Hi all i have a 21ft caravan and i wont to connect it to home i have a a lead i got with the caravan when i bought it its a second hand caravan i bought the guy used it at his place now i have connected the caravan to to my home and it keeps tripping the house so i thought ok the lead is faulty so i went out and bought a Amphibian box i got home and connected it to the house and than the caravan and to my surprised tripped the house again and now power to the caravan so i thought ok so i went next door to ask if i could connect to there house they said yes ok so i did and to my surprised it tripped there house but when he flicked the switch to turn house on it it dident trip the second time but i dident have power to the caravan this was with the Amphibian box connected i hope i have explained myself ok that everyone understands.
Cheers
-- Edited by Smithy on Monday 16th of April 2018 09:59:52 PM
Bill B said
10:26 PM Apr 16, 2018
Switch off & pull the plug out of the power point for the hot water system in the van and connect the van to the house power again and see what happens.
Your problem can be a sympton of a burnt out element in the HWS.
Jaahn said
08:26 AM Apr 17, 2018
Hi Smithy
You should be careful of that van. Electricity kills ! You must look and see what is tripping off. Is it the overload breaker or is it the earth leakage unit.
If it is only the overload then go through the van and turn everything off. If all appliances and an air conditioner are on, it just might be too much power in a rush as you turn it on. After switching on with them all off, turn the appliances on one at a time to check they are working OK.
If it is the earth leakage in the house tripping them you should get an electrician to look at it before using it again.
Jaahn
Norweb said
08:57 AM Apr 17, 2018
I purchased a van and they put us up in a caravan park for the night to try out as we had only camped before.
Hooked up the lead to the CP power pole and the circuit breaker went off try again same thing, rang the Caravan seller and he sent a person out and they said it was the anode in the hot water system replaced it and never had the problem since.
RustyD said
10:38 AM Apr 17, 2018
House power is only 10A. The van is expecting 15A. You need a step-up transformer. www.ebay.com.au/i/171452731309. The earth plug on a 15A lead won't fit in a 10A plug. If a 15A plug on the end of the van lead has been filed down to fit a 10A, you will have problems.
What is this step up transformer business? Transformers change the voltage supply not current. The page you have shown has a range of power boards on it. There are too many on the forum loosely using the term transformer for things that are not transformers (quite often they are using the term for power supplies.)
RustyD said
12:40 PM Apr 17, 2018
Oops. I should have know better with "transformer". What I was pointing out was "Powertech 15A to 10A Converter / Adapter & RCD suits Caravan 15 Amp to 10 Amp". I have one myself.
Terryt said
03:12 PM Apr 17, 2018
The van is not "expecting" any particular amperage. If all is well it's circuits will take 15 amps if necessary. Connecting the van to a 10 amp outlet will not in itself cause any problems at all. The worst you are doing is supplying less than what it can take. There must be something wrong with the wiring or an appliance in the van
Ron-D said
05:10 PM Apr 17, 2018
When we bought our van first trip out the ,the vans circuit breaker would not hold a load ,the dealer put it down to a faulty power point,they also fitted a new battery charger,but they seemed to think the p,point was the culprit...
RustyD said
05:27 PM Apr 17, 2018
Overloading can also an issue. We've tripped our circuit breakers a few times by simply having too many 240v appliances plugged in and switched on at the same time. We have the HWS, fridge, microwave, one electric stove element, 12v controller plus what is plugged into a bench top power points (TV, toaster, frypan etc.). It all ads up real quick.
Izabarack said
06:33 PM Apr 17, 2018
RustyD wrote:
House power is only 10A. The van is expecting 15A. You need a step-up transformer. www.ebay.com.au/i/171452731309. The earth plug on a 15A lead won't fit in a 10A plug. If a 15A plug on the end of the van lead has been filed down to fit a 10A, you will have problems.
Usual current rating for a house GPO 10 Amps. House power is 230 Volts
A van does not expect anything.
Definitely, absolutely, does NOT need a step-up transformer.
Perhaps you mean the earth pin rather then an earth plug.
Perhaps you mean that if the earth pin on the male end of a 15 Amp rated plug has been filed down to fit into a 10 Amp rated female socket you might be overloading the safety switch by drawing more current than the switch is rated to limit.
This post should be deleted in total.
Iza
Izabarack said
06:42 PM Apr 17, 2018
PeterD wrote:
Transformers change the voltage supply not current.
A 2:1 ratio transformer will similarly change the current capability/rating of the secondary winding. Consider the example of the Step Up auto transformer that is a car coil; several amp rating on the primary and maybe as much as 1 Amp out of the the secondary. A simple, rectified Step-down transformer supply used as a battery charger often puts out up to 25 Amps from a 10 Amp rated 230 Volt supply input.
There is no simple answer to what a transformer can do.
It ALL depends on the transformer design , step up ,step down or current transformer.
Watts output required is part of that design.
Unless specifically designed as a CURRENT transformer [no practical use in the vanner situation] ,more for AC current measurement/ control ,all other transformers are designed as voltage transformers,they simply convert the voltage input to a higher or lower voltage. output.
The ratio of input to output voltage does not determine either the actual max current input or current output..
That is determined by the designed WATTS rating
oldtrack123 said
06:19 PM Apr 18, 2018
Izabarack wrote:
PeterD wrote:
Transformers change the voltage supply not current.
A 2:1 ratio transformer will similarly change the current capability/rating of the secondary winding. Consider the example of the Step Up auto transformer that is a car coil; several amp rating on the primary and maybe as much as 1 Amp out of the the secondary. A simple, rectified Step-down transformer supply used as a battery charger often puts out up to 25 Amps from a 10 Amp rated 230 Volt supply input.
Iza
NO .
a transformer must have three specs
The input voltage V1
The required max output voltage V2
The required power output rating[ Watts ]
The factors in the design determine :
[1]
[a]input voltage[ V1] & max input [A1]
the max output voltage [V2] & rated MAX output current[A2] = the WATTS rating [W]
[2]
V1 & V2 determines the winding turns ratio
A1 To A2 determes the copper winding size ratio
[W]determines the size of the actual input & output winding, & weight of metal laminations
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 18th of April 2018 06:26:17 PM
oldtrack123 said
06:47 PM Apr 18, 2018
Ron-D wrote:
When we bought our van first trip out the ,the vans circuit breaker would not hold a load ,the dealer put it down to a faulty power point,they also fitted a new battery charger,but they seemed to think the p,point was the culprit...
The Dealer did not know what he was talking about
A faulty power point [unless physically having an internal short ]would not trip a circuit breaker
The only things that will trip an overload circuit breaker is excess current[higher than it's rating]
That in most cases is simple overload due to too much being switched on
Only cure is to reduce the load turn off unnecessary devices
IF a RCD [Safety switch tripping ,you have a fault , call a qualified electrician
Of course if the breaker is a combined. RCD /Overload CB, it is more difficult to determine the problem' so start by turning every thing off.
Then switch on one at a time with a few minutes between each If the RCD /OLCBbreaker trips immediately you turn one on ;that one most likely has an earth fault[requires an electrician to repair.
To verify , turn all off again & just turn that one back on ,if it trips stop using & have it inspected /repaired
Carry out as above until you find if overload or fault is the problem
Just bear in mind that if you are connected to a house 10A power outlet you must use an approved adapter such as an Amphibian
However that is only to protect the power outlet you are connected to from overloading.
You could still overload the house wiring circuit to the extent that the OLCB protecting THAT circuit trips, due to that circuit having other loads on it within the house
One thing I should mention is that Circuit breakers do have a limited ,but long , operational life & in time will trip off at less than rated load current .
An electrician can verify if that is the problem.
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 18th of April 2018 06:57:50 PM
Mike Harding said
08:48 PM Apr 18, 2018
oldtrack123 wrote:a transformer must have three specs
The input voltage V1
The required max output voltage V2
The required power output rating[ Watts ]
The factors in the design determine :
[1]
[a]input voltage[ V1] & max input [A1]
the max output voltage [V2] & rated MAX output current[A2] = the WATTS rating [W]
Almost right: transformer power is normally specified as "VA" rather than watts because a power factor of 1 should not be assumed.
There are many other factors to consider in the design eg. isolation capability from pri to sec (critical in medical devices), temperature rise, core saturation etc.
Izabarack said
06:19 AM Apr 19, 2018
oldtrack123 wrote:
NO .
Err, YES! As I have demonstrated to my students many times in the Lab.
As someone said above, here we go again.
Iza
oldtrack123 said
11:25 AM Apr 19, 2018
Mike Harding wrote:
oldtrack123 wrote:a transformer must have three specs
The input voltage V1
The required max output voltage V2
The required power output rating[ Watts ]
The factors in the design determine :
[1]
[a]input voltage[ V1] & max input [A1]
the max output voltage [V2] & rated MAX output current[A2] = the WATTS rating [W]
Almost right: transformer power is normally specified as "VA" rather than watts because a power factor of 1 should not be assumed.
There are many other factors to consider in the design eg. isolation capability from pri to sec (critical in medical devices), temperature rise, core saturation etc.
Agree ,for complete accuracy
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Thursday 19th of April 2018 11:26:54 AM
oldtrack123 said
11:30 AM Apr 19, 2018
oldbloke wrote:
Here we go again.
Shame that some ,it would seem, would rather remain in the dark & use useless terminology
Tony Bev said
12:34 PM Apr 19, 2018
Smithy wrote:
Hi all i have a 21ft caravan and i wont to connect it to home i have a a lead i got with the caravan when i bought it its a second hand caravan i bought the guy used it at his place now i have connected the caravan to to my home and it keeps tripping the house so i thought ok the lead is faulty so i went out and bought a Amphibian box i got home and connected it to the house and than the caravan and to my surprised tripped the house again and now power to the caravan so i thought ok so i went next door to ask if i could connect to there house they said yes ok so i did and to my surprised it tripped there house but when he flicked the switch to turn house on it it dident trip the second time but i dident have power to the caravan this was with the Amphibian box connected i hope i have explained myself ok that everyone understands.
Cheers
-- Edited by Smithy on Monday 16th of April 2018 09:59:52 PM
Hello Smithy
I am not an Electrician, so please feel free to disregard my opinion
My interpretation of your question, is that you are asking what is tripping your house power off, when you connect to your second hand caravan Unfortunately from behind a computer screen, no one can actually see if
Your extension cord is damaged The 240 volt side of your fridge/electric heater/air conditioner are damaged The 240 volt wires inside the caravan wall are damaged Or worse still if someone previously had been playing around, and you now have some crossed 240 volt wires
My opinion is that an Electrician with the correct tools/meters, will easily and safely find the problem, at a much cheaper price than someone being electrocuted. Just remember that you do not have to actually touch a live wire to be electrocuted, any metal which has become live, due to a 240 volt fault elsewhere, can also electrocute you
Please advise whatever the problem was, when it has been rectified
vince56 said
07:48 PM Apr 20, 2018
To the OP, what is happening is dangerous! get an electrician in and let him/her sort it, don't waste time with all the guff!
Aus-Kiwi said
08:49 AM Apr 21, 2018
Yep may have reverse in lead etc . Breakers donât feberally fault because they like too . REASONS !! Check it out as said . No point in spending on things to fix around the problem !
IAN zzz said
11:02 PM Apr 22, 2018
Just a small point. I can sometimes be quite a pedant :)
But I think I have read somewhere ...
Australia's 'official' voltage is 230V, not 240V ...
Stay safe
Aus-Kiwi said
08:48 AM Apr 23, 2018
Actually I used to do voltage servey in north Sydney . It varies from as low as 180 to 250v . Obviously 180v is low . The tranny needs stepping up, larger mains , smaller sub area.. Much the same as our DC batteries . 12 to 14v or there abouts .
oldtrack123 said
10:47 AM Apr 23, 2018
IAN zzz wrote:
Just a small point. I can sometimes be quite a pedant :)
But I think I have read somewhere ...
Australia's 'official' voltage is 230V, not 240V ...
Stay safe
Yes ,That is NOW the "Official " voltage , but you will rarely find that as the actual voltage
Mine was constantly around 254V because we are close to the transformer, which had been set on a high tapping, so those at the end of the looong line got an acceptable voltage[ something like Kiwi found, around 180V ],
Now ,since being upgraded we have a pretty constant 245V
We actual lost of feed back credits from our solar system as it kept shutting down due to the high voltage
Now it very rarely shuts down, due to excess voltage,40 to 50kWhr per day is common
Aus-Kiwi said
11:08 AM Apr 23, 2018
Can also be from poor line neutral . But thatâs another story ! Often at the end of lines in sandy soil where earth to ground is poor .
Hi all i have a 21ft caravan and i wont to connect it to home i have a a lead i got with the caravan when i bought it its a second hand caravan i bought the guy used it at his place now i have connected the caravan to to my home and it keeps tripping the house so i thought ok the lead is faulty so i went out and bought a Amphibian box i got home and connected it to the house and than the caravan and to my surprised tripped the house again and now power to the caravan so i thought ok so i went next door to ask if i could connect to there house they said yes ok so i did and to my surprised it tripped there house but when he flicked the switch to turn house on it it dident trip the second time but i dident have power to the caravan this was with the Amphibian box connected i hope i have explained myself ok that everyone understands.
Cheers
-- Edited by Smithy on Monday 16th of April 2018 09:59:52 PM
Your problem can be a sympton of a burnt out element in the HWS.
Hi Smithy
You should be careful of that van. Electricity kills ! You must look and see what is tripping off. Is it the overload breaker or is it the earth leakage unit.
If it is only the overload then go through the van and turn everything off. If all appliances and an air conditioner are on, it just might be too much power in a rush as you turn it on. After switching on with them all off, turn the appliances on one at a time to check they are working OK.
If it is the earth leakage in the house tripping them you should get an electrician to look at it before using it again.
Jaahn
Hooked up the lead to the CP power pole and the circuit breaker went off try again same thing, rang the Caravan seller and he sent a person out and they said it was the anode in the hot water system replaced it and never had the problem since.
What is this step up transformer business? Transformers change the voltage supply not current. The page you have shown has a range of power boards on it. There are too many on the forum loosely using the term transformer for things that are not transformers (quite often they are using the term for power supplies.)
Oops. I should have know better with "transformer". What I was pointing out was "Powertech 15A to 10A Converter / Adapter & RCD suits Caravan 15 Amp to 10 Amp". I have one myself.
When we bought our van first trip out the ,the vans circuit breaker would not hold a load ,the dealer put it down to a faulty power point,they also fitted a new battery charger,but they seemed to think the p,point was the culprit...
Usual current rating for a house GPO 10 Amps. House power is 230 Volts
A van does not expect anything.
Definitely, absolutely, does NOT need a step-up transformer.
Perhaps you mean the earth pin rather then an earth plug.
Perhaps you mean that if the earth pin on the male end of a 15 Amp rated plug has been filed down to fit into a 10 Amp rated female socket you might be overloading the safety switch by drawing more current than the switch is rated to limit.
This post should be deleted in total.
Iza
A 2:1 ratio transformer will similarly change the current capability/rating of the secondary winding. Consider the example of the Step Up auto transformer that is a car coil; several amp rating on the primary and maybe as much as 1 Amp out of the the secondary. A simple, rectified Step-down transformer supply used as a battery charger often puts out up to 25 Amps from a 10 Amp rated 230 Volt supply input.
Iza
Here we go again.
Yep
There is no simple answer to what a transformer can do.
It ALL depends on the transformer design , step up ,step down or current transformer.
Watts output required is part of that design.
Unless specifically designed as a CURRENT transformer [no practical use in the vanner situation] ,more for AC current measurement/ control ,all other transformers are designed as voltage transformers,they simply convert the voltage input to a higher or lower voltage. output.
The ratio of input to output voltage does not determine either the actual max current input or current output..
That is determined by the designed WATTS rating
NO .
a transformer must have three specs
The input voltage V1
The required max output voltage V2
The required power output rating[ Watts ]
The factors in the design determine :
[1]
[a]input voltage[ V1] & max input [A1]
the max output voltage [V2] & rated MAX output current[A2] = the WATTS rating [W]
[2]
V1 & V2 determines the winding turns ratio
A1 To A2 determes the copper winding size ratio
[W]determines the size of the actual input & output winding, & weight of metal laminations
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 18th of April 2018 06:26:17 PM
A faulty power point [unless physically having an internal short ]would not trip a circuit breaker
The only things that will trip an overload circuit breaker is excess current[higher than it's rating]
That in most cases is simple overload due to too much being switched on
Only cure is to reduce the load turn off unnecessary devices
IF a RCD [Safety switch tripping ,you have a fault , call a qualified electrician
Of course if the breaker is a combined. RCD /Overload CB, it is more difficult to determine the problem' so start by turning every thing off.
Then switch on one at a time with a few minutes between each If the RCD /OLCBbreaker trips immediately you turn one on ;that one most likely has an earth fault[requires an electrician to repair.
To verify , turn all off again & just turn that one back on ,if it trips stop using & have it inspected /repaired
Carry out as above until you find if overload or fault is the problem
Just bear in mind that if you are connected to a house 10A power outlet you must use an approved adapter such as an Amphibian
However that is only to protect the power outlet you are connected to from overloading.
You could still overload the house wiring circuit to the extent that the OLCB protecting THAT circuit trips, due to that circuit having other loads on it within the house
One thing I should mention is that Circuit breakers do have a limited ,but long , operational life & in time will trip off at less than rated load current .
An electrician can verify if that is the problem.
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 18th of April 2018 06:57:50 PM
Almost right: transformer power is normally specified as "VA" rather than watts because a power factor of 1 should not be assumed.
There are many other factors to consider in the design eg. isolation capability from pri to sec (critical in medical devices), temperature rise, core saturation etc.
Err, YES! As I have demonstrated to my students many times in the Lab.
As someone said above, here we go again.
Iza
Agree
,for complete accuracy
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Thursday 19th of April 2018 11:26:54 AM
Shame that some ,it would seem, would rather remain in the dark & use useless terminology
Hello Smithy
I am not an Electrician, so please feel free to disregard my opinion
My interpretation of your question, is that you are asking what is tripping your house power off, when you connect to your second hand caravan
Unfortunately from behind a computer screen, no one can actually see if
Your extension cord is damaged
The 240 volt side of your fridge/electric heater/air conditioner are damaged
The 240 volt wires inside the caravan wall are damaged
Or worse still if someone previously had been playing around, and you now have some crossed 240 volt wires
My opinion is that an Electrician with the correct tools/meters, will easily and safely find the problem, at a much cheaper price than someone being electrocuted.
Just remember that you do not have to actually touch a live wire to be electrocuted, any metal which has become live, due to a 240 volt fault elsewhere, can also electrocute you
Please advise whatever the problem was, when it has been rectified
But I think I have read somewhere ...
Australia's 'official' voltage is 230V, not 240V ...
Stay safe
Yes ,That is NOW the "Official " voltage , but you will rarely find that as the actual voltage
Mine was constantly around 254V because we are close to the transformer, which had been set on a high tapping, so those at the end of the looong line got an acceptable voltage[ something like Kiwi found, around 180V
],
Now ,since being upgraded we have a pretty constant 245V
We actual lost of feed back credits from our solar system as it kept shutting down due to the high voltage
Now it very rarely shuts down, due to excess voltage,40 to 50kWhr per day is common