I started this thread with a simple question about how one deals with the 15 to 10 amp issues with RVs. I know the regulations, (AS/NZ 3001 ---). I have been involved in the industry and the legalities of the subject and spent time and money seeking legal advice. All I was asking was for a solution. I didn't seek to start a slinging match between those who don't know, those who think they know and those who know. All I wanted to know was a solution. I found the answer with the Amfibian unit. Bunning's is now $118.00 richer.
And to those who moan about this subject being old hat then too bad. Get over it. Remember that there are always new folks looking for answers to what you may consider a dumb question. And before anyone thinks I don't know %#$& I bought my first motorhome back in the early 90's. Since then I have owner 4 motorhomes. 2 for 15 years in the USA and 2 here in Australia since 2002.
Any wonder forums die when a simple question becomes a slinging match.
Corndoggy said
12:15 PM Dec 14, 2019
And good for you. You asked, you found the answer and you did the wise thing and went out and got the appropriate lead. Unfortunately there are some with no idea, and I mean no idea, giving out information that people looking for answers my be persuaded to take. Some people cannot be told that their thinking is wrong. It's bad information and they have to be told so. Threads of the same topic will and do pop up on all forums. Don't have a problem with that. And whilst you can get several different ways to answer , that all can be correct, wth this topic you really get one correct answer. That is the way you went.
Corndoggy said
12:28 PM Dec 14, 2019
WindyHill wrote
I didn't realise that electricity behaved differently in different parts of the world.
And it is also legal and easy to buy a automatic assult rifle just about everywhere in America. Does that mean I can run down the shop and buy one here. They also drive on the other side of the road, can i do that here?
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 12:30:04 PM
rgren2 said
12:29 PM Dec 14, 2019
Lot of bored old farts on here with too much time on their hands. Mine was the first reply, its what I use under an upturned bucket on a block of wood. I now have a 15 amp external power point on the house waterproof and installed by a licensed electrician.
Corndoggy said
12:38 PM Dec 14, 2019
LMAO rgen2. That link. That is what I use.
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 12:40:18 PM
rgren2 said
12:46 PM Dec 14, 2019
Interesting point, Ive known a few licensed electricians and if they change states to work in, they must get relicenced in their new state as the qualifications dont automatically switch states. Think its the same with plumbers too. Definitely with school teachers.
Jaahn said
01:18 PM Dec 14, 2019
WindyHill wrote:
Corndoggy wrote:
Totally irrelevant to what you can buy and what you can legally use in Australia . As been said, you can buy leads to connect 10a outlets to 15a socket for use that are legal in Australa. Knuckle heads want to make their own then tell others they're all good. All to save themselves money.
I didn't realise that electricity behaved differently in different parts of the world.
Hi WindyHill
It must be because we live upside down here
The US has a Laissez-faire regulation system for their trades and work in their homes and other things. I have had some experience with that and basically feel much more confident that our system is safer than theirs. Of course our basic electricity system at the outlets is at twice the voltage as well. But they also have the higher voltage for higher loads.
We might be over regulated here but when you read some of the rubbish people put on here, perhaps not Common sense is misnamed, for sure !!
Jaahn
Corndoggy said
01:25 PM Dec 14, 2019
Victoria was once said to be the hardest to get a licence and the toughest on the industry. Got know idea how that goes today. Although Australia is covered under AS/NZS standards, codes, rules, legislations, things can change between states , in saying that I've never worked outside Victoria. Licenced are issued on a state basis but there was talk about an Australian wide licence. Don't know if it happened or will happen, not something that would interest me.
Corndoggy said
01:30 PM Dec 14, 2019
And as we live in the southern hemisphere our electricity spins around the opposite way from the northern, just like or water does going down the drain.
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 01:30:58 PM
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 01:32:38 PM
oldtrack123 said
03:05 PM Dec 14, 2019
Corndoggy wrote:
And as we live in the southern hemisphere our electricity spins around the opposite way from the northern, just like or water does going down the drain.
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 01:30:58 PM
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 01:32:38 PM
Our electricity also does not go as fast as US only 50 per cycles sec compared to their 60
But is stronger 240/415v compared to their normal 110V/220v
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 14th of December 2019 03:11:53 PM
With all this concern about drawing more than 10A from a 10A outlet and patch cables being illegal because of this issue would someone please explain to me why this product is perfectly legal and available for purchase in Australia?
There are ways . But to publicly post on here where everyone can follow . Is VERY dangerous!! I would fit a 15 amp outlet and be done !! Or known water proof approved inline breaker etc .
Long Weekend said
02:32 PM Dec 15, 2019
I think where people are getting off track is that they incorrectly believe that the 10Amp to 15Amp devices INCREASE the current from 10Amp to 15Amp. Of course, that is not so - the devices prevent more than 10Amps going into equipment with 15Amp circuits.
Ampfibians and such really only allow the MECHANICAL connection of 15Amp wide earth pin plugs to 10Amp narrow earth pin sockets. Then the circuit breakers between socket and plug work to prevent more than 10Amps passing through.
Perhaps the devices should really be called ADAPTORS rather than CONVERTERS.
Murray
-- Edited by Long Weekend on Sunday 15th of December 2019 03:20:26 PM
-- Edited by laurieoz on Sunday 15th of December 2019 08:22:29 PM
Long Weekend said
08:43 PM Dec 15, 2019
Hi Laurie,
I have been using an Ampfibian for about six years. I have to confess in all that time that I never thought about it being an 'adaptor' but simply a legal requirement to connect to a house supply. So without even checking you are right - Ampfibians are adaptors.
Anyway, other people do think of these adaptors as 'converters' - like Santa's post on 12 December.
Regards,
Murray
oldtrack123 said
11:50 PM Dec 15, 2019
rgren2 wrote:
Lot of bored old farts on here with too much time on their hands. Mine was the first reply, its what I use under an upturned bucket on a block of wood. I now have a 15 amp external power point on the house waterproof and installed by a licensed electrician.
Well that was not the right answer
That one does not comply with the applicable standard
It must be a compliant fully weatherproof one
Improvised weatherproofing is not acceptable.
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Sunday 15th of December 2019 11:53:21 PM
Aus-Kiwi said
11:40 AM Dec 26, 2019
Yes its to de-rate the load for the cable, service . When its explained it ALL makes sense . These things are done due the ignorant,stupid out there . I believe in Darwin theory . But its not very PC these days .
Mike Harding said
02:42 PM Dec 26, 2019
I note that, yet again, no one has attempted to explain why this is OK but patch leads are not - bit hard is it guys:
I would think because it is for a different purpose. It seems to be the same as a double adaptor (also legal Michael), and not to allow connection of a 15 amp unit to a 10 amp outlet.
I guess your point is that using 2 items drawing over 10 amps between them will overload the plug/wiring, but that is 1) not the discussion here, and 2) doesn't appear to raise the ire of the legislators.
The fact is though Michael, despite your protestations, just like driving at 100kmh in suburban streets, patch cables are illegal, and should not be encouraged.
The Travelling Dillberries said
06:19 PM Dec 26, 2019
Mike Harding wrote:
I note that, yet again, no one has attempted to explain why this is OK but patch leads are not - bit hard is it guys:
And good for you. You asked, you found the answer and you did the wise thing and went out and got the appropriate lead. Unfortunately there are some with no idea, and I mean no idea, giving out information that people looking for answers my be persuaded to take. Some people cannot be told that their thinking is wrong. It's bad information and they have to be told so. Threads of the same topic will and do pop up on all forums. Don't have a problem with that. And whilst you can get several different ways to answer , that all can be correct, wth this topic you really get one correct answer. That is the way you went.
And it is also legal and easy to buy a automatic assult rifle just about everywhere in America. Does that mean I can run down the shop and buy one here. They also drive on the other side of the road, can i do that here?
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 12:30:04 PM
LMAO rgen2. That link. That is what I use.
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 12:40:18 PM
Hi WindyHill
It must be because we live upside down here
The US has a Laissez-faire regulation system for their trades and work in their homes and other things. I have had some experience with that and basically feel much more confident that our system is safer than theirs. Of course our basic electricity system at the outlets is at twice the voltage as well. But they also have the higher voltage for higher loads.
We might be over regulated here but when you read some of the rubbish people put on here, perhaps not
Common sense is misnamed, for sure !!
Jaahn
And as we live in the southern hemisphere our electricity spins around the opposite way from the northern, just like or water does going down the drain.
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 01:30:58 PM
-- Edited by Corndoggy on Saturday 14th of December 2019 01:32:38 PM
Our electricity also does not go as fast as US only 50 per cycles sec compared to their 60
But is stronger 240/415v compared to their normal 110V/220v
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 14th of December 2019 03:11:53 PM
History of Power Supply for those interested http://ewh.ieee.org/r10/nsw/subpages/history/electricity_in_australia.pdf
After all that:
With all this concern about drawing more than 10A from a 10A outlet
and patch cables being illegal because of this issue would someone
please explain to me why this product is perfectly legal and available
for purchase in Australia?
https://www.bunnings.com.au/arlec-5m-black-piggy-back-extension-lead_p4420180
Because one doesn't have this option.
I think where people are getting off track is that they incorrectly believe that the 10Amp to 15Amp devices INCREASE the current from 10Amp to 15Amp. Of course, that is not so - the devices prevent more than 10Amps going into equipment with 15Amp circuits.
Ampfibians and such really only allow the MECHANICAL connection of 15Amp wide earth pin plugs to 10Amp narrow earth pin sockets. Then the circuit breakers between socket and plug work to prevent more than 10Amps passing through.
Perhaps the devices should really be called ADAPTORS rather than CONVERTERS.
Murray
-- Edited by Long Weekend on Sunday 15th of December 2019 03:20:26 PM
Murray
If you look at the web site for Ampfibian they are called an ADAPTOR
not converter!
ampfibian.com.au/product/rv-plus-15a-caravan-power-adaptor/
Laurie
-- Edited by laurieoz on Sunday 15th of December 2019 08:22:29 PM
I have been using an Ampfibian for about six years. I have to confess in all that time that I never thought about it being an 'adaptor' but simply a legal requirement to connect to a house supply. So without even checking you are right - Ampfibians are adaptors.
Anyway, other people do think of these adaptors as 'converters' - like Santa's post on 12 December.
Regards,
Murray
Well that was not the right answer
That one does not comply with the applicable standard
It must be a compliant fully weatherproof one
Improvised weatherproofing is not acceptable.
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Sunday 15th of December 2019 11:53:21 PM
I note that, yet again, no one has attempted to explain why this is OK but patch leads are not - bit hard is it guys:
https://www.bunnings.com.au/arlec-5m-black-piggy-back-extension-lead_p4420180
arent they both 10 amp still
I would think because it is for a different purpose. It seems to be the same as a double adaptor (also legal Michael), and not to allow connection of a 15 amp unit to a 10 amp outlet.
I guess your point is that using 2 items drawing over 10 amps between them will overload the plug/wiring, but that is 1) not the discussion here, and 2) doesn't appear to raise the ire of the legislators.
The fact is though Michael, despite your protestations, just like driving at 100kmh in suburban streets, patch cables are illegal, and should not be encouraged.
You obviously have an opinion Mike so why don't you tell us why you think it is not different to a 10-15amp adapter.
For the same reason as a quad wall outlet. One can try & run 4 kettles but the circuit breaker will trip.
https://www.bunnings.com.au/hpm-excel-4-outlet-powerpoint_p7050007