ATM (aggregate trailer mass) or GTM (gross trailer mass) is the combined weight of the caravan when fully loaded not coupled to a vehicle.
When calculating ATM remember:
Water storage weight.
Gas bottle weights.
Boot contents weight.
All foods and clothing.
All added accessories.
All grocery weight.
Tow vehicle must be at least the same weight as the caravan, preferably heavier, better if the van is only 70% of the weight of the tow vehicle.
Pradokakadudavid said
04:24 PM May 4, 2017
The police would think about it like this.
They see a Toyota Prado pulling a 25" van - hey presto has to be over ATM.
They see a Landcruiser towing a 25" no problems; add a few more cartons.
They see a smaller rig like D Max or BT 50 then they might investigate if van looks too big.
Pradokakadudavid said
04:30 PM May 4, 2017
Will be on your compliance plate; if you can still read it
rockylizard said
05:58 PM May 4, 2017
Pradokakadudavid wrote:
Caravans and towing and important weights.
Tow vehicle must be at least the same weight as the caravan, preferably heavier, better if the van is only 70% of the weight of the tow vehicle.
Gday...
David, that is very interesting information. Are you able to provide a link to the source of that comment/information?
I have not heard of that 'regulation/advice/opinion' previously.
Definitely, it is extremely valid advice that the van should ideally be less weight that the towing vehicle ... not sure about 70% ... but lower.
cheers - John
dogbox said
08:20 PM May 4, 2017
Possum3 wrote:
Radar We were pulled over by Police and Mermaids (They are the one's with scales) East of Camooweal, along with all heavy vehicles - They checked weights (van and tug), licences, BAC (Breathalysed), Compliance Plates - They even mentioned that number plate location was OK.
The State Police were brought in from Cairns for a week long "Targeted Operation" in Qld.
from all the replies only one person has said that they have been check weighed by the authorities
-- Edited by dogbox on Thursday 4th of May 2017 08:21:05 PM
Birdo said
08:52 AM May 14, 2017
Hi Peter Rose
A very interesting topic that you hear a lot from third or fourth parties.
Your original question was "has anyone had their caravan WEIGHED by police or authorities "
After 1154 views only one person has actually said they have had their caravan weighed by authorities and no one has said they have SEEN any van being weighed by police or authorities.
With so many obviously over weight vans on the road will this become a common occurrence?
If someone has an accident with an overweight van Why should the insurance company pay out as it is an illegal rig.
Cheers
aussie_paul said
12:31 PM May 14, 2017
Birdo wrote:
Hi Peter Rose A very interesting topic that you hear a lot from third or fourth parties. Your original question was "has anyone had their caravan WEIGHED by police or authorities " After 1154 views only one person has actually said they have had their caravan weighed by authorities and no one has said they have SEEN any van being weighed by police or authorities. With so many obviously over weight vans on the road will this become a common occurrence? If someone has an accident with an overweight van Why should the insurance company pay out as it is an illegal rig. Cheers
Depending on the accident severity it may be difficult proving it was overweight.
Aussie Paul.
Mike Harding said
01:33 PM May 14, 2017
aussie_paul wrote:Depending on the accident severity it may be difficult proving it was overweight.
Exactly.
Virtually every vehicle is in breach of some law if you look hard enough; that alone is not sufficient to invalidate an insurance agreement - irrespective of the policy wording. When it all gets to court it has to be shown the breach materially contributed to the accident.
Birdo said
02:09 PM May 14, 2017
aussie_paul wrote:
Birdo wrote:
Hi Peter Rose A very interesting topic that you hear a lot from third or fourth parties. Your original question was "has anyone had their caravan WEIGHED by police or authorities " After 1154 views only one person has actually said they have had their caravan weighed by authorities and no one has said they have SEEN any van being weighed by police or authorities. With so many obviously over weight vans on the road will this become a common occurrence? If someone has an accident with an overweight van Why should the insurance company pay out as it is an illegal rig. Cheers
Depending on the accident severity it may be difficult proving it was overweight.
Aussie Paul.
Sorry
I should not have added the insurance company bit as it was off the original topic.
Back to the original topic.
So far only one member has actually been weighed by the police.
cheers
Radar said
06:53 PM May 14, 2017
An interesting fact.
After 43 years as a professional transport driver, driving in 4 states and 1 territory apart from maned states road transport weighbridges, once only have I been asked to drive onto portable weighing device on the side of the road but moments before I climbed back into the cab they decided it was not needed, proceed on your way.
Now maned weighbridges thats different at least once if not twice a day up to 5 times in 24 hours. Melbourne to Cairns by the coast and via inland roads, Newcastle/Sydney to Adelaide, Whyalla and everything between.
Would you believe 7 times in one night on the Hume Highway in one night the police enforcement raids between Goulburn to Gundagi "license, logbook, blow in the bag" I don't recall them ever saying thank you or goodnight. This was a training exercise for the police academy at Goulburn in NSW.
Now this was in the eighties maybe in the 2 thousands things could be different.
What I am trying to say is this weighing is not a common thing, if another caravaner is pointing to the ground he maybe trying to warn you the scalelies are weighing up the road pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear, you will soon learn as I did and not become a static.
Hewy54 said
07:40 PM May 14, 2017
Radar wrote:
What I am trying to say is this weighing is not a common thing, if another caravaner is pointing to the ground he maybe trying to warn you the scalelies are weighing up the road pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear, you will soon learn as I did and not become a static.
Why would you advise anyone to pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear?
If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
Mike Harding said
07:54 PM May 14, 2017
>If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
Damn! But you self righteous people make me sick.
Radar said
07:58 PM May 14, 2017
Hewy54 wrote:
Radar wrote:
What I am trying to say is this weighing is not a common thing, if another caravaner is pointing to the ground he maybe trying to warn you the scalelies are weighing up the road pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear, you will soon learn as I did and not become a static.
Why would you advise anyone to pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear?
If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
Well pull up, check that everything is in order, there would be nothing worse then being wrote up for 10 litres of water or a globe not working which was working at the start of your day.
Your name could be Kelly, Starlight, Thunderbolt, Bond or just plain unlucky.
Just saying.
Hewy54 said
08:04 PM May 14, 2017
Mike Harding wrote:
>If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
Damn! But you self righteous people make me sick.
Sorry but I value the safety of myself, my family and other road users. We have ATM's etc for a reason so I believe we should stick to them.
Sorry about you feeling sick, hope you get better soon.
macka17 said
12:22 PM Nov 15, 2017
Driving an Overwight\Defective veh or combination of any size.
It SHOULD be stopped and rectified.
Think of those kids back there. Your missus in seat beside you.
It's known as "responsibilities" for YOUR actions.
You KNOW what figures ARE. If YOU(whoever) Ignore them to suit yourself. YOU are being irresponsible to yourself,
and EVERYBODY else on the road.
Same as that 96 yr old drove into Hospital wall yesterday. If I pass medical I'll KEEP my licence.
NO Mention of brain slowing down. Reactions to things. Actual ageing.
I reckon NOBODY. Regardless of experience ecord. Should be driving in todays traffic in todays (much more) powerful vehicles. OVER the age of. Say 85 yrs and UP TO.. Depending on , your capabilities and medical.
Plus it SHOULD BE ILLEGAL.
To have that medical with any doctor in YOUR Usual surgery.
Doc has NOT to know you. Just see your medical history.
Impartial.
Be REAL. You've had a great run. YOUR Reactions ARE a lot slower. Regardless of what YOU think.
A licence is NOT... an entitlement. It has to be both earned. and kept valid.
Same as Dieing. Move over and make room for somebody else. Somebody did for you a long time ago.
Have a gud won All.
-- Edited by macka17 on Wednesday 15th of November 2017 12:25:43 PM
TD said
01:29 PM Mar 3, 2024
To summarise
- Not many people actually pulled over.
- All sounds fine to run the gauntlet till we have an accident and others are effected (killed).
- Regardless, we should all try to do the right thing for all road users and stay under weight. It provides peace of mind, keeps us safe but also important to acknowledging that its financially costly. I ignorantly bought my first renovated van then looked into everything and found I was overweight (4kg) with just the essentials in it. (expensive lesson in caravan weights!)
I had to up the ATM of my van.extra breaks on back axel and increase the GVM of my tow vehicle.(if I planned on taking the kids and filling up with fuel!?)
A total of about 8k (caravan breaks plus increased suspension on my cruiser but Im sorted now.)
My motivation was the safety of my family (and you) and the knowledge that if an accident happened, insurance would drop me like a hot spud.
Safe travels!
Aussie1 said
02:19 PM Mar 3, 2024
Hewy54 wrote:
Mike Harding wrote:
>If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
Damn! But you self righteous people make me sick.
Sorry but I value the safety of myself, my family and other road users. We have ATM's etc for a reason so I believe we should stick to them.
Sorry about you feeling sick, hope you get better soon.
X2
Exactly Hewy54, along with those who "winge" at every opportunity re ALL area's of road rules. Especially those that are Voluntary revenue contributors. Oh hang on, it is suddenly different if one of their one's suffers a tragedy
diggerop said
11:33 AM Mar 4, 2024
My sister and her husband had an accident while towing. The vehicle was a written off, the van was fixed. The truck that they hit was rolled. The van was not weighed and all the insurance was paid in full.
Hydeeeho said
02:52 PM Mar 5, 2024
In over 30 years towing a caravan never been stopped and weighed
Cheers
Dave
Eaglemax said
03:02 PM Mar 5, 2024
Well I'll answer your question and wont lecture you.
No, I've never been weighed by any authority.
But in terms of your larger/extra water tank. I repleaced our 63L tank in our Jurgens for a 110L and got an upgrade of a max of 120kg for our van. Meaning we have 57kg extra for food etc. But one of the best moved I've made is to add a water bladder to the towcar. In our case behind the rear seat of our SUV 93L. has pump. you can get them for the rear footwell. In our case it doesnt go over the max load for our vehicle. Tony
Caravans and towing and important weights.
Tare weight = unladed weight of the van (new van with nothing added).
Gross weight = laden weight (total weight when fully loaded) usually described as ATM
Gross-tare = net weight (how much weight you can add) ATM - Tare weight = gross tare weight.
ATM (aggregate trailer mass) or GTM (gross trailer mass) is the combined weight of the caravan when fully loaded not coupled to a vehicle.
When calculating ATM remember:
Water storage weight.
Gas bottle weights.
Boot contents weight.
All foods and clothing.
All added accessories.
All grocery weight.
Tow vehicle must be at least the same weight as the caravan, preferably heavier, better if the van is only 70% of the weight of the tow vehicle.
The police would think about it like this.
They see a Toyota Prado pulling a 25" van - hey presto has to be over ATM.
They see a Landcruiser towing a 25" no problems; add a few more cartons.
They see a smaller rig like D Max or BT 50 then they might investigate if van looks too big.
Will be on your compliance plate; if you can still read it
Gday...
David, that is very interesting information. Are you able to provide a link to the source of that comment/information?
I have not heard of that 'regulation/advice/opinion' previously.
Definitely, it is extremely valid advice that the van should ideally be less weight that the towing vehicle ... not sure about 70% ... but lower.
cheers - John
from all the replies only one person has said that they have been check weighed by the authorities
-- Edited by dogbox on Thursday 4th of May 2017 08:21:05 PM
A very interesting topic that you hear a lot from third or fourth parties.
Your original question was "has anyone had their caravan WEIGHED by police or authorities "
After 1154 views only one person has actually said they have had their caravan weighed by authorities and no one has said they have SEEN any van being weighed by police or authorities.
With so many obviously over weight vans on the road will this become a common occurrence?
If someone has an accident with an overweight van Why should the insurance company pay out as it is an illegal rig.
Cheers
Depending on the accident severity it may be difficult proving it was overweight.
Aussie Paul.
Exactly.
Virtually every vehicle is in breach of some law if you look hard enough; that alone is not sufficient to invalidate an insurance agreement - irrespective of the policy wording. When it all gets to court it has to be shown the breach materially contributed to the accident.
Sorry
I should not have added the insurance company bit as it was off the original topic.
Back to the original topic.
So far only one member has actually been weighed by the police.
cheers
An interesting fact.
After 43 years as a professional transport driver, driving in 4 states and 1 territory apart from maned states road transport weighbridges, once only have I been asked to drive onto portable weighing device on the side of the road but moments before I climbed back into the cab they decided it was not needed, proceed on your way.
Now maned weighbridges thats different at least once if not twice a day up to 5 times in 24 hours. Melbourne to Cairns by the coast and via inland roads, Newcastle/Sydney to Adelaide, Whyalla and everything between.
Would you believe 7 times in one night on the Hume Highway in one night the police enforcement raids between Goulburn to Gundagi "license, logbook, blow in the bag" I don't recall them ever saying thank you or goodnight. This was a training exercise for the police academy at Goulburn in NSW.
Now this was in the eighties maybe in the 2 thousands things could be different.
What I am trying to say is this weighing is not a common thing, if another caravaner is pointing to the ground he maybe trying to warn you the scalelies are weighing up the road pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear, you will soon learn as I did and not become a static.
Why would you advise anyone to pull up and have a cuppa until the coast is clear?
If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
>If any rig is overweight they deserve to be pulled up and fined!!!!
Damn! But you self righteous people make me sick.
Well pull up, check that everything is in order, there would be nothing worse then being wrote up for 10 litres of water or a globe not working which was working at the start of your day.
Your name could be Kelly, Starlight, Thunderbolt, Bond or just plain unlucky.
Just saying.
Sorry but I value the safety of myself, my family and other road users. We have ATM's etc for a reason so I believe we should stick to them.
Sorry about you feeling sick, hope you get better soon.
Driving an Overwight\Defective veh or combination of any size.
It SHOULD be stopped and rectified.
Think of those kids back there. Your missus in seat beside you.
It's known as "responsibilities" for YOUR actions.
You KNOW what figures ARE.
If YOU(whoever) Ignore them to suit yourself.
YOU are being irresponsible to yourself,
and EVERYBODY else on the road.
Same as that 96 yr old drove into Hospital wall yesterday.
If I pass medical I'll KEEP my licence.
NO Mention of brain slowing down. Reactions to things.
Actual ageing.
I reckon NOBODY. Regardless of experience
ecord.
Should be driving in todays traffic in todays (much more) powerful vehicles.
OVER the age of. Say 85 yrs and UP TO.. Depending on ,
your capabilities and medical.
Plus it SHOULD BE ILLEGAL.
To have that medical with any doctor in YOUR Usual surgery.
Doc has NOT to know you. Just see your medical history.
Impartial.
Be REAL. You've had a great run. YOUR Reactions ARE a lot slower. Regardless of what YOU think.
A licence is NOT... an entitlement. It has to be both earned. and kept valid.
Same as Dieing.
Move over and make room for somebody else.
Somebody did for you a long time ago.
Have a gud won All.
-- Edited by macka17 on Wednesday 15th of November 2017 12:25:43 PM
X2
Exactly Hewy54, along with those who "winge" at every opportunity re ALL area's of road rules. Especially those that are Voluntary revenue contributors. Oh hang on, it is suddenly different if one of their one's suffers a tragedy
No, I've never been weighed by any authority.
But in terms of your larger/extra water tank. I repleaced our 63L tank in our Jurgens for a 110L and got an upgrade of a max of 120kg for our van. Meaning we have 57kg extra for food etc. But one of the best moved I've made is to add a water bladder to the towcar. In our case behind the rear seat of our SUV 93L. has pump. you can get them for the rear footwell. In our case it doesnt go over the max load for our vehicle. Tony