Firstly, I need to acknowledge, and thank, ExplorOz for this excellent article on camping.
Given the times this emotive issue raises its ugly head on this forum, it provides good advice and reasoning, giving the perspective of all who are involved in, or impacted by, our pleasure-time activity.
I am confident the vast majority of those utilising this forum are fully aware of the content but perhaps it is time for each of us to pass this information to those who appear unaware of the impact of their actions when the opportunity arises and help to protect our 'lifestyle'.
All very well having rules and regulations regarding land ownership and use of crown land, reserves etc. After nearly 50 years of travelling and camping in all sorts of conveyances in all manner of locations there is still one inescapable fact, that is, none of these regulations are enforced. If anyone doubts this just pull into Clairview on the central Queensland coast and take a look at where the backpackers set up their camps. It won't be hard to find, just keep an eye out for the used toilet paper, shopping bags and discarded 2 minute noodle packets. Of course you have to drive past the extremely cheap campsites to see where these people stay overnight. We have the same issue here in Cairns, all sorts of rules but zero enforcement. Visitors to our country don't bother to obey our camping regulations and businesses who have councillors in their pockets don't want the illegal campers upset in case they miss out on a few miserable dollars. These same businesses though are only too keen to gouge Australians who want to park a van or motorhome. The same scenario extends all the way to the Kimberleys. Recently there have been serious issues at Cow Bay in the Daintree. There is a very small parking area for visitors to the beach and it was being completely overrun by backpackers. Resulting in practically all the available branches being broken off trees for firewood. This is a very small community and has no council resources north of the river to do maintenance. The locals had to complain long and loud to get heard but the next wave of illegal campers will arrive and do exactly the same thing as word is passed amongst o/seas travellers. Just my 2 cents worth after seeing most of the excellent coastal campsites destroyed in the last 40 years.
chrisnchris said
05:08 PM May 10, 2013
On our last trip we travelled through Eidsvold , thinking we would stopover at Claude Wharton Weir and have a look about the area . We drove into the camp site weaving between campers parked on the road in only to find the whole area taken up with backpackers and their various forms of transport and the place was a total pigsty. I have nothing against these people but why do the rules not apply to them . As a result we moved on and Eidsvold missed out on our money ( fuel groceries etc ) and we won't be back that way Cheers
Scotty01 said
05:30 PM May 10, 2013
Very good informative article but the problem is the bigest offenders wouldnt take the time to read it, thats if they can read. From what I have seen in my first year on the raod indicates quite clearly that the Overseas backpackers are the main offenders possibly because they just dont understand english and due to the living standards in some European/Asian countries. Not saying they are the only ones I have seen some Aussie Travelers do some discusting things, makes you wonder what their homes are like.
KFT said
06:01 PM May 10, 2013
thanks John, I enjoyed reading that article.
It really is a shame that the tourism companies that host international tourist are not compelled to explain these things to their customers before they hit the road.
Mind you there are many aussie day trippers who also could do with a dose of etiquette about the use of rest areas.
frank
GaryKelly said
11:18 PM May 10, 2013
Good article, John, and thanks for the link. I must say I'm confused after reading so many comments from GNs on this forum about what a great time they had visiting various places, and then to read a comment like Weedy's. I guess the only way I'll be able to judge the big picture for myself is when I'm finally on the road permanently.
Meanwhile, I'm wondering about the value of leading by example. The article stressed the need to consider the next camper after you, and to leave the site in a clean and tidy condition. In other words, be mindful of your responsibility to the next person. I'm sure the people Weedy refers to - the backpackers and day trippers who leave a mess - don't even think about the next person. So maybe they need to be reminded by signs such as THANK YOU FOR LEAVING THIS SITE CLEAN AND TIDY FOR THE NEXT CAMPER. It's a bit wordy but it's better than short messages like Keep Australia Beautiful that have no meaning, and that don't specifically remind campers of their responsibilities.
If you ask the question why don't some people care about the mess they make, there are probably two answers. 1) Some people just don't give a sheet anyway, and never will. 2) Some people need to be reminded that if they have a right to expect a nice clean camping site, so does the next person, and that it's each camper's responsibility to care for their fellow travellers.
I'd be happy to have a sticker on my rig that said something like I AM A RESPONSIBLE CAMPER or a message to that effect. It there were enough stickers on enough rigs, plus signs with a similar message at camp sites throughout Australia, the message might get through. It's the word 'responsible' that's important... to make people understand that the responsibility for camp site maintenance is in the hands of campers themselves - not governments, not councils but campers.
herbie said
12:08 AM May 11, 2013
Hello Gary , i agree in every word you say regarding leaving camp spots clean for the next person.But there is people ,even who are on this site who say if they find a dirty unkept spot to camp they move onto a cleaner one. So if this is the attitude of people who are grey nomads, what hope has any sign going to make to these other grubs out there. Maybe on each sign that displays the name of the town it could also have a sign attatch reading in bigger letters WE HAVE SOME FREE/ LOW COST CAMPING BUT WE DO NEED YOU OR YOUR MONEY IF YOU ARE GOING TO LEAVE OUR AREA IN A MESS !!!! The worst thing i have enountered is counciles place garbage (44 gal drums in most cases open top ) Tke the bloody dirty things away ,they hardley ever get emptied until most of the rubbish has blowen away into the bush anyway.I have noticed some of the cleaner places to camp have no toilet/ bins/...Was down at Angus Waters the other day doing some mowing on my block and next thing i see this WizBang drive in with three back packers inside , my question to them was what you after or want, ..could not believe it when in broken english they said they had been camping at the workmans camp for three weeks and asked to move on as they did not want to pay the $5 per night to stay there, so wanted to know if they could camp on my land for free as they had been up north earlier and too expensive up there and get kicked out of parking on the beach front . The attitude of some people makes one wonder , what the world has become. Like some think we wont a nice free camping spot but be damned if we are going to clean it up ,we will just move on to one that some body else has done the hard yards.
GaryKelly said
02:07 AM May 11, 2013
Yes, Herbie, you're quite right about the problems. However, it's not the problems we need to be talking about, it's solutions. Meanwhile, I take your point about people bypassing dirty camp sites in favor of a cleaner one. If the "good guys" refuse to get their hands dirty, what then?
herbie said
03:35 AM May 11, 2013
Hello Gary, the thing about all this HOO ARRRR about the dirty conditions surounding free camping places, is that the caravan park operator is clapping his/ her hands together,as it gives them more surport for these said places down. In the not so distant future i can see ( like in some places through out the world ) that camping will be out lawed.And heavy fines handed out.To the point where one would not be game to take the chance to free camp, due to the hefty fines. Reading from other peoples thoughts on this very concern in other forums wheather it is a 4x4 ,combie ,tent,hiking,forums they all feel the same,it is onlt time before a law is passed that free camping/ low cost camping is not allowed...
rockylizard said
02:46 PM May 11, 2013
Gday...
As of just now there have been 338 'reads' of this thread with only eight responses/comments. I am very pleased to see so many read it and hopefully they will take the positive message and apply it and spread the word to those they meet.
I didn't post the article to draw out even more comments about the 'problem' of camps but for it to hopefully be the catalyst for change. I hope my faith in human nature prevails.
Herbie, your comment ... "i can see ( like in some places through out the world ) that camping will be out lawed. And heavy fines handed out" ... can you actually name such places??
I think camping will always remain a valuable pastime and there will always be places to camp in inviting environments away from cities and crowds. These places may increasingly attract a 'fee to camp'. However, I will concede there will be 'free rest areas' that will be closed (outlawed?) due to the inconsideration of some. I don't consider them as 'camping' anyway.
Cheers - John
blaze said
03:07 PM May 11, 2013
Yep some backpackers are pigs but take a look at aussies in general. Not talking about our camping spots but what we as a nation , business and private leave scattered about. The truck loads that are illegally dumped and that sort of thing. we are a nation of pigs cheers blaze
Bugsy said
04:10 PM May 11, 2013
I don't for one minute condone camping where people don't carry out what they take in and dispose of it in a responsible way but we hear so much about grey nomads and Rvers being responsible for all this.
Have a look around your local parks in town sometime, have a look around the grounds after a football match or V8 race meeting or the fireworks on Sydney harbour on new year's eve. Here is a classic example http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2013/05/disposable-garbage-bag-tents-are-the-cleverest-way-to-keep-camping-clean/
We have a cultural problem, not a camping problem. Try dropping a chewing gum wrapper in Singapore and see how you go.
-- Edited by Bugsy on Saturday 11th of May 2013 04:10:52 PM
chrisnchris said
05:33 PM May 11, 2013
I agree blaze just look at "Clean up Australia Day" how many tons of rubbish is collected . Now to Herbies post where he mentions Nomads moving on from a dirty or unkept site . We are more than happy to camp free , paid fess or C/P on our travels and always leave the site as tidy or tidier than when we arrived eg walking aroung picking up rubbish smoothing over fire pits etc The comment from another van who drove into the site we were moving on from was " and people wonder why free camps are being closed down " Also thanks John for the original post . It was very informative Cheers
GaryKelly said
01:18 AM May 12, 2013
In fairness to Aussies, it's also Aussies who participate in Clean Up Australia Day.
Gday...
Firstly, I need to acknowledge, and thank, ExplorOz for this excellent article on camping.
Given the times this emotive issue raises its ugly head on this forum, it provides good advice and reasoning, giving the perspective of all who are involved in, or impacted by, our pleasure-time activity.
I am confident the vast majority of those utilising this forum are fully aware of the content but perhaps it is time for each of us to pass this information to those who appear unaware of the impact of their actions when the opportunity arises and help to protect our 'lifestyle'.
http://www.exploroz.com/OntheRoad/Camping/BushCamps.aspx
Cheers - John
If anyone doubts this just pull into Clairview on the central Queensland coast and take a look at where the backpackers set up their camps. It won't be hard to find, just keep an eye out for the used toilet paper, shopping bags and discarded 2 minute noodle packets. Of course you have to drive past the extremely cheap campsites to see where these people stay overnight. We have the same issue here in Cairns, all sorts of rules but zero enforcement.
Visitors to our country don't bother to obey our camping regulations and businesses who have councillors in their pockets don't want the illegal campers upset in case they miss out on a few miserable dollars. These same businesses though are only too keen to gouge Australians who want to park a van or motorhome.
The same scenario extends all the way to the Kimberleys.
Recently there have been serious issues at Cow Bay in the Daintree. There is a very small parking area for visitors to the beach and it was being completely overrun by backpackers. Resulting in practically all the available branches being broken off trees for firewood. This is a very small community and has no council resources north of the river to do maintenance. The locals had to complain long and loud to get heard but the next wave of illegal campers will arrive and do exactly the same thing as word is passed amongst o/seas travellers.
Just my 2 cents worth after seeing most of the excellent coastal campsites destroyed in the last 40 years.
We drove into the camp site weaving between campers parked on the road in only to find the whole area taken up with backpackers
and their various forms of transport and the place was a total pigsty. I have nothing against these people but why do the rules not apply
to them . As a result we moved on and Eidsvold missed out on our money ( fuel groceries etc ) and we won't be back that way
Cheers
Very good informative article but the problem is the bigest offenders wouldnt take the time to read it, thats if they can read. From what I have seen in my first year on the raod indicates quite clearly that the Overseas backpackers are the main offenders possibly because they just dont understand english and due to the living standards in some European/Asian countries. Not saying they are the only ones I have seen some Aussie Travelers do some discusting things, makes you wonder what their homes are like.
It really is a shame that the tourism companies that host international tourist are not compelled to explain these things to their customers before they hit the road.
Mind you there are many aussie day trippers who also could do with a dose of etiquette about the use of rest areas.
frank
Meanwhile, I'm wondering about the value of leading by example. The article stressed the need to consider the next camper after you, and to leave the site in a clean and tidy condition. In other words, be mindful of your responsibility to the next person. I'm sure the people Weedy refers to - the backpackers and day trippers who leave a mess - don't even think about the next person. So maybe they need to be reminded by signs such as THANK YOU FOR LEAVING THIS SITE CLEAN AND TIDY FOR THE NEXT CAMPER. It's a bit wordy but it's better than short messages like Keep Australia Beautiful that have no meaning, and that don't specifically remind campers of their responsibilities.
If you ask the question why don't some people care about the mess they make, there are probably two answers. 1) Some people just don't give a sheet anyway, and never will. 2) Some people need to be reminded that if they have a right to expect a nice clean camping site, so does the next person, and that it's each camper's responsibility to care for their fellow travellers.
I'd be happy to have a sticker on my rig that said something like I AM A RESPONSIBLE CAMPER or a message to that effect. It there were enough stickers on enough rigs, plus signs with a similar message at camp sites throughout Australia, the message might get through. It's the word 'responsible' that's important... to make people understand that the responsibility for camp site maintenance is in the hands of campers themselves - not governments, not councils but campers.
Hello Gary, the thing about all this HOO ARRRR about the dirty conditions surounding free camping places, is that the caravan park operator is clapping his/ her hands together,as it gives them more surport for these said places down. In the not so distant future i can see ( like in some places through out the world ) that camping will be out lawed.And heavy fines handed out.To the point where one would not be game to take the chance to free camp, due to the hefty fines. Reading from other peoples thoughts on this very concern in other forums wheather it is a 4x4 ,combie ,tent,hiking,forums they all feel the same,it is onlt time before a law is passed that free camping/ low cost camping is not allowed...
Gday...
As of just now there have been 338 'reads' of this thread with only eight responses/comments. I am very pleased to see so many read it and hopefully they will take the positive message and apply it and spread the word to those they meet.
I didn't post the article to draw out even more comments about the 'problem' of camps but for it to hopefully be the catalyst for change. I hope my faith in human nature prevails.
Herbie, your comment ... "i can see ( like in some places through out the world ) that camping will be out lawed. And heavy fines handed out" ... can you actually name such places??
I think camping will always remain a valuable pastime and there will always be places to camp in inviting environments away from cities and crowds. These places may increasingly attract a 'fee to camp'. However, I will concede there will be 'free rest areas' that will be closed (outlawed?) due to the inconsideration of some. I don't consider them as 'camping' anyway.
Cheers - John
cheers
blaze
I don't for one minute condone camping where people don't carry out what they take in and dispose of it in a responsible way but we hear so much about grey nomads and Rvers being responsible for all this.
Have a look around your local parks in town sometime, have a look around the grounds after a football match or V8 race meeting or the fireworks on Sydney harbour on new year's eve. Here is a classic example http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2013/05/disposable-garbage-bag-tents-are-the-cleverest-way-to-keep-camping-clean/
We have a cultural problem, not a camping problem. Try dropping a chewing gum wrapper in Singapore and see how you go.
-- Edited by Bugsy on Saturday 11th of May 2013 04:10:52 PM
Now to Herbies post where he mentions Nomads moving on from a dirty or unkept site .
We are more than happy to camp free , paid fess or C/P on our travels and always leave the site
as tidy or tidier than when we arrived eg walking aroung picking up rubbish smoothing over fire pits etc
The comment from another van who drove into the site we were moving on from was
" and people wonder why free camps are being closed down "
Also thanks John for the original post . It was very informative
Cheers