We have been invited to stay with some friends on the far southcoast nsw Over christmas. Slight problem not sure on this part when we stay at our friends place in the motor home, can we run the van via there house power with an ordinary weather proof extension lead? or do we still need to use a 15 amp lead?
justcruisin01 said
04:24 PM Sep 29, 2009
We have done it many timeswith no trouble,normally you dont have everything turned on at the same time.I have seen alot of people carry a short lead with 15amp one end & 10amp the other for this purpose.Just need to be sensable with what you run.
milo said
07:48 PM Sep 29, 2009
we'd just have a light, heater and tv on, got cooking for gas though which is handy
dave06 said
08:01 PM Sep 29, 2009
watch the heater power milo, some heaters are 1500 watt and may just be enough to burn out your wiring, works for a while but there is a reason the manufacturers and safety mob recommend a 15 amp plug
at the very least run the plug through a r.c.d. (residual current device)
Basil Faulty said
01:58 PM Oct 2, 2009
Just be sure your load does not exceed 2400 watts which is the limit you can legally draw through a 10 map outlet and do not coil the lead up outside rather if there is lots of lead left over slake it out on the ground.
Peter_n_Margaret said
08:50 PM Oct 2, 2009
What you want to do is illegal, and for good safety reasons. The circuits in your van are designd for a 15A input cable. If you use a 10A one how do you plug it in to the 15A socket on the van? If you do this (illegally) with an adaptor and it catches fire you will say good by to insurance for the van (and maybe your friend's house too. The cable could be overloaded. It is also illegal to file the earth pin down on a 15A lead to fit into a 10A plug.
This is the only legal and approved way to do it Jonathan.
This has an additional safety devise incorporated (and that is why it costs......).
Worth having one if you need to plug into 10A.
Cheers,
Peter
Jonathan said
12:53 PM Oct 3, 2009
You're quite right Peter ..
No doubt like many others, I've got my own 'adaptors' that I made up many years ago .. but not something I'd happily promote or recommend .. While these items are rediculously pricey, folks will avoid spending the pennies to acquire one .. pity
Jon
Basil Faulty said
02:17 PM Oct 3, 2009
Ok, so why not build your own???? An appropriate RCD 10 amp rated is about $30, a box some lead a 10 Amp plug a 15 amp socket and bobs your uncle for around $50 tops..... Or even simpler buy an outdoor 10 amp lead with inbuilt RCD protection and replace the 10 amp socket with a 15 amp one to plug into the van. Bunnings and all electrical outlets sell these, they are a legal requirment for builders these days.... Just because someone "invents" a way to do things safely does not mean that you can't use some nouse and do the job cheaper without sacrificing safety.....
Rolly said
04:51 PM Oct 3, 2009
Basil,
Do those RCDs have a current limiting function in addition to their primary purpose of switching off the current if a short circuit is detected??
Peter_n_Margaret said
09:41 PM Oct 3, 2009
Basil Faulty wrote:
Ok, so why not build your own???? An appropriate RCD 10 amp rated is about $30, a box some lead a 10 Amp plug a 15 amp socket and bobs your uncle for around $50 tops..... Or even simpler buy an outdoor 10 amp lead with inbuilt RCD protection and replace the 10 amp socket with a 15 amp one to plug into the van. Bunnings and all electrical outlets sell these, they are a legal requirment for builders these days.... Just because someone "invents" a way to do things safely does not mean that you can't use some nouse and do the job cheaper without sacrificing safety.....
Are you a licenced electrician then Basil? Building your own is not legal if you aren't. The product that you propose is not legal, or safe and a licensed electrician won't build that for you.
Cheers, Peter
dave06 said
10:40 AM Oct 5, 2009
before we get all "knowing" about a particular subject let's just get back to the original question "can he do it" short answer "NO" dont do it, it's not safe and I wouldnt recommend it
Basils rcd would be perfectly safe and I would back Basil and his knowledge long before I would back yours peter, a lot of these "inventions", in fact 99% of them, are built in back yard sheds, most by "non technical" personell, some go on further to the market and others just sit in the shed, doesnt make them better or worse than the shop bought one,
how many recalls have there been on any particular unit so far this year from "safe" shop bought ones, I can remember no less than 4 that I have seen on electrical items, including motor vehicles built by a swag of "licensed people"
the only comment I would make is that the motorhome has already got an R.C.D. on board, all new electrical fitouts as of feb. 05? must by law have a residual current device fitted as part of the electrical process
I quite often weld off 10 amp power with my "portable" welder, I keep the current draw below 100 amps and I have never had a problem on short jobs, I would summise that the motorhome would be more than happy on 10 amp providing the draw was kept low, NO HEATER for a start
however I would still advise not to do it
Jonathan said
11:02 AM Oct 5, 2009
.. Aren't we fortunate that we are all given the opportunity to voice our own opinions .. and that we, as individuals, can choose to glean what we wish from anothers opinions ..
Jon
Basil Faulty said
05:51 PM Oct 6, 2009
Rolly wrote:
Basil,
Do those RCDs have a current limiting function in addition to their primary purpose of switching off the current if a short circuit is detected??
Short answer YES, you buy them like a circuit breaker with amperage rating to suit your needs.
Basil Faulty said
06:16 PM Oct 6, 2009
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Basil Faulty wrote:
Ok, so why not build your own???? An appropriate RCD 10 amp rated is about $30, a box some lead a 10 Amp plug a 15 amp socket and bobs your uncle for around $50 tops..... Or even simpler buy an outdoor 10 amp lead with inbuilt RCD protection and replace the 10 amp socket with a 15 amp one to plug into the van. Bunnings and all electrical outlets sell these, they are a legal requirment for builders these days.... Just because someone "invents" a way to do things safely does not mean that you can't use some nouse and do the job cheaper without sacrificing safety.....
Are you a licenced electrician then Basil? Building your own is not legal if you aren't. The product that you propose is not legal, or safe and a licensed electrician won't build that for you.
Cheers, Peter
No, I'm not a licenced sparky. Yes all 240Volt work should be done by a licenced electrician and indeed there are rules now being designed for the retail market that will prohibit the sale of all electrical fittings, switches, power points etc to anyone not licenced. Naturally Bunnings are furious about this as it will kill sales in that area..... Strictly speaking you are correct, however it may be illegal to do it but it is never prosecuted because there would be a queue stretching from Perth to Bammaga of people waiting for a sparky to put a plug on a lead if this was rigidly enforced. My problem is I tend to judge others by my own standards and skills so I made a statement that was not correct, simply because I am confident enough to make something like this I should have realised that others are not so confident and could kill themselves taking my advice. Scrap that idea everyone, if you want to make one of these up yourself take option 2 i.e. buy a 10 amp lead with the RCD/Breaker built in and replace the 10 amp socket THE END THAT PLUGS INTO THE VAN with a 15 amp socket making sure the GREEN wire goes to the earth (E) the BROWN wire goes to the active ( A) and the BLUE wire goes to the neutral (N). Remember this 15 amp socket is downstream from the 10 amp breaker so the max current that can flow through the 15 amp socket into your van is in fact only 10 amps. Illegal? so is parking not close and parrellel, or not at exactly 45 degrees when the sign so directs, and a myriad of other stupid things that we each, individually or severally do each day. Now there are escape clauses in the electrical wireing rules, one I exploit is in the manufacture of machinery, I used to make some woodworking machinery, lathes, circular saw, lathe, jointer combos; disc sanders etc and I was quite entitled to make and wire these things up as long as they were plug in, it is assumed that the RCD etc in the house wiring will protect the user. Another thing here maybe worth mentioning. Has anyone ever checked their 240 V Generator for compliance with australian standards???? And who makes the leads to plug them into a caravan??? Just because you are making your own 240 volt does not abrogate ones responsibilities under the electrical wiring rules. Its all a very grey mushy area, I was under the mistaken opinion that we were against the over governance of society, use some common sense and all will be ok....
-- Edited by Basil Faulty on Tuesday 6th of October 2009 05:26:44 PM
Hi All While Basil has given very detailed instructionson how to make up a 10<15 amp lead the real point is,it is still not an approved item under the australian standards.
Any devise connected to 240v power has to meet Australian standards, using ANY devise that has not been approved leaves the user &/or maker/supplier subject to possibly severe penalties in the case of an accident. Insurance could also be void. The Amphibian lead has standards approval.!!!, not a back yard job. It also seems that many believe that EVERY home van etc is fitted with a RCD, many older ones are not
Even posting advise such as Basil's could have problems in the case of an accident, if it could be shown that the advise led to the accident
DeBe said
11:01 PM Nov 17, 2009
Hi Basil I agree with you whole heartedly I to are very competent with 240Vwiring used to work on live mains with ETSA. But what I have found on several caravan forums it seems un wise to give any advice on electrical subjects as you will undoubtebly will be shot down. as it is asumed you are giving advice to incompetent people. Probably beter to comunicate by phone or PMS on these subjects, which i have had to do at times. there finished my rant. Cheers Daryl
The circuits in your van are designd for a 15A input cable. If you use a 10A one how do you plug it in to the 15A socket on the van? If you do this (illegally) with an adaptor and it catches fire you will say good by to insurance for the van (and maybe your friend's house too. The cable could be overloaded.
It is also illegal to file the earth pin down on a 15A lead to fit into a 10A plug.
Cheers,
Peter
Jon
No doubt like many others, I've got my own 'adaptors' that I made up many years ago .. but not something I'd happily promote or recommend ..
While these items are rediculously pricey, folks will avoid spending the pennies to acquire one .. pity
Jon
Or even simpler buy an outdoor 10 amp lead with inbuilt RCD protection and replace the 10 amp socket with a 15 amp one to plug into the van. Bunnings and all electrical outlets sell these, they are a legal requirment for builders these days....
Just because someone "invents" a way to do things safely does not mean that you can't use some nouse and do the job cheaper without sacrificing safety.....
Basil,
Do those RCDs have a current limiting function in addition to their primary purpose of switching off the current if a short circuit is detected??
Building your own is not legal if you aren't.
The product that you propose is not legal, or safe and a licensed electrician won't build that for you.
Cheers,
Peter
Jon
Strictly speaking you are correct, however it may be illegal to do it but it is never prosecuted because there would be a queue stretching from Perth to Bammaga of people waiting for a sparky to put a plug on a lead if this was rigidly enforced. My problem is I tend to judge others by my own standards and skills so I made a statement that was not correct, simply because I am confident enough to make something like this I should have realised that others are not so confident and could kill themselves taking my advice.
Scrap that idea everyone, if you want to make one of these up yourself take option 2 i.e. buy a 10 amp lead with the RCD/Breaker built in and replace the 10 amp socket THE END THAT PLUGS INTO THE VAN with a 15 amp socket making sure the GREEN wire goes to the earth (E) the BROWN wire goes to the active ( A) and the BLUE wire goes to the neutral (N). Remember this 15 amp socket is downstream from the 10 amp breaker so the max current that can flow through the 15 amp socket into your van is in fact only 10 amps. Illegal? so is parking not close and parrellel, or not at exactly 45 degrees when the sign so directs, and a myriad of other stupid things that we each, individually or severally do each day.
Now there are escape clauses in the electrical wireing rules, one I exploit is in the manufacture of machinery, I used to make some woodworking machinery, lathes, circular saw, lathe, jointer combos; disc sanders etc and I was quite entitled to make and wire these things up as long as they were plug in, it is assumed that the RCD etc in the house wiring will protect the user. Another thing here maybe worth mentioning. Has anyone ever checked their 240 V Generator for compliance with australian standards???? And who makes the leads to plug them into a caravan??? Just because you are making your own 240 volt does not abrogate ones responsibilities under the electrical wiring rules.
Its all a very grey mushy area, I was under the mistaken opinion that we were against the over governance of society, use some common sense and all will be ok....
-- Edited by Basil Faulty on Tuesday 6th of October 2009 05:26:44 PM
While Basil has given very detailed instructionson how to make up a 10<15 amp lead the real point is,it is still not an approved item under the australian standards.
Any devise connected to 240v power has to meet Australian standards, using ANY devise that has not been approved leaves the user &/or maker/supplier subject to possibly severe penalties in the case of an accident.
Insurance could also be void.
The Amphibian lead has standards approval.!!!, not a back yard job.
It also seems that many believe that EVERY home van etc is fitted with a RCD, many older ones are not
Even posting advise such as Basil's could have problems in the case of an accident, if it could be shown that the advise led to the accident