Looking for some advice re our Toyota Coaster bus (purchased second hand a few years ago) and a possible generator purchase.... Planning for a new trip and installed a 60 litre fridge / freezer to run as a dedicated freezer (to supplement our small freezer in the existing fridge). The freezer draws about 7 amps and the solar panels are now struggling to keep up. The solar panels are around 10 years old so probably not a lot of power.
Thought we might supplement the solar with a generator while we monitor and decide what we should do next. We currently have 2 X 100ah house batteries which we are going to upgrade to 2 X 160ah before we leave on our trip.
A local had a small generator for sale and we visited last night to check it out. In as new condition and started first up. Plugged in to an appliance and that worked fine.
However, when we plugged the generator in to the 240V input on the bus that we use at caravan parks, it seemed to make no difference.
Is it possible that the freezer cycled on at the same time that I plugged it in and the generator overloaded? The generator is rated at 8 amp.
Any thoughts?
Possum3 said
10:44 AM Feb 6, 2018
How many Kilowatt on your generator - make and model? - Most on here use Honda 20i or Yamaha equivalent.
Lenny999 said
10:47 AM Feb 6, 2018
The generator I was looking at is a Honda eu10i. I think it is rated a little lower than the 20i
Peter_n_Margaret said
11:35 AM Feb 6, 2018
Fit some more solar (as much as you can) plus a DC-DC charger from the vehicle alternator and you will have no need for a generator.
Using the DC output of a generator to charge batteries is like using a D9 grader to make a garden path. It won't do a very good job, and will cost a fortune for what it does.
Cheers,
Peter
Triggy said
11:48 AM Feb 6, 2018
You probably have hot water element on or some other 230 volt loads . freezer, battery charger, microwave, jug etc.
Are all the fridges running off 12v
The 1 kva generator only needs to be connected direct to the battery charger to charge the batteries nothing else.
Gary
Lenny999 said
11:57 AM Feb 6, 2018
Does the generator only provide power to one item at a time? I could plug it in to the Engel (which uses the most power).... But I thought if I plugged the generator in to the 240 volt input socket it would provide power to anything that was running.
The existing fridge is gas and we don't have many items that use much power, so we have never been concerned about solar / batteries up until now. But having installed the Engel and seen how much current it draws, we will need to do something more.
That's partly why we are upgrading the batteries. We are also looking at additional solar panels, but what I was thinking was... I could use the generator as a backup to run the freezer if we have weather conditions that dont provide much solar.
The Engel website says this unit uses a maximum 4.2 amps, however redarc suggests that the usage is higher than that (I think about 7 amps). Ordinarily the load on the redarc is only about 1 amp, but it jumps to about 8amp when the freezer runs.
-- Edited by Lenny999 on Tuesday 6th of February 2018 12:13:46 PM
Possum3 said
09:29 PM Feb 6, 2018
Agree with Peter on this; more solar may be answer, when you put in two 160ah batteries - but Small Honda not enough grunt to do more than occasional top up on cloudy days, and would need almost constant running.
Jaahn said
09:38 PM Feb 6, 2018
Lenny999 wrote:
Does the generator only provide power to one item at a time? I could plug it in to the Engel (which uses the most power).... But I thought if I plugged the generator in to the 240 volt input socket it would provide power to anything that was running.
The existing fridge is gas and we don't have many items that use much power, so we have never been concerned about solar / batteries up until now. But having installed the Engel and seen how much current it draws, we will need to do something more.
That's partly why we are upgrading the batteries. We are also looking at additional solar panels, but what I was thinking was... I could use the generator as a backup to run the freezer if we have weather conditions that dont provide much solar.
The Engel website says this unit uses a maximum 4.2 amps, however redarc suggests that the usage is higher than that (I think about 7 amps). Ordinarily the load on the redarc is only about 1 amp, but it jumps to about 8amp when the freezer runs.
-- Edited by Lenny999 on Tuesday 6th of February 2018 12:13:46 PM
Hi Lenny
Perhaps you misunderstood the output of the generator. I believe, (without checking), the generator puts out 1000Watts MAX(only) at the 240V AC outlet which is only 4A AC, and 8 Amps at the 12V DC outlets. Both these outputs may not be run flat out together and both should be reduced for longer use times.
Within the limits as stated it will run whatever you want up to the limit. But if you read some other threads on using generators here you will find that you should be careful about plugging it into the caravan and using multiple items. But perhaps your bus circuit tripped out or the switch/breaker was off.
In theory it should work as you said. I guess the Engel has a 240V to 12/24V dc to run it. So it is not drawing 8 amps at 240 V. Getting confusing ?? To make it worse your bus would be a 24V vehicle system. How is your house battery system set up, 12v x2 or 24V in series ? The Engle might run on either. The bus alternator will provide plenty of power if necessary depending on the setup.
My suggestion is get another panel or two on the roof. The 10 year old ones will be almost as good as new and a check on the connections etc will get them back to scratch if needed. My panels are twice that old and still work OK.
Jaahn
Aus-Kiwi said
12:22 AM Feb 7, 2018
Another potion ?? Consider another alternater on bus motor ? 120
Amp goes along way charging and pretty quiet
when the odd time you get 2 or 3 overcast days ..
Lenny999 said
04:01 PM Feb 7, 2018
Thanks very much for the comments guys.
I think my first step will be to source some additional solar and then to test drive to see how the new batteries (when installed) cope.
Lenny999 said
04:21 PM Feb 7, 2018
I rechecked the specs on both the EU10i and EU20i and came up with:
EU10i EU20i
Rated AC output 900Va 1600Va
DC output 12V 8.3A 12V 8.3A
Of course I=P/V confirms that 900Va at 240V gives 4A, but I think I assumed I still had 8.3A. Too small for me.
I don't know why the DC output would be the same for each model but I am just a babe in the woods when it comes to this.
Anything I may have learned at school has long since been forgotten!!
Warren-Pat_01 said
07:00 PM Feb 8, 2018
Lennie, , the 12v 8.3A DC is generally supplied to the generators for battery charging. The rating of the generators is for the 240v RMS only and as the others explained, you cannot have both going at the same time at maximum outputs.
In earlier days I had a Honda e1000. I used the DC output on the car battery to give it a bit of a kick when the innards collapsed & I was in isolated areas of NW WA.
Hi all,
Looking for some advice re our Toyota Coaster bus (purchased second hand a few years ago) and a possible generator purchase.... Planning for a new trip and installed a 60 litre fridge / freezer to run as a dedicated freezer (to supplement our small freezer in the existing fridge). The freezer draws about 7 amps and the solar panels are now struggling to keep up. The solar panels are around 10 years old so probably not a lot of power.
Thought we might supplement the solar with a generator while we monitor and decide what we should do next. We currently have 2 X 100ah house batteries which we are going to upgrade to 2 X 160ah before we leave on our trip.
A local had a small generator for sale and we visited last night to check it out. In as new condition and started first up. Plugged in to an appliance and that worked fine.
However, when we plugged the generator in to the 240V input on the bus that we use at caravan parks, it seemed to make no difference.
Is it possible that the freezer cycled on at the same time that I plugged it in and the generator overloaded? The generator is rated at 8 amp.
Any thoughts?
Using the DC output of a generator to charge batteries is like using a D9 grader to make a garden path. It won't do a very good job, and will cost a fortune for what it does.
Cheers,
Peter
You probably have hot water element on or some other 230 volt loads . freezer, battery charger, microwave, jug etc.
Are all the fridges running off 12v
The 1 kva generator only needs to be connected direct to the battery charger to charge the batteries nothing else.
Gary
Does the generator only provide power to one item at a time?
I could plug it in to the Engel (which uses the most power)....
But I thought if I plugged the generator in to the 240 volt input socket it would provide power to anything that was running.
The existing fridge is gas and we don't have many items that use much power, so we have never been concerned about solar / batteries up until now.
But having installed the Engel and seen how much current it draws, we will need to do something more.
That's partly why we are upgrading the batteries.
We are also looking at additional solar panels, but what I was thinking was...
I could use the generator as a backup to run the freezer if we have weather conditions that dont provide much solar.
The Engel website says this unit uses a maximum 4.2 amps, however redarc suggests that the usage is higher than that (I think about 7 amps). Ordinarily the load on the redarc is only about 1 amp, but it jumps to about 8amp when the freezer runs.
-- Edited by Lenny999 on Tuesday 6th of February 2018 12:13:46 PM
Hi Lenny
Perhaps you misunderstood the output of the generator. I believe, (without checking), the generator puts out 1000Watts MAX(only) at the 240V AC outlet which is only 4A AC, and 8 Amps at the 12V DC outlets. Both these outputs may not be run flat out together and both should be reduced for longer use times.
Within the limits as stated it will run whatever you want up to the limit. But if you read some other threads on using generators here you will find that you should be careful about plugging it into the caravan and using multiple items. But perhaps your bus circuit tripped out or the switch/breaker was off.
In theory it should work as you said. I guess the Engel has a 240V to 12/24V dc to run it. So it is not drawing 8 amps at 240 V. Getting confusing ?? To make it worse your bus would be a 24V vehicle system. How is your house battery system set up, 12v x2 or 24V in series ? The Engle might run on either. The bus alternator will provide plenty of power if necessary depending on the setup.
My suggestion is get another panel or two on the roof. The 10 year old ones will be almost as good as new and a check on the connections etc will get them back to scratch if needed. My panels are twice that old and still work OK.
Jaahn
Thanks very much for the comments guys.
I think my first step will be to source some additional solar and then to test drive to see how the new batteries (when installed) cope.
EU10i EU20i
Rated AC output 900Va 1600Va
DC output 12V 8.3A 12V 8.3A
Of course I=P/V confirms that 900Va at 240V gives 4A, but I think I assumed I still had 8.3A. Too small for me.
I don't know why the DC output would be the same for each model but I am just a babe in the woods when it comes to this.
Anything I may have learned at school has long since been forgotten!!
In earlier days I had a Honda e1000. I used the DC output on the car battery to give it a bit of a kick when the innards collapsed & I was in isolated areas of NW WA.