This is how discussions get heated. This is what I mean by lowering expectations. Nobody forced you to buy a caravan that doesn't fit in a normal carpark. To me, these things should have been discussed before buying and planning anything. Why don't people have the 'foresite' to look into these things before purchasing? In all these discussions it always seems that some people are saying what the councils should and should not do but I never hear about what 'we' can do to help councils.
jules47 wrote:
We can only hope that more towns have the forsight to plan for "grey nomads" of the future, and make allowances for us - there is nothing worse than arriving in a town, and being unable to find a place with enough room for us to park, so we can shop and look around - gets frustrating, and sometimes we just keep on moving through.
-- Edited by gordon_adl on Saturday 8th of December 2012 02:12:50 PM
Pejay said
05:48 PM Dec 8, 2012
When it comes to finding a parking spot in a town, we usually head for the back streets, and look on the walk as exercise - let's face it, we have been sitting on our butts for a few hours in the car, so the exercise is good, then between us, we carry the things back to the car/van, and call this our weight bearing exercises!!!!
Edited 'cause dumb 'puta can't spell!!
-- Edited by Pejay on Saturday 8th of December 2012 05:49:23 PM
the rocket said
08:29 PM Dec 8, 2012
I may be wrong but I do not see an explosion of grey nomads in a few years time. Lots of nomads now will choose to settle in maybe a house or flat because they have done what they wanted to do and the vast majority of retirees will never buy a caravan and if they do it will be for the lap or maybe a year or two on holidays. Heaps more options now ie. cruise ships and cheap overseas holidays. maybe a few more on the road but that's all I expect.
It may be proved in time that I was wrong but that's my opinion now. cheers.
-- Edited by the rocket on Saturday 8th of December 2012 08:31:44 PM
Yuglamron said
09:51 PM Dec 8, 2012
I was testing the old grey cells the other day after wondering where to go over the Xmas school holidays.
I am not knocking people with kids who book out the major Van/holiday parks and push up the prices during holiday periods.We all do our own thing then and resume our travels when it quietens down.
I was wondering how it will be in the next five years or so when it is projected that lots of the "Baby Boomer' generation retire. Obviously there will be far more people on the big lap and the pressure on the freecamps and lowcost sites will increase.The modern van and Motorhomes are getting more and more self contained.
There are councils out there looking at the bigger picture and setting up low cost sites,eg Beerwah on the Qld Sunshine coast.
Seems to me that lots of councils need a little push in the right direction to look at the future needs of the GN and travelling community.
Any thoughts on the subject?
jules47 said
09:57 PM Dec 8, 2012
They sure do - we are in Tassy at the moment, for five months, and some towns are a lot more "friendly" than others. Stopped at Rosebery, had a nice breakfast, visited the grocery store, bought some necessary items - probably spent $50 in the town, then had the use of their dump point and filled our water tank, and used their public loo (very clean) - services like this are appreciated, so we will spend our money in these towns.
We can only hope that more towns have the forsight to plan for "grey nomads" of the future, and make allowances for us - there is nothing worse than arriving in a town, and being unable to find a place with enough room for us to park, so we can shop and look around - gets frustrating, and sometimes we just keep on moving through.
gordon_adl said
10:06 PM Dec 8, 2012
I think both sides are going to have to learn to compromise. Caravan groups threatening boycotts and other actions are not going to endear themselves to small country councils. I think expectations of what gn's are entitled to need to be lowered. On the other side, there should be camping alternatives to paying top dollar for the big chain caravan parks. If the councils have available property a low budget ground with basic amenities could be built. But one needs to remember budget sites offer budget amenities.
Brenda and Alan said
10:47 PM Dec 8, 2012
Gordon, even small vans (ours is 18ft) can find it hard to get somewhere to park while they shop and look around before going onto the caravan park or free camping spot. It's nice when you see a sign saying, for example, "caravan parking next left" because you know you are welcome in that town.
jules47 said
11:07 PM Dec 8, 2012
gordon_adl wrote:
This is how discussions get heated. This is what I mean by lowering expectations. Nobody forced you to buy a caravan that doesn't fit in a normal carpark. To me, these things should have been discussed before buying and planning anything. Why don't people have the 'foresite' to look into these things before purchasing? In all these discussions it always seems that some people are saying what the councils should and should not do but I never hear about what 'we' can do to help councils.
jules47 wrote:
We can only hope that more towns have the forsight to plan for "grey nomads" of the future, and make allowances for us - there is nothing worse than arriving in a town, and being unable to find a place with enough room for us to park, so we can shop and look around - gets frustrating, and sometimes we just keep on moving through.
-- Edited by gordon_adl on Saturday 8th of December 2012 02:12:50 PM
Gordon - firstly we are in a motor home - so it is a bit easier to park than a caravan - and the forsight was having a motorhome instead of a caravan, for parking reasons partly. Don't wish to induce a heated discussion - far from it - we appreciate the facilities offered to us by various councils around the country, and support these places and the nearby towns.
It is a conundrum to me that manufacturers are making caravans, motorhomes etc, self sufficient, and then we have to almost plead to have somewhere to park them at no, or at least a very small cost. There is no point in having a totally self sufficient "home", and paying to park in a caravan park to use their facilities - am I wrong?
As for "helping" councils - I have paid council rates for the last 40f.....g years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
gordon_adl said
11:07 PM Dec 8, 2012
I agree is it nice and there are plenty of councils that do provide that. If a council has the funds to do this than fantastic. But if they don't, I don't think it's fair to call such places anti gn's and provoke them with boycotts and other threatening actions. Also, any place I've ever been, i've been able to find parking a short walk away. Some places can afford this luxury and some cannot. To me, it's about compromising and lowering expectations and also looking at other people's points of view. I don't see the sense in badmouthing councils just because someone couldn't camp for free and or cheap and couldn't find a spot to park a caravan in the centre of town.
Just because someplaces do not provide services you are after does not mean they provided bad service to you. I'd say places like that are just not compatible with our life styles and one just moves on.
Brenda and Alan wrote:
Gordon, even small vans (ours is 18ft) can find it hard to get somewhere to park while they shop and look around before going onto the caravan park or free camping spot. It's nice when you see a sign saying, for example, "caravan parking next left" because you know you are welcome in that town.
gordon_adl said
11:17 PM Dec 8, 2012
jules47 wrote: Gordon - firstly we are in a motor home - so it is a bit easier to park than a caravan - and the forsight was having a motorhome instead of a caravan, for parking reasons partly. Don't wish to induce a heated discussion - far from it - we appreciate the facilities offered to us by various councils around the country, and support these places and the nearby towns.
Excellent idea to support the councils that provide these services. Ie read my statements below about that idea.
It is a conundrum to me that manufacturers are making caravans, motorhomes etc, self sufficient, and then we have to almost plead to have somewhere to park them at no, or at least a very small cost. There is no point in having a totally self sufficient "home", and paying to park in a caravan park to use their facilities - am I wrong?
Yes, you're wrong :) It's not the councils fault that caravan mfr's are making units bigger and more self sufficient. One can easily blame the makers for being greedy and making units bigger than really needed. Again it's about compromise and lowering expectations. I feel I need to remind people I'm all for free camping. But it's when people on here resort to name calling and abusing councils for not providing these services that annoy me.
As for "helping" councils - I have paid council rates for the last 40f.....g years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
To me this is just a silly statement. Everyone has paid council fees and taxes. But paying fees in location A does not mean you get anything in location B.
jules47 said
11:48 PM Dec 8, 2012
Sorry Gordon, I don't wish to "lower my expectations" - and I realise that paying rates in one area does not equate to another area - I am not a stupid person!
I realise it is my choice to live on the road full time, and I am not asking for any assistance in doing so - we live on a budget, and our budget does not cover caravan parks at an average of $35 per night - maybe caravan parks could do like they have done at George Town Low Head CP, here in Tassy, and have low cost areas available - they have an area with no power for $12 per night per van - you have the use of the showers and toilets, and free wi fi I might add - ok, as someone said the area is not in the best position in the park, but hey - a lot of free camps are not in the best spots either - we camped in an old quarry last night with no facilities.
Also, in any of the posts above, I don't see anyone "name calling".
gordon_adl said
12:11 AM Dec 9, 2012
jules47 wrote:
Sorry Gordon, I don't wish to "lower my expectations"
You just did lower your expectations. Your statement below about the georgetown cp is a perfect example of this.
- and I realise that paying rates in one area does not equate to another area - I am not a stupid person!
I never said you were stupid? Where did that assumption come from? But you're telling me you understand about rates yet you're complaining about rates that you paid in a different council?
I realise it is my choice to live on the road full time, and I am not asking for any assistance in doing so - we live on a budget, and our budget does not cover caravan parks at an average of $35 per night - maybe caravan parks could do like they have done at George Town Low Head CP, here in Tassy, and have low cost areas available - they have an area with no power for $12 per night per van - you have the use of the showers and toilets, and free wi fi I might add - ok, as someone said the area is not in the best position in the park, but hey - a lot of free camps are not in the best spots either - we camped in an old quarry last night with no facilities.
I whole heartedly agree with you with that statement. That is a perfect example of compromising and lowering expectations. You were happy to be charged less but in return you didn't get the prime real estate area of the park. This is the very definition of 'compromise'.
Also, in any of the posts above, I don't see anyone "name calling".
I'm not refering to this particular thread. But in other threads the terms 'cancerous' and other very slanderous terms have been used.
Name calling, threats and boycotts are not the way to introduce a medium.
billeeeeeee said
12:29 AM Dec 9, 2012
Howdyeeee all u Nutty Nomads, my two cents worth, We have been in Tassie for 38 days ,spent on fuel~~food, $1100.. spent 2 nights in C park, $60,,,,free camping the rest,...........38 days in a caravan park, would have cost us ,$1140, am on,. a pension..could not have seen Tassie on a pension ,alone......sooooooooo i guess, us pensioners should get a Gov housing flat , and wait to die ,,,,,,or!!!! use free camps,,, Yippeeeee!!!! to all them Councils who do!!! the decent thing ,, and i hope the rest of the backwards thinking ppl who r draging this Country down , and this Form, who r not excited,or enjoying life,or,, enjoy this beautiful Australia, all they can do is bag everthing,get out there and get Happy!!!!!!! Well Nomads just a minute or two of wot goes on in my mindhehehe...........PS.. U can choose to b happy ,,b my guest,,,...Billeeeeeeeeee
I agree. There just isn't sense in bagging places that don't provide for gn's. Just move on if you don't like a place and be happy.
billeeeeeee wrote:
who r not excited,or enjoying life,or,, enjoy this beautiful Australia, all they can do is bag everthing,get out there and get Happy!!!!!!!
gordon_adl said
01:55 AM Dec 9, 2012
Completely agree.
Pejay wrote:
When it comes to finding a parking spot in a town, we usually head for the back streets, and look on the walk as exercise - let's face it, we have been sitting on our butts for a few hours in the car, so the exercise is good, then between us, we carry the things back to the car/van, and call this our weight bearing exercises!!!!
Edited 'cause dumb 'puta can't spell!!
-- Edited by Pejay on Saturday 8th of December 2012 05:49:23 PM
jimricho said
02:13 AM Dec 9, 2012
Pejay wrote:
Edited 'cause dumb 'puta can't spell!!
-- Edited by Pejay on Saturday 8th of December 2012 05:49:23 PM
Thats watt spell chequers are four! wye dont yew ewes it!
Helena said
06:44 AM Dec 9, 2012
I think the explosion has already started we travelled from Adelaide through the middle up to Darwin then across to Broome down the coast road to Perth then across the Nullabour home we found that if you didn't pull into a free camp by about 2pm you had trouble getting a spot quite a few came in later than that and had to move further down the road to try to get in somewhere. Two years ago we could stay on the road until about 4pm before we had to make camp and we only have a small A'Van Sportsliner so don't need a lot of room. Have a great day every one Helena. Sorry didn't mean to put it up twice.
-- Edited by Helena on Sunday 9th of December 2012 06:45:03 AM
Helena said
02:39 PM Dec 9, 2012
I think the explosion has already started we went through the middle up to Darwin across to Broome then down the coast road to Perth then onto the Nullabour home to Adelaide and we found that in the free camps you had to get in by about 2pm otherwise they were crowded out in fact some people couldn't get in and had to try further down the road. Yet when we went away two years ago could stay on the road til around 4pm before we thought of camping. This was our experience anyway. Helena.
biggles said
03:21 PM Dec 9, 2012
the rocket wrote:
I may be wrong but I do not see an explosion of grey nomads in a few years time. Lots of nomads now will choose to settle in maybe a house or flat because they have done what they wanted to do and the vast majority of retirees will never buy a caravan and if they do it will be for the lap or maybe a year or two on holidays. Heaps more options now ie. cruise ships and cheap overseas holidays. maybe a few more on the road but that's all I expect.
It may be proved in time that I was wrong but that's my opinion now. cheers.
.. I tend to agree with the Rocket .. the last place I suffered over-crowding in a free-camp situation was over 2 years ago. A lot has to do with your own experience and planning and, of course, your mode of travel !
Naturally I prefer to freecamp but often I will stay at CP's for up to a month .. some reasons being is that I might enjoy the location and frequently the 3rd week is free .. and don't forget that if travelling as a solo, that you should always 'bargain' for the best price on offer .. If a fulltime traveller and you find yourself back at that venue another time, even further discounting is quite possible and /or other benefits that you may not have expected are available .. Its quite amazing how 'attitude' shared can be a such a positive !
If numbers do increase, then one adapts accordingly ..
Jon
Gerty Dancer said
09:14 PM Dec 9, 2012
Helena wrote:
I think the explosion has already started we went through the middle up to Darwin across to Broome then down the coast road to Perth then onto the Nullabour home to Adelaide and we found that in the free camps you had to get in by about 2pm otherwise they were crowded out in fact some people couldn't get in and had to try further down the road. Yet when we went away two years ago could stay on the road til around 4pm before we thought of camping. This was our experience anyway. Helena.
We had the same experience in 2011 Helena, we ended up staying in caravan parks more often, as at least there you get a whole site and people dont park themselves a couple of feet away from your door.
Mr B2 said
10:27 PM Dec 9, 2012
I have a fully self contained Mobile home, Once I put Solar on the roof, I dont need a caravan park for any thing,
I can park my Bus up the back of a Supermarket car park, Industrial area, Back street and none would be the wiser, Unless I started to put deck chairs outside it,
I can park on the side of the road in a truck stop, beside a creek or river, down the beach, When I leave, the only trace I have been there are my wheel tracks and four indentations where my self levers have hit the ground, Any rubbish I have, I take it with me,
I have Fresh water, Grey water, and Black water tanks on board, I have a flushing Dunny, shower and bath, Full kitchen, and a garbage compactor, which all can be emptied at those Various council disposal places,
I pay rates in the shire of Yarra Ranges for my house, The Shire of Yarra Ranges also covers the Mt Dandenong and Yarra Valley Tourist area's, which my rates also help to pay for, People come from allover the world to stay in the Yarra Valley and Dandenong Ranges, It puts money into the economy, I dont object to that, My rates going towards tourists,
Councils do need to realize that travellors of all kinds do need some money spent towards them if they want the extra income from travellors, It does work towards the local economy of all these places,
Travellors still need fuel, Food, and spending on the local tourist attractions, Thats why they have gone there, to see the local attractions, No matter how they travel, or what mode of conveyance they used to get there,
Councils that make too hard for the travellors, the word does get out, We all have the internet these days, so we just avoid the places where the councils are being hard on travellors, so they miss out on the income that travellors bring, Then its their loss,
They do need to look at the bigger picture,
We have some of the best Motorcycling roads in Australia here, The police have been cracking down on Motor cyclists here for the last few years, The thousands of Bike riders have all gone else where to ride because of it, and now the traders are feeling the pinch of no income from them, Its a tourist area, no tourists, no income, Motor cyclists spent a lot of money up there on the weekends, They are Tourists, Its now gone else where,
Motor cycling Forums have done that, Passing the word,
-- Edited by gordon_adl on Saturday 8th of December 2012 02:12:50 PM
When it comes to finding a parking spot in a town, we usually head for the back streets, and look on the walk as exercise - let's face it, we have been sitting on our butts for a few hours in the car, so the exercise is good, then between us, we carry the things back to the car/van, and call this our weight bearing exercises!!!!
Edited 'cause dumb 'puta can't spell!!
-- Edited by Pejay on Saturday 8th of December 2012 05:49:23 PM
I may be wrong but I do not see an explosion of grey nomads in a few years time. Lots of nomads now will choose to settle in maybe a house or flat because they have done what they wanted to do and the vast majority of retirees will never buy a caravan and if they do it will be for the lap or maybe a year or two on holidays. Heaps more options now ie. cruise ships and cheap overseas holidays. maybe a few more on the road but that's all I expect.
It may be proved in time that I was wrong but that's my opinion now. cheers.
-- Edited by the rocket on Saturday 8th of December 2012 08:31:44 PM
I was testing the old grey cells the other day after wondering where to go over the Xmas school holidays.
I am not knocking people with kids who book out the major Van/holiday parks and push up the prices during holiday periods.We all do our own thing then and resume our travels when it quietens down.
I was wondering how it will be in the next five years or so when it is projected that lots of the "Baby Boomer' generation retire. Obviously there will be far more people on the big lap and the pressure on the freecamps and lowcost sites will increase.The modern van and Motorhomes are getting more and more self contained.
There are councils out there looking at the bigger picture and setting up low cost sites,eg Beerwah on the Qld Sunshine coast.
Seems to me that lots of councils need a little push in the right direction to look at the future needs of the GN and travelling community.
Any thoughts on the subject?
We can only hope that more towns have the forsight to plan for "grey nomads" of the future, and make allowances for us - there is nothing worse than arriving in a town, and being unable to find a place with enough room for us to park, so we can shop and look around - gets frustrating, and sometimes we just keep on moving through.
Gordon - firstly we are in a motor home - so it is a bit easier to park than a caravan - and the forsight was having a motorhome instead of a caravan, for parking reasons partly. Don't wish to induce a heated discussion - far from it - we appreciate the facilities offered to us by various councils around the country, and support these places and the nearby towns.
It is a conundrum to me that manufacturers are making caravans, motorhomes etc, self sufficient, and then we have to almost plead to have somewhere to park them at no, or at least a very small cost. There is no point in having a totally self sufficient "home", and paying to park in a caravan park to use their facilities - am I wrong?
As for "helping" councils - I have paid council rates for the last 40f.....g years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I realise it is my choice to live on the road full time, and I am not asking for any assistance in doing so - we live on a budget, and our budget does not cover caravan parks at an average of $35 per night - maybe caravan parks could do like they have done at George Town Low Head CP, here in Tassy, and have low cost areas available - they have an area with no power for $12 per night per van - you have the use of the showers and toilets, and free wi fi I might add - ok, as someone said the area is not in the best position in the park, but hey - a lot of free camps are not in the best spots either - we camped in an old quarry last night with no facilities.
Also, in any of the posts above, I don't see anyone "name calling".
Howdyeeee all u Nutty Nomads, my two cents worth, We have been in Tassie for 38 days ,spent on fuel~~food, $1100.. spent 2 nights in C park, $60,,,,free camping the rest,...........38 days in a caravan park, would have cost us ,$1140, am on,. a pension..could not have seen Tassie on a pension ,alone......sooooooooo i guess, us pensioners should get a Gov housing flat , and wait to die ,,,,,,or!!!! use free camps,,, Yippeeeee!!!! to all them Councils who do!!! the decent thing ,, and i hope the rest of the backwards thinking ppl who r draging this Country down , and this Form, who r not excited,or enjoying life,or,, enjoy this beautiful Australia, all they can do is bag everthing,get out there and get Happy!!!!!!! Well Nomads just a minute or two of wot goes on in my mindhehehe...........PS.. U can choose to b happy ,,b my guest,,,...Billeeeeeeeeee
Thats watt spell chequers are four! wye dont yew ewes it!
I think the explosion has already started we travelled from Adelaide through the middle up to Darwin then across to Broome down the coast road to Perth then across the Nullabour home we found that if you didn't pull into a free camp by about 2pm you had trouble getting a spot quite a few came in later than that and had to move further down the road to try to get in somewhere. Two years ago we could stay on the road until about 4pm before we had to make camp and we only have a small A'Van Sportsliner so don't need a lot of room. Have a great day every one Helena. Sorry didn't mean to put it up twice.
-- Edited by Helena on Sunday 9th of December 2012 06:45:03 AM
I think the explosion has already started we went through the middle up to Darwin across to Broome then down the coast road to Perth then onto the Nullabour home to Adelaide and we found that in the free camps you had to get in by about 2pm otherwise they were crowded out in fact some people couldn't get in and had to try further down the road. Yet when we went away two years ago could stay on the road til around 4pm before we thought of camping. This was our experience anyway. Helena.
.. I tend to agree with the Rocket .. the last place I suffered over-crowding in a free-camp situation was over 2 years ago. A lot has to do with your own experience and planning and, of course, your mode of travel !
Naturally I prefer to freecamp but often I will stay at CP's for up to a month .. some reasons being is that I might enjoy the location and frequently the 3rd week is free .. and don't forget that if travelling as a solo, that you should always 'bargain' for the best price on offer .. If a fulltime traveller and you find yourself back at that venue another time, even further discounting is quite possible and /or other benefits that you may not have expected are available .. Its quite amazing how 'attitude' shared can be a such a positive !
If numbers do increase, then one adapts accordingly ..
Jon
We had the same experience in 2011 Helena, we ended up staying in caravan parks more often, as at least there you get a whole site and people dont park themselves a couple of feet away from your door.
I can park my Bus up the back of a Supermarket car park, Industrial area, Back street and none would be the wiser, Unless I started to put deck chairs outside it,
I can park on the side of the road in a truck stop, beside a creek or river, down the beach,
When I leave, the only trace I have been there are my wheel tracks and four indentations where my self levers have hit the ground, Any rubbish I have, I take it with me,
I have Fresh water, Grey water, and Black water tanks on board, I have a flushing Dunny, shower and bath, Full kitchen, and a garbage compactor, which all can be emptied at those Various council disposal places,
I pay rates in the shire of Yarra Ranges for my house, The Shire of Yarra Ranges also covers the Mt Dandenong and Yarra Valley Tourist area's, which my rates also help to
pay for,
People come from allover the world to stay in the Yarra Valley and Dandenong Ranges, It puts money into the economy, I dont object to that, My rates going towards tourists,
Councils do need to realize that travellors of all kinds do need some money spent towards them if they want the extra income from travellors, It does work towards the local economy of all these places,
Travellors still need fuel, Food, and spending on the local tourist attractions, Thats why they have gone there, to see the local attractions, No matter how they travel, or what mode of conveyance they used to get there,
Councils that make too hard for the travellors, the word does get out, We all have the internet these days, so we just avoid the places where the councils are being hard on travellors, so they miss out on the income that travellors bring, Then its their loss,
They do need to look at the bigger picture,
We have some of the best Motorcycling roads in Australia here, The police have been cracking down on Motor cyclists here for the last few years, The thousands of Bike riders have all gone else where to ride because of it, and now the traders are feeling the pinch of no income from them, Its a tourist area, no tourists, no income, Motor cyclists spent a lot of money up there on the weekends, They are Tourists, Its now gone else where,
Motor cycling Forums have done that, Passing the word,