Are you running anything else, tv, inverter, fan etc. I have 175 litre everkool, run a tv for 4 to 6 hours a night, a light or 2 and even the microwave for a few minutes and the 2 120 amp batteries read at worst 12.3 volts usually 12.6 volts in the morning from 13.2 at dusk. Those batteries need to start the boat motors so i keep a close eye on the voltage.
Can you put an inline watt/amp metre to the fridge and check the draw. If the batteries are good and fully charged there must be a hell of a current draw somewhere to flatten them.
I only have 320 watts of solar and this is usually enough.
oldbloke said
11:19 PM Sep 24, 2021
Get the batteries checked. I bought a new van and the battery was sh1t from new.
Wanda said
09:32 AM Sep 25, 2021
iana wrote:
Is it possible that the power is going back through the solar panels at night, there should be a diode in the system to stop that. We have a compressor fridge and only 240ahs of battery, it lasts OK through the night.
I hope this is of some help.
We have 2 x 120 batteries with 3 x 150 solar panels and 210lt Evakool compressor fridge. After 5yrs of this set up we have never experienced any issues, most mornings, summer or winter with good sun, batteries are as low as 12.2vlts. Never have they been below 12vlt after watching tv(sometimes sat tv setup, so running sat box as well) lights and water pumps running for 2 people showering of an evening.
So you do have a issue, not telling you something you are not aware off, hey.
First up, yours, 13.2vlts at 8pm of an evening sounds high, mine as soon as the sun sets quickly drops to about 12.7(8)vlts which I believe is what a 12vlt battery sits on when fully charged? Yours at 13.2vlt sounds very high, but with 2 X 200 size batteries, which are enormous really, I am not sure what they should be sitting on when fully charged
All working with 2 x 200 batteries and 480solar you should be flying
I am NO sparky, but it sounds to me as if something is using up all this power somewhere, it can't just dissappear into the wilderness, or maybe 1 battery is faulty??It can happen, even with new batteries!
I think your only choice is to find a recommended sparky and leave it with him overnight so he can see exactly what it is doing
Don't go backwards to a 3way, they can give you problems as well, you have a good setup you just need to persist and find the problem.
Hang in there and good luck mate
Ian
-- Edited by Wanda on Sunday 26th of September 2021 09:28:20 AM
Whenarewethere said
01:32 PM Sep 25, 2021
Have a cup of tea.
Physically disconnect everything. Charge batteries. Disconnect charger. Measure voltage regularly as best you can for a 24 hour period with nothing connected.
You will have some sort of benchmark for the batteries.
Only connect the fridge, not via existing cable as there maybe some issue there.
Measure batteries voltage both with & without the compressor running regularly until the fridge will not run.
If you have an amp metre or DC clampmeter measure amps as well.
Once you have put all this data on a speadspread or back of an envelope.
Then we can hopefully narrow down the issue.
PeterD said
01:54 PM Sep 25, 2021
iana wrote:
Is it possible that the power is going back through the solar panels at night, there should be a diode in the system to stop that. We have a compressor fridge and only 240ahs of battery, it lasts OK through the night.
No doubt the solar panels are charging the batteries through a solar controller. There is no need for a diode. The controller does not work backwards and will not pass power back to the panel.
PeterD said
02:02 PM Sep 25, 2021
iana wrote:
Baz, have you had a look for that module yet?
Why do you keep harping on about the black box/module? He most likely does not have one. Waeco/Dometic electric caravan fridges have had a 240 V input for yonks. It is only the very old ones that are 12/24 V only. Look on P39 of the attachment.
Well here we go... last nite at 6pm fridge electrically disconnected, HWS going on GAS water pump on, 2 lights on. at about 8.30 pm voltage 12.8v. this morning at 6am voltage 10.7v oh golly gee and darn. RIGHT, both batteries OUT all 120kg of them and get them checked. QUOTE ( I'm putting a staggering amout of load on them and they holding up very well these are good very batteries. ). So the head scratching and search begins this is not a new problem 1st 2 years doing the same and i were blaming the fridge, new solar panels, new enerdrive system and dedicated solar controller and 2 x 260 ahr batteries ( in the process anti sway control wires cut and didn't know ) problem solved and worked ok. 1st chance to get away after chemo and a wheel came off on fixing the wheel discovered brake controller in car faulty and wires for anti sway cut and wiring removed , both fixed by auto elect. away for weekend ( when Dan allowed ) ran out of power but it was an over cast days. This time same problem but sunny in parts. This is where we are, Batteries in place and connected. fridge disconnected, water pump disconnected, Diesel heater disconnected, anti sway fuse removed, brake away disconnected. 4pm same 2 lights turned on, now we wait. Opp's and inverter disconnected.
iana said
06:05 PM Sep 25, 2021
Gee Pete, I know I have to stop my harping, that post entered on the Thu Oct 10 05:29 2019, and one earlier than that must be causing folks like you grief, goodness two posts in 2 years, Much too many. I had a read of the PDF document, same type of fridge as ours, although ours is bigger being an RPD-215. I could not see any 240v connection, but it has the same 12-24v DC connection as ours. There was however no mention of the (will write softly here) 240vac converter, so perhaps you could point out on those instructions where the 240vac connection is. Ours did come with the converter, and is one year older than Basses. Others and myself are trying to suggest where the power is going, solar panels do work in reverse at night, but as you so rightly say that should be stopped at the regulator. Maybe you could help by posting some helpful suggestions.
Bass said
07:51 PM Sep 25, 2021
7.50pm battery voltage 12.9v... so far so good.
Bass said
09:31 PM Sep 25, 2021
9.30pm battery voltage 12.9v.... so far so good.
Bass said
08:41 AM Sep 26, 2021
6am battery voltage 10.7v......So now the slow process of electrically disconnecting every individual 12v circut one at a time to see where fault is. (Of course its going to be the last one )
iana said
11:25 AM Sep 26, 2021
Reading your post back a bit, you say the fridge runs 24/7, is that right ? I hope the compressor is cycling maybe on for 5 minutes, off for 10. I have just recently added an extra fan to push air up past the compressor, and the condenser, you need to have a clear flow of air from below the compressor unit and out above. Your fridge I hope has the condenser mounted horizontally, ours has it mounted vertically, and I reckon it was struggling for cooling air.
Bass said
12:55 PM Sep 26, 2021
Iana, I don't think it is the fridge and yes the condensor is mounted horizontally. fitted a bottom vent and rejerked a few things and fridge was sort of working as it should. With everything connected electrically and turned off there was no current draw showing through the TREK controller and it is showing 13.5v. turn 2 lights on and it shows 0.4amps being drawn from the system, so I am thinking that whatever is drawing down from the batteries is not going through the controller. next step today is to disconect the solar and see the result. Slowly working out what it is not.
rgren2 said
12:59 PM Sep 26, 2021
Have you load tested the batteries?
Wanda said
02:16 PM Sep 26, 2021
I'm a bit confused with your battey sizes
Are they 200amp or 260amp and what you have 2 of them?
Are you running lithium or AGM type?
They are seriously big batteries if running AGM, can you get them that big!!How much do they each weigh??
Have they been badged correctly?
Ian
Bass said
03:52 PM Sep 26, 2021
Yep the batteries were load tested yesterday we had smoke coming from terminals they held up excellent, battery bloke said he had a staggering amount of load on the batteries and they held up very well. Batteries are 260 Ahr each, both are AGM, and weight more than the van, lol. Had to get help to lift them off the ground into the back of the landcruiser.
So.... Disconnected solar and electrically connected every thing else except heater that was at 12 midday at the moment battery voltage is 13.2v every thing is turned off. see how we go.
Peter_n_Margaret said
05:00 PM Sep 26, 2021
A test with a "staggering amount of load" on the batteries is a useless test. They are not being used for cranking. You need to put an accurately known load of (say) 20A on them (separately) and measure the voltage every hour until they are flat to establish their capacity in Ahrs. Cheers, Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Sunday 26th of September 2021 05:03:15 PM
oldbloke said
06:10 PM Sep 26, 2021
Bass wrote:
6am battery voltage 10.7v......So now the slow process of electrically disconnecting every individual 12v circut one at a time to see where fault is. (Of course its going to be the last one )
This is the best way to isolate the issue I think. Kiss. Guessing you have a short some where.
Bass said
09:30 AM Sep 27, 2021
6am this morn.... 13.0v so now connect heater up and see what happens.
iana said
09:39 AM Sep 27, 2021
Good news !
Bass said
01:57 PM Sep 27, 2021
Heater connected at 9am. at 2pm voltage 12.9v still solar disconnected. Slowly slowly we chase the monkey.
I have a Kyoritsu 2046R & would be completely lost without it.
Bass said
09:05 AM Sep 28, 2021
Well... got a new breakaway battery old one was cactus connected breakaway battery back up at 3pm not expecting any change, after holding at 12.9v for day and a half, over night the voltage dropped to 12.5v at 8am this morn. Not expecting that, so now the search goes off on a tangent.
Craig1 said
09:15 AM Sep 28, 2021
If you the breakaway charge switch on "charge from battery?" it will suck out of house battery
iana said
10:07 AM Sep 28, 2021
I think you need to put some solar into the batteries, I usually don't let ours get below 12.5. What do you mean the search goes off on a tangent ?
Peter_n_Margaret said
11:07 AM Sep 28, 2021
12.5V is about 75% charged when at rest.
If you are discharging at 10A (from a 100Ah battery), 12.5V is about 100% charged. Cheers, Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Tuesday 28th of September 2021 11:10:38 AM
iana said
08:58 AM Sep 29, 2021
Morning report ! the suspense is killing me.
Bass said
11:07 AM Sep 29, 2021
HaHaHa.... sorry mate been sidetracked. connected the solar up at 3pm yesterday, inverter also connected, the only thing that is not electrically connected is the DEXTER anti sway unit. At about 4pm 13.9 v, after charged at 6pm 13.1v. 6am this morning 13.0v. Interestingly the only thing the the Auto elect played with was the,....... you guessed it, the Dexter anti sway unit. we're on the home straight now just gotta find where in the circut or unit the fault is.
Bass said
08:08 AM Sep 30, 2021
Well well well......Having eliminated reverse feed through the solar system, the solar was connected late yesterday and even though it was raining and cloudy the solar went straight to work, I then turned fridge on, it was draining the batteries at 4.3amps. At 7pm freezer was -15deg C , fridge was +4.5deg C. and 12.9v and 0 amp draw.... 7am this morn freezer +1.5deg C, fridge +14.8deg C RED light on fridge flashing and batteries 11.0v.
Fridge coming out and 3 way going in, THE END.
Thank all for suggestions and imput.
Gundog said
09:02 AM Sep 30, 2021
Bass wrote:
Well well well......Having eliminated reverse feed through the solar system, the solar was connected late yesterday and even though it was raining and cloudy the solar went straight to work, I then turned fridge on, it was draining the batteries at 4.3amps. At 7pm freezer was -15deg C , fridge was +4.5deg C. and 12.9v and 0 amp draw.... 7am this morn freezer +1.5deg C, fridge +14.8deg C RED light on fridge flashing and batteries 11.0v. Fridge coming out and 3 way going in, THE END. Thank all for suggestions and imput.
Going 3 way is a big backward step, 3 ways have their issues as well when running off a batteries.
The alternative to caravan fridges is Digital Inverter home fridges, about 5 years ago I removed our under performing 3 way. I fitted a Samsung 228l Digital Inverter fridge, there was some minor changes to the enclosure to fit the fridge. Items required for the change over new fridge, 350va Inverter, 6B&S cable, Change over switch (for switching from 240v to 12v via inverter), Child proof locks as travel locks total conversion under $600.
Pitfalls : maximum fridge width enty door width, removal of old fridge which was wider than the door, had to go through a window.
I ran a amp hour test over 72 hours with only a 100watt solar panel recharging the battery, an average of 65ah per day in January with average daily temps peaking at 35 deg ( Van in full sun no shade) The remainder of the van was running off 240v during the test.
Can you put an inline watt/amp metre to the fridge and check the draw. If the batteries are good and fully charged there must be a hell of a current draw somewhere to flatten them.
I only have 320 watts of solar and this is usually enough.
I hope this is of some help.
We have 2 x 120 batteries with 3 x 150 solar panels and 210lt Evakool compressor fridge. After 5yrs of this set up we have never experienced any issues, most mornings, summer or winter with good sun, batteries are as low as 12.2vlts. Never have they been below 12vlt after watching tv(sometimes sat tv setup, so running sat box as well) lights and water pumps running for 2 people showering of an evening.
So you do have a issue, not telling you something you are not aware off, hey
.
First up, yours, 13.2vlts at 8pm of an evening sounds high, mine as soon as the sun sets quickly drops to about 12.7(8)vlts which I believe is what a 12vlt battery sits on when fully charged? Yours at 13.2vlt sounds very high, but with 2 X 200 size batteries, which are enormous really, I am not sure what they should be sitting on when fully charged
All working with 2 x 200 batteries and 480solar you should be flying
I am NO sparky, but it sounds to me as if something is using up all this power somewhere, it can't just dissappear into the wilderness, or maybe 1 battery is faulty??It can happen, even with new batteries!
I think your only choice is to find a recommended sparky and leave it with him overnight so he can see exactly what it is doing
Don't go backwards to a 3way, they can give you problems as well, you have a good setup you just need to persist and find the problem.
Hang in there and good luck mate
Ian
-- Edited by Wanda on Sunday 26th of September 2021 09:28:20 AM
Have a cup of tea.
Physically disconnect everything. Charge batteries. Disconnect charger. Measure voltage regularly as best you can for a 24 hour period with nothing connected.
You will have some sort of benchmark for the batteries.
Only connect the fridge, not via existing cable as there maybe some issue there.
Measure batteries voltage both with & without the compressor running regularly until the fridge will not run.
If you have an amp metre or DC clampmeter measure amps as well.
Once you have put all this data on a speadspread or back of an envelope.
Then we can hopefully narrow down the issue.
No doubt the solar panels are charging the batteries through a solar controller. There is no need for a diode. The controller does not work backwards and will not pass power back to the panel.
Why do you keep harping on about the black box/module? He most likely does not have one. Waeco/Dometic electric caravan fridges have had a 240 V input for yonks. It is only the very old ones that are 12/24 V only. Look on P39 of the attachment.
Gee Pete, I know I have to stop my harping, that post entered on the Thu Oct 10 05:29 2019, and one earlier than that must be causing folks like you grief, goodness two posts in 2 years, Much too many. I had a read of the PDF document, same type of fridge as ours, although ours is bigger being an RPD-215. I could not see any 240v connection, but it has the same 12-24v DC connection as ours. There was however no mention of the (will write softly here) 240vac converter, so perhaps you could point out on those instructions where the 240vac connection is. Ours did come with the converter, and is one year older than Basses.
Others and myself are trying to suggest where the power is going, solar panels do work in reverse at night, but as you so rightly say that should be stopped at the regulator. Maybe you could help by posting some helpful suggestions.
Are they 200amp or 260amp and what you have 2 of them?
Are you running lithium or AGM type?
They are seriously big batteries if running AGM, can you get them that big!!How much do they each weigh??
Have they been badged correctly?
Ian
So.... Disconnected solar and electrically connected every thing else except heater that was at 12 midday at the moment battery voltage is 13.2v every thing is turned off. see how we go.
A test with a "staggering amount of load" on the batteries is a useless test. They are not being used for cranking.
You need to put an accurately known load of (say) 20A on them (separately) and measure the voltage every hour until they are flat to establish their capacity in Ahrs.
Cheers,
Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Sunday 26th of September 2021 05:03:15 PM
This is the best way to isolate the issue I think. Kiss. Guessing you have a short some where.
A DC clampmeter could save a whole lot of time.
https://www.jaycar.com.au/600a-true-rms-ac-dc-clamp-meter/p/QM1632
I have a Kyoritsu 2046R & would be completely lost without it.
12.5V is about 75% charged when at rest.
If you are discharging at 10A (from a 100Ah battery), 12.5V is about 100% charged.
Cheers,
Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Tuesday 28th of September 2021 11:10:38 AM
Fridge coming out and 3 way going in, THE END.
Thank all for suggestions and imput.
Going 3 way is a big backward step, 3 ways have their issues as well when running off a batteries.
The alternative to caravan fridges is Digital Inverter home fridges, about 5 years ago I removed our under performing 3 way. I fitted a Samsung 228l Digital Inverter fridge, there was some minor changes to the enclosure to fit the fridge. Items required for the change over new fridge, 350va Inverter, 6B&S cable, Change over switch (for switching from 240v to 12v via inverter), Child proof locks as travel locks total conversion under $600.
Pitfalls : maximum fridge width enty door width, removal of old fridge which was wider than the door, had to go through a window.
I ran a amp hour test over 72 hours with only a 100watt solar panel recharging the battery, an average of 65ah per day in January with average daily temps peaking at 35 deg ( Van in full sun no shade) The remainder of the van was running off 240v during the test.