Looking at closing this location to over nighters, But they are asking for submissions and this is a chance for nomads to provide some input to try to save this excellent overnighter.
Just click on the following link and read through the information. You can then send council your views.
http://www.tweed.nsw.gov.au/BruceChick
this info was sent to me from another entity.
Bob
-- Edited by Old Crofter on Sunday 24th of November 2013 08:57:39 AM
-- Edited by Roving-Dutchy on Sunday 24th of November 2013 09:47:20 AM
liddle said
04:55 PM Nov 24, 2013
Hi Beth
Makes it difficult to have any kind of discussion .
Shame for the rest of us.
I have no choice but to read all the messages in a thread as the next one just rolls up and in this case it was a huge unpleasant photo
-- Edited by liddle on Sunday 24th of November 2013 05:17:16 PM
jules47 said
05:10 PM Nov 24, 2013
Can't click the link Bob - can someone help??
billeeeeeee said
05:17 PM Nov 24, 2013
jules47 wrote:
Can't click the link Bob - can someone help??
I helped,,,,,just turned the pc on ..................
jules47 said
05:21 PM Nov 24, 2013
Smart Alec Billeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!
Got it.
Stotts may not be flash - but it one of the only overnight stops in the area - have stayed there many, many times - is quite often standing room only - so obviously a well known and used spot - is this another instance of closing free camps and not caring about travelling public!!!!!???
Thanks for posting Bob.
rockylizard said
05:48 PM Nov 24, 2013
jules47 wrote:
Stotts may not be flash - but it one of the only overnight stops in the area - have stayed there many, many times - is quite often standing room only - so obviously a well known and used spot - is this another instance of closing free camps and not caring about travelling public!!!!!???
Thanks for posting Bob.
Gday...
Or is it simply being "loved to death" by perhaps an inconsiderate travelling public?
I quote from the website -
"The park was originally developed in conjunction with New South Wales Parks and Wildlife (NPWS) as an environmental interpretive and recreation area to help protect Stott's Island Nature Reserve, one of the least disturbed areas of vegetation in the lower Tweed Valley floodplain."
"Over time, the site has become popular as a free overnight stopover for campers and recreational vehicle travellers, and more recently, a base for longer stays and itinerants.Much of the infrastructure within the park - including an ineffective pump-out toilet facility - has deteriorated and is at the end of its life"
There may be many on here who 'respect' these areas, but perhaps the majority of 'travellers' have not been so considerate.
Local populations, and their authorities, quite often find that 'pandering' to those who don't return the respect extended is just not worth the trouble - or cost.
These situations are certainly going to grow as there are increasingly more 'travellers' each year, all seemingly intent on "camping free". It always amuses me that such people seem to think that it is their "right" to do so.
I have always maintained that sleeping at wayside stops and these sorts of reserves is not 'camping' and the areas will ultimately be so over-used by those who want a "free ride" that the so-called financial benefits the 'traveller' may bring to an area is offset by the cost of maintainence. I do hope no-one tries to raise that old furphy that "the travelling bank accounts spend $500 a week each in places they stay for free."
Take note of the costings attributed to each option and if you were a Councillor, or ratepayer, in the municipality which would you choose.
Cheers - John
Gerty Dancer said
07:00 PM Nov 24, 2013
Yeah RL, can see why they wouldn't want the restoration of facilities, then annual upkeep of over $30 000. "Loved to death" sums it up Jules. Sad.
rockylizard said
07:13 PM Nov 24, 2013
billeeeeeee wrote:
perhaps r-lizard u need to c the bigger picture about wot life is all about.....................................Looking down u nose at ppl ,...Blah Blah blah...........................Billeeeeeee I know , I know , Cindy, off to hell for this one,,,,,, glad I only bump into nice ppl out here,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Gday...
Good morning Billeeeeeee. Perhaps you need to have your early morning coffee, and lay back and become the "excited" person you so constantly and loudly profess to be.
I would suggest that of all people on this forum, you have the most posts of "looking down u nose at ppl".
It would appear that unless other forum users are "excited or nutters" in your opinion (which you also constantly and loudly share) they are open to your tirades and attempts at wit.
It would be much more productive if you read the website supplied to the forum, read AND absorbed the differing opinions, and provided comment on the topic.
Just a suggestion.
cheers - John
Golddetectornomad said
09:39 PM Nov 24, 2013
Apart from rubbing salt into the wound John, how does your post help or encourage us to put our case to them....agreeing that we've been naughty and deserve our punishment does not give a positive direction for us to go when the majority of us would indeed like to see it remain open....I'm not into blame games...they are rarely helpful and often just inflame....
If Billiieeee felt he had been spoken to in a condescending way, then I'm with Billlieee on this one....
In short 'Old Crofters' post was positive and asked for help with submissions...yours was negative...and in no way helps the first poster IMO....Hoo Roo
rockylizard said
10:11 PM Nov 24, 2013
Gday...
Sorry Larry. Like you, I am only proffering my opinion. That is my right as it is yours.
If you see my comments as negative, so be it. I don't feel that.
Whilst I understand that those on this forum respect, and abide by, the rules applied by municipalities on the areas they allow 'travellers' to rest, it is patently obvious that the majority of 'travellers' seem to be abusing the hospitality of those municipalities.
To have a wayside stop, with a 24 hours limit, being 'squatted' on for longer periods of time and, as the Council feels becoming "a base for longer stays and itinerants" is the result of the thoughtless inconsideration of those who are not members of this forum.
I would much prefer all of us on this forum, when we see abuse of the facilities - such as overstaying the limit, failing to lodge the donation, leaving rubbish etc - we approach and make a "submisssion" to those who are actually doing the misdemeanor - rather than submitting a belated plea to sway a Council to trust us, the more considerate traveller.
The Council, and local residents/ratepayers, do not see those of us who are doing the right thing ... they only see those who 'squat' and abuse their hospitality. Makes it hard for the Council to react in our favour.
Anyway, I welcome all opinions, on this and every topic, even if they differ from mine. When someone differs from my opinion, I do not respond by telling them they are "Looking down u nose at ppl" or that they are "a flea", or any other level of personal denigration.
Cheers - and let's keep finding good spots and camping - John
Beth54 said
12:00 AM Nov 25, 2013
I don't have a problem with Billeee. I just don't read any of his ramblings. Easy.
johnq said
01:34 AM Nov 25, 2013
It is a difficult problem isn't it, where the responsible and caring can be blamed and excluded as well?
It is 2013 and public authorities are often caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. To give a few possible considerations:
- over-zealous immigration is resulting in the population growth of an undeveloped third world country and stretching infrastructure in some locations past all reasonable expectations;
- Local and State governments are being obliged by lobby groups of sectional interests to supply many new and expensive services and the costs are horrendous;
- the population is becoming litigious and ideology decrees that public authorities use private insurers instead of government self-insuring as before (losing the benefit of scale of government for instance); and
- some of the groups who despoil and vandalise can easily claim 'discrimination' where action is taken against them.
We the Aussie people seem to have lost our perspective and our way. We are far too busy doing our own thing to value our freedom, culture and quality of life and take action. People say it is a waste of time contacting politicians. However the politicians say they never hear from the vast majority and consequently have no defence when sectional interests lobby and manipulate them and threaten to embarrass them in the media.
Maybe the only realistic, practical option available to State and local government authorities is that suggested by an earlier poster, which is more restrictions and user pays. As a possible tweak maybe we could lobby for some relief for seniors and the disabled from part of the charges. Of course that will turn to clay too if the usual wedge politics are invoked, and it is true to say that the wedge politics are so often played by the pensioners themselves, for example by claiming that self-funding retirees are already 'advantaged' and should be excluded from any benefit.
More than 2c worth as usual, sorry.
yeoeleven said
05:59 AM Nov 25, 2013
I have stopped many times at Stotts Reserve and discussed the rules for overnight camping with the ranger, previously it was on the main highway before the most recent diversion and then it was part of the Main Roads Authority. Now it has been transferred to local council.
The Ranger told me last June that only one night overnight stops were allowed and those who previously stayed longer have been moved on and his job was to keep track of vehicles stopping there and issue fines if there were infringements. He was very friendly and spoke to all parked there explaining the position, those who had lived there previously had moved on.
So if the matter has been resolved by policing the camp site it is strange to find that the council are seriously considering closing the reserve to overnight camping, there are no caravan parks in th near vicinity so there would be no campaigning from that direction.
As one who uses that reserve when I visit the Gold Coast I would be dissappointed to find it closed when next I travel north.
Looking at closing this location to over nighters, But they are asking for submissions and this is a chance for nomads to provide some input to try to save this excellent overnighter.
Just click on the following link and read through the information. You can then send council your views.
http://www.tweed.nsw.gov.au/BruceChick
this info was sent to me from another entity.
Bob
-- Edited by Old Crofter on Sunday 24th of November 2013 08:57:39 AM
This link should be right now.
http://www.tweed.nsw.gov.au/BruceChick
Cheers
David
-- Edited by Roving-Dutchy on Sunday 24th of November 2013 09:47:20 AM
Hi Beth
Makes it difficult to have any kind of discussion .
Shame for the rest of us.
I have no choice but to read all the messages in a thread as the next one just rolls up and in this case it was a huge unpleasant photo
-- Edited by liddle on Sunday 24th of November 2013 05:17:16 PM
I helped,,,,,just turned the pc on ..................
Got it.
Stotts may not be flash - but it one of the only overnight stops in the area - have stayed there many, many times - is quite often standing room only - so obviously a well known and used spot - is this another instance of closing free camps and not caring about travelling public!!!!!???
Thanks for posting Bob.
Gday...
Or is it simply being "loved to death" by perhaps an inconsiderate travelling public?
I quote from the website -
"The park was originally developed in conjunction with New South Wales Parks and Wildlife (NPWS) as an environmental interpretive and recreation area to help protect Stott's Island Nature Reserve, one of the least disturbed areas of vegetation in the lower Tweed Valley floodplain."
"Over time, the site has become popular as a free overnight stopover for campers and recreational vehicle travellers, and more recently, a base for longer stays and itinerants. Much of the infrastructure within the park - including an ineffective pump-out toilet facility - has deteriorated and is at the end of its life"
There may be many on here who 'respect' these areas, but perhaps the majority of 'travellers' have not been so considerate.
Local populations, and their authorities, quite often find that 'pandering' to those who don't return the respect extended is just not worth the trouble - or cost.
These situations are certainly going to grow as there are increasingly more 'travellers' each year, all seemingly intent on "camping free". It always amuses me that such people seem to think that it is their "right" to do so.
I have always maintained that sleeping at wayside stops and these sorts of reserves is not 'camping' and the areas will ultimately be so over-used by those who want a "free ride" that the so-called financial benefits the 'traveller' may bring to an area is offset by the cost of maintainence. I do hope no-one tries to raise that old furphy that "the travelling bank accounts spend $500 a week each in places they stay for free."
Take note of the costings attributed to each option and if you were a Councillor, or ratepayer, in the municipality which would you choose.
Cheers - John
Yeah RL, can see why they wouldn't want the restoration of facilities, then annual upkeep of over $30 000.
"Loved to death" sums it up Jules. Sad.
Gday...
Good morning Billeeeeeee. Perhaps you need to have your early morning coffee, and lay back and become the "excited" person you so constantly and loudly profess to be.
I would suggest that of all people on this forum, you have the most posts of "looking down u nose at ppl".
It would appear that unless other forum users are "excited or nutters" in your opinion (which you also constantly and loudly share) they are open to your tirades and attempts at wit.
It would be much more productive if you read the website supplied to the forum, read AND absorbed the differing opinions, and provided comment on the topic.
Just a suggestion.
cheers - John
If Billiieeee felt he had been spoken to in a condescending way, then I'm with Billlieee on this one....
In short 'Old Crofters' post was positive and asked for help with submissions...yours was negative...and in no way helps the first poster IMO....Hoo Roo
Gday...
Sorry Larry. Like you, I am only proffering my opinion. That is my right as it is yours.
If you see my comments as negative, so be it. I don't feel that.
Whilst I understand that those on this forum respect, and abide by, the rules applied by municipalities on the areas they allow 'travellers' to rest, it is patently obvious that the majority of 'travellers' seem to be abusing the hospitality of those municipalities.
To have a wayside stop, with a 24 hours limit, being 'squatted' on for longer periods of time and, as the Council feels becoming "a base for longer stays and itinerants" is the result of the thoughtless inconsideration of those who are not members of this forum.
I would much prefer all of us on this forum, when we see abuse of the facilities - such as overstaying the limit, failing to lodge the donation, leaving rubbish etc - we approach and make a "submisssion" to those who are actually doing the misdemeanor - rather than submitting a belated plea to sway a Council to trust us, the more considerate traveller.
The Council, and local residents/ratepayers, do not see those of us who are doing the right thing ... they only see those who 'squat' and abuse their hospitality. Makes it hard for the Council to react in our favour.
Anyway, I welcome all opinions, on this and every topic, even if they differ from mine. When someone differs from my opinion, I do not respond by telling them they are "Looking down u nose at ppl" or that they are "a flea", or any other level of personal denigration.
Cheers - and let's keep finding good spots and camping - John
I don't have a problem with Billeee. I just don't read any of his ramblings. Easy.
It is 2013 and public authorities are often caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. To give a few possible considerations:
- over-zealous immigration is resulting in the population growth of an undeveloped third world country and stretching infrastructure in some locations past all reasonable expectations;
- Local and State governments are being obliged by lobby groups of sectional interests to supply many new and expensive services and the costs are horrendous;
- the population is becoming litigious and ideology decrees that public authorities use private insurers instead of government self-insuring as before (losing the benefit of scale of government for instance); and
- some of the groups who despoil and vandalise can easily claim 'discrimination' where action is taken against them.
We the Aussie people seem to have lost our perspective and our way. We are far too busy doing our own thing to value our freedom, culture and quality of life and take action. People say it is a waste of time contacting politicians. However the politicians say they never hear from the vast majority and consequently have no defence when sectional interests lobby and manipulate them and threaten to embarrass them in the media.
Maybe the only realistic, practical option available to State and local government authorities is that suggested by an earlier poster, which is more restrictions and user pays. As a possible tweak maybe we could lobby for some relief for seniors and the disabled from part of the charges. Of course that will turn to clay too if the usual wedge politics are invoked, and it is true to say that the wedge politics are so often played by the pensioners themselves, for example by claiming that self-funding retirees are already 'advantaged' and should be excluded from any benefit.
More than 2c worth as usual, sorry.
I have stopped many times at Stotts Reserve and discussed the rules for overnight camping with the ranger, previously it was on the main highway before the most recent diversion and then it was part of the Main Roads Authority. Now it has been transferred to local council.
The Ranger told me last June that only one night overnight stops were allowed and those who previously stayed longer have been moved on and his job was to keep track of vehicles stopping there and issue fines if there were infringements. He was very friendly and spoke to all parked there explaining the position, those who had lived there previously had moved on.
So if the matter has been resolved by policing the camp site it is strange to find that the council are seriously considering closing the reserve to overnight camping, there are no caravan parks in th near vicinity so there would be no campaigning from that direction.
As one who uses that reserve when I visit the Gold Coast I would be dissappointed to find it closed when next I travel north.
http://yeoeleven.blogspot.com.au/2013/05/stotts-island-nature-reserve-revisited.html#!/2012/07/stotts-island-nature-reserve.html
John