I just thought I would pass some info on as recently there has been some conjecture regarding keeping left unless overtaking...on multi lane roads.
For everyones info, if you are on a 3 lane road/highway and the speed limit is 80km/h or above, then you have to keep left unless overtaking. Now, this is where a lot of people seem to misunderstand....to keep left, means to keep left to the inside lane, or the lane closest to the edge of the roadway (commonly referred to as lane 1)
If, for example, you are th only car on a 3 lane 100km/h roadway, you must keep to lane 1. I know, it is a pain in the proverbial, but it is the law and there was recently a crack down on it in Sydney and a LOT of people received fines.
How many times are we stuck behind a slow moving vehicle in the middle lane (lane 2) ?
Bloody heaps of times
It is a law that is not always enforced by the Police, but be warned, they do now and then so a little knowledge may stop you getting a pill.
Vic, maybe pass this on in the other Forum so they can all argue and yell at one another
Firefly said
01:12 PM Jun 20, 2011
Thanks for that Dunco, I thought that was how it worked but it will be nice to inform a few who dream otherwise mate.
Cruising Granny said
03:09 PM Jun 20, 2011
I don't know what they do the the multi-lane highways in the vicinity of Sydney, but in SA it's also mandatory to travel in the left lane unless overtaking. It's very difficult to escort an oversize when a slow vehicle is in the right lane, especially when there are 3 lanes. Some people just don't think about how their actions affect other people. They just want to be in front and get there first, even it it's only to the next set of red lights. I really is all about good manners on the road, which is an endangered phenomenon.
Sheba said
03:56 PM Jun 20, 2011
That's just plain old Common Sense.
Cheers,
Sheba.
Happywanderer said
04:27 PM Jun 20, 2011
Its not commonsense to everybody Sheba. My B in L travels the Geelong to Melbourne freeway in the right hand lane regardless of any other traffic or how fast or slow he wants to go. He thinks he owns it I'm sure and everyone should get out of his way. It freaks me out.
Travel Bug said
04:31 PM Jun 20, 2011
The problem with commonsense is that it's such an uncommon commodity!
Dunco said
04:38 PM Jun 20, 2011
We all know to travel in the left hand lane when there are TWO lanes, however, there are hundreds of people who travel in the centre lane when there are 3 lanes which in essence, is NOT KEEPING LEFT unless overtaking. This is the point I am raising, not when there are only 2 lanes.
-- Edited by Dunco on Monday 20th of June 2011 04:40:02 PM
-- Edited by Dunco on Monday 20th of June 2011 04:40:16 PM
Happywanderer said
04:44 PM Jun 20, 2011
I'm sure everyone understood what you meant Dunco. I don't think anyone was thinking of a two way road, were they? Travelling in the wrong lane then and you would be going the wrong way and into traffic.
elliemike said
05:47 PM Jun 20, 2011
In the UK when the M1 was opened, when was that ?? 1960 ?? cant recall.
First Motorway and no speed limit like German Autobahns. I think Barbara Castle MP brought in the 100 MPH Limit on motorways shortly after.
I remember a policeman on the TV explaining the keep left rule.
"The M1 Motorway has only one lane and it's on the left.
The other two are Overtaking lanes only, and are there for moving past slower vehicles only.
To drive in those Overtaking lanes, you must be moving faster than the vehicles to your immediate left.
If the lane is clear to your Left you must move into that lane
It is an offence to be going slower than vehicles on your left when in these Overtaking lanes
I also think that in certain circumstances, overtaking on the left hand side of vehicles can get you booked ???
The Keep Left Rule is not realy enforced here in W.A. I will be on the Mitchell Freeway in about an hour 1630 and peak traffic. I will be sure to see a few Lane weavers through the heavy traffic. Outside lane to inside lane and back again as they see a gap open to allow them to overtake in any lane.
-- Edited by elliemike on Monday 20th of June 2011 05:55:00 PM
Dunco said
09:22 PM Jun 20, 2011
Happywanderer wrote:
I'm sure everyone understood what you meant Dunco. I don't think anyone was thinking of a two way road, were they? Travelling in the wrong lane then and you would be going the wrong way and into traffic.
Umm...no, I wasn't talking about driving on the wrong side of the road ?????
Happywanderer said
09:47 PM Jun 20, 2011
Oh, I thought you were saying two lanes as in one each way. My mistake. Whether its two lanes or 3 lanes going the same way there are people who will travel in the right lane when supposed to be in the left lane. They will never learn.
Cruising Granny said
09:56 PM Jun 20, 2011
Some vehicle owners and operators (can't call them drivers) think they pay their rego, and in the eastern states, the toll, which entitles them to drive in any damn lane they like, at any speed, usually too fast. Some also use this "logic" when confronted by an oversize load in opposite direction, claiming they paid their taxes so they have every right to be there. That's just not logic.
Vic said
10:15 PM Jun 20, 2011
Hi Gary,
If they (CF members) want to read the thread they will have to come over here mate, a few just waiting for any excuse for an argument, so will pass on that one.
My understanding in WA (the only state to do so I believe) is that as long as you are doing the speed limit in a three lane road you can travel in the two nearest the kerb, but can only use the outside lane for overtaking, not to travel in. This is what the rule book says;
3.4.2 Roads with 2 or more lanes If the speed limit that applies to a road is 90km/h or higher or there are KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING signs installed, you are not permitted to drive in the right lane of these roads unless: you are turning right or making a U turn and giving a right turn signal; you are overtaking another vehicle; the adjacent left lane is a special purpose lane such as a bus lane or bicycle lane; the left lane is a left turning lane and you are travelling straight ahead; or the other lanes are congested with traffic.
landy said
10:24 PM Jun 20, 2011
Hi elliemike, You are right about Barbara Castle but from memory she dropped the speed limit from open road right down to 70 mph. there was an obituary in our local paper declaring the death of all fast vehicles, murdered in their prime by Mrs Barbara Castle.
Barbara Castle did not have a driving licence but knew what was best for those of us that did.
The night of the new laws coming into force, the owners of many performance vehicles staged a 100 mph protest procession on the M1 motorway
Landy
Cruising Granny said
10:45 PM Jun 20, 2011
Typical politician. They make the policies they have not idea what they are doing, and are not affected by the policies they make, especially if they don't have a licence, in this case.
Dunco said
11:03 PM Jun 20, 2011
Cruising Granny....how good is your memory ?
I remember a few years back when you were stopped in a van park in Cairns and your caravan boot was stuck shut as the locking bar was broken or something...and two blokes came and helped you and we had to remove the boot lid...I was one of them .
jimsiron said
07:57 AM Jun 21, 2011
keep left unless overtaking
Keeping to the left on a multi-lane road is not only courteous to other drivers, its the law! This rule is designed to improve traffic flow on our roads and reduce driver frustration.
Drivers must stay out of the right lane when driving on a multi-lane road with a speed limit of more than 80km/h or where a Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign applies. A multi-lane road is a road with two or more marked traffic lanes in the same direction.
The exceptions to this are when a driver is turning right or making a U-turn from the centre of the road and has their right-turn indicator on, overtaking another vehicle, avoiding an obstruction, travelling where signs or arrows indicate this is allowed (such as where a Left Lane Must Turn Left sign applies and the driver is not turning left) or where traffic in other lanes is congested.
This rule only applies to the far right lane. Drivers may drive in the left and centre lanes on a road with three or more lanes in each direction, unless signs or markings on the road indicate otherwise.
A Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign applies for the length of road from the first sign until an End Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign, road markings on the surface of the road or signage indicate that the road is no longer a multi-lane road or the road ends, for example at a T-intersection or a dead end.
However, even where it is not legally necessary to keep left, it is courteous (when practical) to give other vehicles free passage past your vehicle should they desire it.
This is what you are supposed to do in Vic!
Vic said
10:33 AM Jun 21, 2011
Thanks for that Jim's iron. I normally travel in the centre lane for a number of reasons, especially if towing. On WA freeways the far left lane often turns into a turn off lane with left turn only and it can be dangerous trying to get to the centre lane if you can before the unbroken line. Slow drivers (way under the speed limit) and heavy slow moving trucks use the left hand lane and even if you pass them and come back in you usually find then you will be stuck behind others doing likewise.
Another reason is in the far left lane merging traffic coming onto the freeway sometimes do not realise that the one they are coming into is a merging lane and others force their way in even if they are way behind you before they start merging (I always give way to those ahead of me even slightly). When I am getting to a km or two before my left hand turn off I look for a spot where I can get into the far left lane safely before I get there. My experience is that the centre lane is the safest to travel in if you are doing the posted speed limit and I never travel in the far right lane at any time.
Glad you pointed that out about over east Dunco, the sooner Australia adopts standard road rules and other traffic items (eg; Rego, road markings etc) the better, but with the empire builders we have in each state I don't think it will happen in our lifetime.
Dunco said
11:17 AM Jun 21, 2011
jimsiron wrote:Drivers must stay out of the right lane when driving on a multi-lane road with a speed limit of more than 80km/h or where a Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign applies. A multi-lane road is a road with two or more marked traffic lanes in the same direction.
This rule only applies to the far right lane. Drivers may drive in the left and centre lanes on a road with three or more lanes in each direction, unless signs or markings on the road indicate otherwise.
This is what you are supposed to do in Vic!
In NSW,...that is incorrect...and that is what I am trying to get across.
When it says KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING....it means LEFT, not centre..LEFT. (On roads with more than two lanes ...going one way)
Firefly said
11:24 AM Jun 21, 2011
Be nice to see the country uniform in at least the road rules though wouldn't it.
Thanks for showing us the differences guys, you just don't realise how much some things can vary.
Dunco said
11:29 AM Jun 21, 2011
There is some conjecture to this law, so don't worry about it too mkuch as I doubt very much whether you will ever get booked....but.....it is always nice to know.
The law does state..KEEP LEFT....not KEEP CENTRE...although the right hand lane is classed as a special purpose lane (Overtaking). Just be aware and don't change too much as it is a pain in the arse to stay in the lreft lane of 3, only to keep moving into the centre lane to pass....
I do like the left lane, of 3, when towing as it saves trucks overtaking you on the nearside
elliemike said
12:05 PM Jun 21, 2011
landy wrote:
Hi elliemike, You are right about Barbara Castle but from memory she dropped the speed limit from open road right down to 70 mph. there was an obituary in our local paper declaring the death of all fast vehicles, murdered in their prime by Mrs Barbara Castle.
Barbara Castle did not have a driving licence but knew what was best for those of us that did.
The night of the new laws coming into force, the owners of many performance vehicles staged a 100 mph protest procession on the M1 motorway
The 70 mph National Speed Limit was introduced as a temporary measure in December 1965. It is often blamed on Barbara Castle, but at the time the Minister of Transport was Tom Fraser.
The reason given was a spate of serious accidents in foggy conditions, but it is often claimed that the MoT had been alarmed by AC Cars testing their latest Cobra on the M1 at speeds up to 180 mph.
It was confirmed as a permanent limit in 1967, by which time Barbara Castle (a non-driver) had become Minister of Transport. There was surprisingly little debate at the time: the fact that the average family car of the time could only just exceed 70 mph perhaps had something to do with this.
It should be noted that this limit applied to all previously "derestricted" roads, not only motorways.
All rural roads in the Isle of Man (including most of the famous TT course) remain genuinely derestricted, as a matter of interest
landy said
10:16 PM Jun 21, 2011
elliemike wrote:
landy wrote:
Hi elliemike, You are right about Barbara Castle but from memory she dropped the speed limit from open road right down to 70 mph. there was an obituary in our local paper declaring the death of all fast vehicles, murdered in their prime by Mrs Barbara Castle.
Barbara Castle did not have a driving licence but knew what was best for those of us that did.
The night of the new laws coming into force, the owners of many performance vehicles staged a 100 mph protest procession on the M1 motorway
The 70 mph National Speed Limit was introduced as a temporary measure in December 1965. It is often blamed on Barbara Castle, but at the time the Minister of Transport was Tom Fraser.
The reason given was a spate of serious accidents in foggy conditions, but it is often claimed that the MoT had been alarmed by AC Cars testing their latest Cobra on the M1 at speeds up to 180 mph.
It was confirmed as a permanent limit in 1967, by which time Barbara Castle (a non-driver) had become Minister of Transport. There was surprisingly little debate at the time: the fact that the average family car of the time could only just exceed 70 mph perhaps had something to do with this.
It should be noted that this limit applied to all previously "derestricted" roads, not only motorways.
All rural roads in the Isle of Man (including most of the famous TT course) remain genuinely derestricted, as a matter of interest
Thanks Eliemike for the extra info. Funy how you can recal things from 40 years ago when you can't remember what you had for breakfast.
Apologies to Dunco for Hijacking his thread.
Landy
Cruising Granny said
10:21 PM Jun 21, 2011
Whatever you do, do not drive on the fog line or cross over it. It's a solid white line, according to Qld Police, and you will get pinched if you get caught.
jimricho said
06:12 AM Jun 22, 2011
Where does one stand (legally) when the traffic density on a three lane road is such that all three lanes are carrying a lot of traffic, especially when the freeway resembles a slow moving parking lot? This situation is quite common on the F3 north of Sydney and many others as well.
Another situation (not as busy as the above example) is when there is traffic moving significantly slower than the speed limit in the left lane. I'd rather maintain my position in the centre lane than be constantly changing lanes to overtake the slower traffic. This often occurs when there are slow moving heavy vehicles on some of the climbs.
Obviously if one is being overtaken on the inside one should get the message that that is where they should be driving.
-- Edited by jimricho on Wednesday 22nd of June 2011 06:25:58 AM
Rip and Rosie said
09:34 AM Jun 22, 2011
My pet hate- people who overtake in the left lane !
I like to have plenty of room when I overtake, and don't like to cut in front of the vehicle I an overtaking. I usually have my move planned so that I can pull into lane 2, overtake, pull ahead a few car lengths (or more if I've go the van on the back) and then pull back into the left lane smoothly. That's how I drive cause I was taught that way. Add to that the complexities of checking mirrors and using indicators of course.
.........and then up comes some young buck, chopping and changing lanes, driving like (s)he's playing a video game!
I hate that!
Dunco said
10:04 PM Jun 22, 2011
My thoughts on most of the above is...if they annoy you, let them go and forget about them. Nothing you can do about it so don't stress. And regarding dense traffic and lanes...don't worry about it either as no one else does :)
I just thought I would pass some info on as recently there has been some conjecture regarding keeping left unless overtaking...on multi lane roads.
For everyones info, if you are on a 3 lane road/highway and the speed limit is 80km/h or above, then you have to keep left unless overtaking. Now, this is where a lot of people seem to misunderstand....to keep left, means to keep left to the inside lane, or the lane closest to the edge of the roadway (commonly referred to as lane 1)
If, for example, you are th only car on a 3 lane 100km/h roadway, you must keep to lane 1. I know, it is a pain in the proverbial, but it is the law and there was recently a crack down on it in Sydney and a LOT of people received fines.
How many times are we stuck behind a slow moving vehicle in the middle lane (lane 2) ?
Bloody heaps of times
It is a law that is not always enforced by the Police, but be warned, they do now and then so a little knowledge may stop you getting a pill.
Vic, maybe pass this on in the other Forum so they can all argue and yell at one another
Thanks for that Dunco, I thought that was how it worked but it will be nice to inform a few who dream otherwise mate.
It's very difficult to escort an oversize when a slow vehicle is in the right lane, especially when there are 3 lanes.
Some people just don't think about how their actions affect other people. They just want to be in front and get there first, even it it's only to the next set of red lights.
I really is all about good manners on the road, which is an endangered phenomenon.
That's just plain old Common Sense.
Cheers,
Sheba.
The problem with commonsense is that it's such an uncommon commodity!
We all know to travel in the left hand lane when there are TWO lanes, however, there are hundreds of people who travel in the centre lane when there are 3 lanes which in essence, is NOT KEEPING LEFT unless overtaking. This is the point I am raising, not when there are only 2 lanes.
-- Edited by Dunco on Monday 20th of June 2011 04:40:02 PM
-- Edited by Dunco on Monday 20th of June 2011 04:40:16 PM
In the UK when the M1 was opened, when was that ?? 1960 ?? cant recall.
First Motorway and no speed limit like German Autobahns. I think Barbara Castle MP brought in the 100 MPH Limit on motorways shortly after.
I remember a policeman on the TV explaining the keep left rule.
"The M1 Motorway has only one lane and it's on the left.
The other two are Overtaking lanes only, and are there for moving past slower vehicles only.
To drive in those Overtaking lanes, you must be moving faster than the vehicles to your immediate left.
If the lane is clear to your Left you must move into that lane
It is an offence to be going slower than vehicles on your left when in these Overtaking lanes
I also think that in certain circumstances, overtaking on the left hand side of vehicles can get you booked ???
The Keep Left Rule is not realy enforced here in W.A. I will be on the Mitchell Freeway in about an hour 1630 and peak traffic. I will be sure to see a few Lane weavers through the heavy traffic. Outside lane to inside lane and back again as they see a gap open to allow them to overtake in any lane.
-- Edited by elliemike on Monday 20th of June 2011 05:55:00 PM
Umm...no, I wasn't talking about driving on the wrong side of the road ?????
Whether its two lanes or 3 lanes going the same way there are people who will travel in the right lane when supposed to be in the left lane. They will never learn.
Some also use this "logic" when confronted by an oversize load in opposite direction, claiming they paid their taxes so they have every right to be there. That's just not logic.
If they (CF members) want to read the thread they will have to come over here mate, a few just waiting for any excuse for an argument, so will pass on that one.
My understanding in WA (the only state to do so I believe) is that as long as you are doing the speed limit in a three lane road you can travel in the two nearest the kerb, but can only use the outside lane for overtaking, not to travel in. This is what the rule book says;
3.4.2 Roads with 2 or more lanes
If the speed limit that applies to a road is 90km/h or higher or there are KEEP LEFT
UNLESS OVERTAKING signs installed, you are not permitted to drive in the right lane
of these roads unless:
you are turning right or making a U turn and giving a right turn signal;
you are overtaking another vehicle;
the adjacent left lane is a special purpose lane such as a bus lane or bicycle lane;
the left lane is a left turning lane and you are travelling straight ahead; or
the other lanes are congested with traffic.
Hi elliemike, You are right about Barbara Castle but from memory she dropped the speed limit from open road right down to 70 mph. there was an obituary in our local paper declaring the death of all fast vehicles, murdered in their prime by Mrs Barbara Castle.
Barbara Castle did not have a driving licence but knew what was best for those of us that did.
The night of the new laws coming into force, the owners of many performance vehicles staged a 100 mph protest procession on the M1 motorway
Landy
Cruising Granny....how good is your memory ?
I remember a few years back when you were stopped in a van park in Cairns and your caravan boot was stuck shut as the locking bar was broken or something...and two blokes came and helped you and we had to remove the boot lid...I was one of them .
keep left unless overtaking
Keeping to the left on a multi-lane road is not only courteous to other drivers, its the law! This rule is designed to improve traffic flow on our roads and reduce driver frustration.
Drivers must stay out of the right lane when driving on a multi-lane road with a speed limit of more than 80km/h or where a Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign applies. A multi-lane road is a road with two or more marked traffic lanes in the same direction.
The exceptions to this are when a driver is turning right or making a U-turn from the centre of the road and has their right-turn indicator on, overtaking another vehicle, avoiding an obstruction, travelling where signs or arrows indicate this is allowed (such as where a Left Lane Must Turn Left sign applies and the driver is not turning left) or where traffic in other lanes is congested.
This rule only applies to the far right lane. Drivers may drive in the left and centre lanes on a road with three or more lanes in each direction, unless signs or markings on the road indicate otherwise.
A Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign applies for the length of road from the first sign until an End Keep Left Unless Overtaking sign, road markings on the surface of the road or signage indicate that the road is no longer a multi-lane road or the road ends, for example at a T-intersection or a dead end.
However, even where it is not legally necessary to keep left, it is courteous (when practical) to give other vehicles free passage past your vehicle should they desire it.
Another reason is in the far left lane merging traffic coming onto the freeway sometimes do not realise that the one they are coming into is a merging lane and others force their way in even if they are way behind you before they start merging (I always give way to those ahead of me even slightly). When I am getting to a km or two before my left hand turn off I look for a spot where I can get into the far left lane safely before I get there. My experience is that the centre lane is the safest to travel in if you are doing the posted speed limit and I never travel in the far right lane at any time.
Glad you pointed that out about over east Dunco, the sooner Australia adopts standard road rules and other traffic items (eg; Rego, road markings etc) the better, but with the empire builders we have in each state I don't think it will happen in our lifetime.
In NSW,...that is incorrect...and that is what I am trying to get across.
When it says KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING....it means LEFT, not centre..LEFT. (On roads with more than two lanes ...going one way)
Thanks for showing us the differences guys, you just don't realise how much some things can vary.
There is some conjecture to this law, so don't worry about it too mkuch as I doubt very much whether you will ever get booked....but.....it is always nice to know.
The law does state..KEEP LEFT....not KEEP CENTRE...although the right hand lane is classed as a special purpose lane (Overtaking). Just be aware and don't change too much as it is a pain in the arse to stay in the lreft lane of 3, only to keep moving into the centre lane to pass....
I do like the left lane, of 3, when towing as it saves trucks overtaking you on the nearside
When was the 70 mph motorway speed limit introduced in Britain?
The 70 mph National Speed Limit was introduced as a temporary measure in December 1965. It is often blamed on Barbara Castle, but at the time the Minister of Transport was Tom Fraser.
The reason given was a spate of serious accidents in foggy conditions, but it is often claimed that the MoT had been alarmed by AC Cars testing their latest Cobra on the M1 at speeds up to 180 mph.
It was confirmed as a permanent limit in 1967, by which time Barbara Castle (a non-driver) had become Minister of Transport. There was surprisingly little debate at the time: the fact that the average family car of the time could only just exceed 70 mph perhaps had something to do with this.
It should be noted that this limit applied to all previously "derestricted" roads, not only motorways.
All rural roads in the Isle of Man (including most of the famous TT course) remain genuinely derestricted, as a matter of interest
Thanks Eliemike for the extra info. Funy how you can recal things from 40 years ago when you can't remember what you had for breakfast.
Apologies to Dunco for Hijacking his thread.
Landy
Where does one stand (legally) when the traffic density on a three lane road is such that all three lanes are carrying a lot of traffic, especially when the freeway resembles a slow moving parking lot? This situation is quite common on the F3 north of Sydney and many others as well.
Another situation (not as busy as the above example) is when there is traffic moving significantly slower than the speed limit in the left lane. I'd rather maintain my position in the centre lane than be constantly changing lanes to overtake the slower traffic. This often occurs when there are slow moving heavy vehicles on some of the climbs.
Obviously if one is being overtaken on the inside one should get the message that that is where they should be driving.
-- Edited by jimricho on Wednesday 22nd of June 2011 06:25:58 AM
I like to have plenty of room when I overtake, and don't like to cut in front of the vehicle I an overtaking. I usually have my move planned so that I can pull into lane 2, overtake, pull ahead a few car lengths (or more if I've go the van on the back) and then pull back into the left lane smoothly. That's how I drive cause I was taught that way. Add to that the complexities of checking mirrors and using indicators of course.
.........and then up comes some young buck, chopping and changing lanes, driving like (s)he's playing a video game!
I hate that!