into a Caravan Park, if I prefer to Freecamp.
Sheba.
-- Edited by Sheba on Sunday 16th of September 2012 09:57:22 PM
briche said
09:34 AM Sep 17, 2012
As the one that seemed to have started this onslaught of free camps I must apologize that it blew up into what in the end was a full on attack on the local council and councils generally. I have no problems with the councillors comments, if fact some of the points she makes are very relevant to the word " free " . As was said, nothing is free, somebody has to pay for those facilities and in fact it's not the traveller but the rate payers of the local area. I, like all of us want to travel for the lowest cost possible but that is not always going to be the case. In the end you take what comes and at whatever cost and grin and bear it, you don't have to like it but there it is. The point I made at the start of all this was to just report a change to the availability for overnight at Kennedy Store, no more, no less. Ther was no intent on my part to add fuel to the topic that at times seems to envelop the whole topic of free camping. The one aspect that I saw come out of this is the term " independent camping" . It does better embrace the lconcept of living this life style and I for one would like to embrace that rather than "free camping". As was stated, smaller towns do, in the main, go out of their way to embrace the traveller, for example, Home Hill, Babinda, etc to a large effort than the larger towns and cities. To be fair about it, those locations are no so vulnerable and therefore don't need to rely on the traveller quite so much. That is just a fact of life and while at times I have been out of sorts about it, that's the way it was and if I don't like it, move on. I'm sorry if I am having a follow up rant here but I felt that the whole thing just got out of control and that was something that I never intended. Thanks, Brian And Cheryl.
-- Edited by briche on Monday 17th of September 2012 09:40:07 AM
jimricho said
01:59 PM Sep 17, 2012
I commend the excellent reply from from Cr Kylie Farinelli. I believe she has covered the issue very well, sticking to facts and data and not resorting to, or responding to, the pejorative name calling that sometimes accompanies posts on this issue on this forum.
Although I'm not a regular free camper I do support the concept as we all benefit from the availability of free and budget facilities. I does irk me however when I come across those who want to be able to set up wherever they wish and for as long as they wish without any regard to the amenity of local residents and/or day users of rest areas. It also irks me to see the intelligence insulting and highly specious argument of "I paid my taxes" for claiming an entitlement to their every wish.
I believe that time limits at campsites/rest areas provides a good compromise between the needs of those travelling on a budget and the operators of caravan parks whose main desire is to be able to make a modest return on their investment and the long hours of running a park. It also should stop "squatters" from claiming the best campsites for the duration thus denying their fellow RVers of a site.
brickies said
03:14 PM Sep 17, 2012
What a balanced post from a wise Man, Camp Book has lots of free camping spot we need to feel lucky for all the places we can free camp . I know for a fact some free camp have been closed down because of miss use , The people that provided these free have a duty of care and if they feel they no longer can provide this duty of care they only have one option they don't do it to be mean if they did the free camp would not have been set up in the first place .
Gerty Dancer said
05:35 PM Sep 17, 2012
Goodonya Briche, well said.
jules47 said
10:35 PM Sep 17, 2012
Jimricho - you are spot on - we can't expect councils and ratepayers to support our life choices - and we must be thankful for the towns and councils that allow us the use of their parks etc., we need to look after them, not abuse them or the ones who make them available.
I love staying in "independent campspots" - more so than a caravan park, the camaradarie is wonderful, with everyone sharing information etc.
Lets all work together to keep this lifestyle available.
brickies said
09:35 PM Sep 18, 2012
Jules we also enjoy stay at camps provided for us when traveling and feel great to have these camps provided for us ,We also respect decision that may have to be made for whatever reason are closed has we do not know it has been done ,One maybe for our safety we then plan to go to another camp
rockylizard said
09:43 PM Sep 18, 2012
Gday...
Presently in the Wyandra Camp (half way between Cunnamulla and Charlieville QLD) - free with flushing toilets and solar-heated showers. It used to have power too for free.
I will post a longer, more informative report when I get to more stable internet - but the power was disconnected from this camp because of "free-campers" who overloaded the electric system on one too many occasions - piggy-backing onto the power outlets - sometimes upto 14 vans at one time. They were blowing the town's power supply. Locals became very unhappy. The locals are now divided on the value of the 'free camp' .. it still exists and is one of the best I have been in - but because of "travellers" it just might not be here for too much longer.
"Travellers" are our own worst enemies often I think.
Cheers - John
Sheba said
02:40 AM Sep 19, 2012
I must apologise if my Post escalated things with regard to "independant" camping too. I can't find the original paragraph that prompted me to do so, but this is the closest I can find to it now. The original had a very large fine mentioned, which I thought was outrageous.
"Those camping outside designated camping grounds can be reported to Council. A Council officer will investigate the complaint and may issue a notice. Should people continue to breach the notice, a fine may be issued."
Cheers,
Sheba.
brickies said
08:56 AM Sep 21, 2012
Thank you for your post we for one enjoy your region and are fully aware of your concerns of your ratepayers , Has you would know all groups have members with mixed ideas about how things should happen , I am pleased that you have taken the time to read all posts to get a balanced view of our forum . We for one are grateful for free camps for overnight camping when they are available but don't believe it is our right and thank your council or others who do also . IT is sad that your personal email was posted without your knowledge but i believe it showed your concern for your people in your area and took on concern of some people on this forum
-- Edited by brickies on Friday 21st of September 2012 08:20:46 PM
This is the cheeky e-mail I sent to Council:
We were intending to stop off at site number 29 ( Kennedy store) in Queensland tonight only to be told by the lady who runs the store that she has had to cancel the stopover due to council intervention. They accused her of running a caravan park which it's not but they would not listen and threatened to fine her if she continued. So there goes another one. May only be a small one but it's just another example.
You might also be interested in the attachment, an article I wrote for the Forums.
What I have written about lack of facilities for RV travellers, not only applies to myself, but those words are echoed time and again in Forums and various publications. Your Council is way out of touch with modern travellers. You have succumbed to the pressure of Caravan Park/s in your area to the detriment of other businesses that we frequent, petrol stations, supermarkets, coffee and souvenier shops and various other tourist attractions you may have to offer. It is noted from your web site that Council run a number of Caravan Parks. Is this the interest you are protecting ?
Im suggesting you not get too excited about building future tourist numbers. Your attitude has lost you the majority of RV travellers who will avoid your town, and others with similar archaic ideas, like the plague. Look at your statistical information on visitor numbers in 12 months, which will prove me right.... I wouldnt like to be your Caravan Park owner having to explain to other businesses in your town how they killed of a lucrative trade from RV travellers. You maybe understandably proud of your town, but to us RV travellers, its only another small town to pass through on the way to something better.
=================================================================================================
This is the reply I received from one Councillor this morning:
Caravan parks have to comply with over 85 laws and regulations which means huge costs are added to running these businesses. Information made available to me suggests that in 2003 the CMCA opened their own caravan park now called Casino RV Resort with basic sites rented at $8. Today however they charge $25-$37 for a site as they have discovered they could not cover costs.
It amazes me that some of these travellers travel around in $100,000, $200,000 and $500,000 motorhomes yet they can't afford $30 for a site in a park. Caravan park stayers mean economic flow on for our region. Park staff sell our region.
Rest areas are designed for travellers to have REST when they are tired. It is a safety initiative that I support. Longer stays of days and weeks is nothing more than RATEPAYER FUNDED CAMPING and there is a cost.
Cost of land, land tax, rates and regulations.
Cost of water.
Cost to treat sewerage.
Cost to treat sullage.
Cost to dispose of rubbish.
Cost to replace or maintain facilities.
Cost to clean facilities.
I will continue to support the best interests of our caravan park owners as they contribute 100's of 1000's of $ to our community and I will advise that they are not all council owned. They are business people doing it tough as a result of this new trend of expected free camping.
Yes the CMCA have 63,000 members but these numbers pale in comparison to the 480,000 members of BIG 4 Holiday Parks Chain and 260,000 Top Tourist Parks.
I have spoken to representatives from Cairns Regional Council, Hinchinbrook Regional Council and the Witsunday Regional Council and they have advised that they do not support free camping. I have also been advised that many other councils have taken steps to reduce the amount of free campers abusing their hospitality by implementing the CPAQ Overflow Policy. Councils such as Fraser Coast, Carpentaria, Murweh, Rockhamton and Blackall-Tambo Regional Councils.
It seems the pressure from this minority of travellers may be coming from the fear that they are losing more and more opportunities for free stays.
I understand that their argument is that they are self contained and don't need all the facilities on offer at caravan parks but imagine the reception an individual would get if they booked into the Hilton but asked for a discounted rate as they did not intend on using the pool, Internet facilities, air conditioning, etc. What a joke.
There are many people I know that would love to go on holiday but can't afford to so they don't go. They have to live within their means.
It is my opinion that if this minority of travellers don't wish to stop at our beautiful region because of our lack of free camping then so be it. I don't believe they are the ones spending here anyway and from reports I have received they are at times the very people walking away from our museums when they find the entry is not free. How long before the expectation of free camping develops into expectation of even more for free.
Cr Kylie Farinelli
Councillor Division 6
=====================================================================================
So there you have it !!!
I do see that the council and ratepayers are subsidising the travellers lifestyle, and we need to appreciate this, not abuse them. The Kennedy Store, by insisting on money be spent in store for staying, opens them up to all sorts of ramifications - i.e., insurance, OH&S rulings etc., all of which caravan parks have to take into account. Councils and ratepayers shoulder these responsibilities when they open a "free camp" - and I can also see that there have to be time limits on free stays, there are some out there who want to "sit" for a long time, not fair on other travellers who want to use the camp.
.
I love free camping, I love the camaraderie in these camps - but I can see where caravan parks are coming from as well. We need to see all sides of a story before criticising any party. I also like staying sometimes in caravan parks, but I prefer a smaller park, with none of the "bells and whistles" of the bigger ones, who cater to families.
My opinion, for what it is worth.
Gday...
I have not met face-to-face any GNs from this forum. However, I am sure most know that, over the past four years of full-time travelling, I use van parks infrequently, preferring to camp. Forumites probably know that I also don't like the expression "free-camping" because I was taught as a little kid and throughout my life that there is "no such thing as a free lunch".
Those of us who travel into towns and expect to be provided with free access to areas for camping - especially should that be for more than overnight - should be mindful of exactly the response of the councillor above. I must admit, I have no difficulty in accepting the stance of that particular councillor's response - when I was a ratepayer, I certainly wanted to make sure my council spent my rates to the benefit of ALL our community. I do concede that "travellers spend money in the town" but $100 of fuel does not generate very much to the profit of the service station owner, $80 worth of basic grocery items similarly perhaps.
In my experience, the push to 'reduce/restrict' camping in rest areas is usually coming from the larger towns, whereas the smaller, inland towns, generally speaking, welcome visitors and offer their hospitality to attract us to their villages. They are really struggling because of their remoteness and small, dwindling and aging population.
At the risk of inflaming forumites, staying in rest areas is not camping, sorry
. To me camping is staying in actual camping areas - which are usually away from towns.
A little while ago, I postured this as a "Food for thought" - offering, perhaps, a different perspective of what many towns feel about "we travellers".
This is the link to that thread - http://thegreynomads.activeboard.com/t50202229/food-for-thought-perhaps/
Cheers - John
Like camping on riverbanks etc., stayed at Boulia at the billabong just off the Donohue Highway - great spot, no time restrictions, no facilities apart from rubbish bins - that is indeed a "free camp" - or independent camping as some call it.
Good debate point for sure. I can't comment much as I haven't done "Free" camping yet but slowly setting up to give it a go. I wonder though if I should still invest in Solar Power, are "Free" Camps on the way out?
I will still set up for "Free" camping so then I can give it a go when possible.
Those for and those against "Free" camping both have good and bad points.
I worked in Local Government Transport, Management level for 17 years so know how staff and councillors think and I will not go there. Let me just say, I'm glad to be out of it and have been now for 6 years.
It would be good though if as a GN looking for safe low cost CV parks some CV parks have a section for us that maybe a bit further away from the toot's and showers, just a bit of power to connect too. I must say that I like meeting people in CV parks and so far in my short travels I have met some really nice people and picked up a few tips along the way.
I go now as I am/will just be rambling on.
Gday...
Actual camping areas will never be closed. Think about it. There is a complete difference between camp areas/campgrounds and rest areas that allow people to stop overnight (or sometimes longer if ya lucky).
There are hundreds of actual campgrounds/camp areas throughout this country. I (we) have been using them for a hundred years (well not personally
). Albeit, some of them are not free - eg National Parks - but they will never close those camp areas.
The issue of councils/authorities closing "free camp" rest areas that were originally put in place for just that, for weary travellers to stop and rest. It was not necessarily for travellers to stop, rest, sleep, roll out the awning, put out the chairs and expect to stay there for a couple (or more) nights.
So prepare for "independent camping", point the vehicle in the direction your heart takes you and enjoy the life.
Cheers - John
Thanks John, until recently I did actually think "Free" and "independent" camping were the same thing but I have found different thanks to this great forum. I have always found your comments to be very good at all times. I will try to use "Independent" when referring to this type of lifestyle from now on. I might forget though occasionally.
I WILL be arranging alternative power source for my Avan Camper ASAP.
Thanks John and,
The holidayers away for 2 to 3 weeks with the family once a year will usually afford the $30 a night to stay in a CP. The traveller or Nomad will try to save money and avoid CPs when they can. Bottom line!
Well I live in the shire of Yarra Ranges, My rates go to pay for parks, recreation area's, Etc Etc, Etc, The Dandenong Ranges, and the Yarra valley, A wine tourist area,
Do you think they will stop me paying my rates while I am away, Not bloody likely, People from all over the world come here, and they stay in all sorts of places, including free stop over places,
And a lot of it is at my expense, Rates Etc, So these councils dont really have a comeback, They come here and I get to subsidise them, Fairs fair, It does work both ways,
Gday...
Not trying to begin a debate ... but just how many "free-camp rest areas" are there in the Yarra Ranges Shire ?? Perhaps the Powelltown Rest Area may qualify - given the boundaries of the Shire -
"Yarra Ranges Shire is located on metropolitan Melbourne's eastern fringe. It was formed in 1994 after the amalgamation of the former Healesville, Lilydale, Sherbrooke and Upper Yarra Shires"
Cheers - John
-- Edited by Sheba on Sunday 16th of September 2012 09:57:22 PM
Read the post again. Do you see any Forums mentioned !
was when we needed a good decent shower and go for a pub meal other than that it was always
a road side sleepout and im talking off the side of the road in the outback anywhere we could park and
in them days it was different you were out in the middle of nowhere and nobody cared but that was about
twelve years ago now since i last travelled like that.
I think that my hubby and i have paid enough taxes to expect to get something out of this life ,its a shame
because all i keep hearing is things are getting tougher and tougher out there im wondering just how we are going
to go i realy dislike the c/van park staying like tuna packed in .
Take this up with any council on the east coast and you are on a hiding to nothing as if you spoke to the ratepayers there would be an overwhelming majority who would support the councillors reply.
Inland in some of the remote parts yes you might stand a chance but on the coast forget it.
I don't think responsible nomads need anyone to clean up after them, unfortunately some do leave a mess spoiling it for all.
I don't want to be forced into a CP either.
-- Edited by briche on Monday 17th of September 2012 09:40:07 AM
Although I'm not a regular free camper I do support the concept as we all benefit from the availability of free and budget facilities. I does irk me however when I come across those who want to be able to set up wherever they wish and for as long as they wish without any regard to the amenity of local residents and/or day users of rest areas. It also irks me to see the intelligence insulting and highly specious argument of "I paid my taxes" for claiming an entitlement to their every wish.
I believe that time limits at campsites/rest areas provides a good compromise between the needs of those travelling on a budget and the operators of caravan parks whose main desire is to be able to make a modest return on their investment and the long hours of running a park. It also should stop "squatters" from claiming the best campsites for the duration thus denying their fellow RVers of a site.
Goodonya Briche, well said.
I love staying in "independent campspots" - more so than a caravan park, the camaradarie is wonderful, with everyone sharing information etc.
Lets all work together to keep this lifestyle available.
Gday...
Presently in the Wyandra Camp (half way between Cunnamulla and Charlieville QLD) - free with flushing toilets and solar-heated showers. It used to have power too for free.
I will post a longer, more informative report when I get to more stable internet - but the power was disconnected from this camp because of "free-campers" who overloaded the electric system on one too many occasions - piggy-backing onto the power outlets - sometimes upto 14 vans at one time. They were blowing the town's power supply. Locals became very unhappy. The locals are now divided on the value of the 'free camp' .. it still exists and is one of the best I have been in - but because of "travellers" it just might not be here for too much longer.
"Travellers" are our own worst enemies often I think.
Cheers - John
I must apologise if my Post escalated things with regard to "independant" camping too. I can't find the original paragraph that prompted me to do so, but this is the closest I can find to it now. The original had a very large fine mentioned, which I thought was outrageous.
"Those camping outside designated camping grounds can be reported to Council. A Council officer will investigate the complaint and may issue a notice. Should people continue to breach the notice, a fine may be issued."
Cheers,
Sheba.
Thank you for your post we for one enjoy your region and are fully aware of your concerns of your ratepayers , Has you would know all groups have members with mixed ideas about how things should happen , I am pleased that you have taken the time to read all posts to get a balanced view of our forum . We for one are grateful for free camps for overnight camping when they are available but don't believe it is our right and thank your council or others who do also . IT is sad that your personal email was posted without your knowledge but i believe it showed your concern for your people in your area and took on concern of some people on this forum
-- Edited by brickies on Friday 21st of September 2012 08:20:46 PM