There is a legal lead available and it has an RVD incorporated (that's why it's legal).
https://www.rvdsafe.com.au/product/rvdsafe-power-lead/
Mike Harding said
06:13 PM Sep 16, 2018
No, you can't buy one... but they are easy to make.... :)
TheHeaths said
06:21 PM Sep 16, 2018
Mike Harding wrote:
No, you can't buy one... but they are easy to make.... :)
Just don't.
Nevd said
06:24 PM Sep 16, 2018
If your van catches fire while plugged into one.............good bye insurance. Soon as I found out, got a proper adaptor (Amfibian)
Nev
EJP said
07:02 PM Sep 16, 2018
I have an Ampfibian adaptor for exactly that reason, when only 10 amp outlets are available, and it works well.. I used to have a 15 amp lead with the earth pin filed down to fit a 10 amp powerpoint but got rid of it, too dangerous and illegal. The ampfibian is waterproof and has a safety switch. I havent had any problems, however while the adaptor will handle normal caravan power loads it may trip out with excessive loads, ie using the a/c plus oven etc together.
Regards EJP
PeterD said
11:57 PM Sep 16, 2018
dabbler wrote:
There is a legal lead available and it has an RVD incorporated (that's why it's legal). https://www.rvdsafe.com.au/product/rvdsafe-power-lead/
I get some mixed advice from that page. In one place it says
If you are using an illegal Cheater Lead, you can replace it with a legal cheater lead, however the RVDSAFE® Power lead gives you the legal features, plus an RVD®
They only seem to have the 10 A to 10 A lead available.
At any rate you already have the power leads available. You only need the Ampfibian, available from Bunnings at a little over $100. Why pay $275 for a new lead? You can get the Ampfibian plus a 20 metrelead from Bunnings and still have plenty of change.
mezza56 said
07:54 AM Sep 17, 2018
An ampfibian is only an RCD it doesn't convert 10 amp to 15 amp
Jaahn said
08:42 AM Sep 17, 2018
mezza56 wrote:
An ampfibian is only an RCD it doesn't convert 10 amp to 15 amp
Hi mezza56
Lets be clear about what these so called "adapters" do. The problem that the OP asked about is the incompatability of the 15A socket/plug and the ordinary 10A socket/plug. This is done for a good reason, and is in the electricity safety standards for our protection. The reason is to prevent the 10A socket being overloaded by the 15A plug and load. It is illegal to construct a device or lead that will allow this safety feature to be overcome.
There are some units made like the Ampfibian that will allow the 15A plug/lead to be used in a 10A socket leagally because they have a current limiter built in to it that protects the 10A socket. So they will 'trip out' if you use more current than 10Aand will never supply 15A. So if you want to use all the power in your caravan like in a caravan park, you cannot use a 10A power socket. But you can carefully use items without any problem possibly except the aircon.
There is no adapter which can plug into a 10A socket and supply 15A to the load. That cannot be done anywhere by any adapter.
An RVD may increase the general safety of using the power but it does not in itself comply with the law if it does not have a 10A overload trip. I am not sure what that site is actually advertising either.
Jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Monday 17th of September 2018 08:47:55 AM
PeterD said
08:44 AM Sep 17, 2018
mezza56 wrote:
An ampfibian is only an RCD it doesn't convert 10 amp to 15 amp
Really! None of those devices "convert 10 amp to 15 amp." The current that you draw through them depsnds upon the load you have on the end of the lead.
The Ampfibians that we commonly use have a 10 A plug to connect to the mains and 15 A socket within them. That 15 A socket allows you to connect your van to a 10 A mains power point with the 15 A power cable that you normally use to connect your van to the mains when you are in a caravan park.
Edit - looks like Jaahn posted whilst I was typing.
-- Edited by PeterD on Monday 17th of September 2018 08:47:35 AM
pinballpat said
10:19 AM Sep 17, 2018
This totally a waste of time, this type of conversation pops up now and then and is frequented by the multitudes with several conflicting answers and I feel that this type of question has more entertainment value than actual Facts and good advice, people quoting Aus Standards, Old Retired Sparkies thinking back to the days when they were in the workforce and quoting Legislations, tips and tricks, possibility of doomsday events like Caravans and Motorhomes burning to the ground, people being Electrocuted and Deaths. I say what a lot of MALARKY my experience has been pulling into a Caravan Park and finding the Rcd Or Circuit breaker Damaged 3 Pin Sockets where they have lost their tension and evidence of severe Arcing that has been going on for a long time and personally having to use the one next door to get some power to my humble mobile abode , Power poles rocking in the ground, other Caravanners with their Power leads all coiled up and submerged in rain pools it goes on and on, The other thing is I am not sure what you people are using in your vehicle that would even Draw 15 Amps like 3.5KW Air Cons or Huge Electric Heaters or Full Size Ovens on for 5Hours producing the Sunday Roast to feed the rest of the Caravan Park ??? I would be very WORRIED if I was drawing 15 amps constant from a 15amp power point EVEN in a Home Environment for any length of time that's a lot of Power. Not Doubt I will Get shot to pieces from my post but I don't mind I am an old bloke a have been around a long time involved in Electronics and I have no fear of Electricity it is your Friend you will find that only people who know Nothing about Electricity Fear it the Rest Use exactly the same as Water out of a Tap, the other interesting thing is that if a person had some Enquiry about some Purported Life Threatening Demon like Electricity WHY would they go to a Forum to Seek Answers? Anyhow I will go Please be Gentle with Me
Peter_n_Margaret said
10:33 AM Sep 17, 2018
pinballpat wrote:
This totally a waste of time, ..
I don't think so.
There are real safety issues involved for reasons that many don't understand (and some irresponsible don't care).
If these discussions can save one life or one insurance claim by the simple act of educating someone, then they are totally worth while.
On that basis if this exact conversation happens every single week, that is fine.
Those that think they know better or know it all need not bother reading.
Cheers,
Peter
dabbler said
12:57 PM Sep 17, 2018
PeterD wrote:
dabbler wrote:
There is a legal lead available and it has an RVD incorporated (that's why it's legal). https://www.rvdsafe.com.au/product/rvdsafe-power-lead/
I get some mixed advice from that page. In one place it says
If you are using an illegal Cheater Lead, you can replace it with a legal cheater lead, however the RVDSAFE® Power lead gives you the legal features, plus an RVD®
They only seem to have the 10 A to 10 A lead available.
At any rate you already have the power leads available. You only need the Ampfibian, available from Bunnings at a little over $100. Why pay $275 for a new lead? You can get the Ampfibian plus a 20 metrelead from Bunnings and still have plenty of change.
There are several options available, just follow the drop down. The page text isn't saying they only have 10/10+RVD, it's saying only they have 10/10+RVD.
The leads they sell are superior to an amfibian+lead, offer greater protection and don't interfere with RCD/RCBO.
Watch their videos and email the company questions if you are interested. I'm not selling them, just providing info on options.
Cost isn't everything but it is the reason people opt to illegally use leads with an earth pin that's been filed down.
Mike Harding said
01:51 PM Sep 17, 2018
pinballpat wrote:
I say what a lot of MALARKY
I agree.
But, look on the positive side, it gives a few people the opportunity to pontificate and they do *so* enjoy that :)
Just wondering: what happens if your caravan is plugged into a 15A outlet in a caravan park but you switch on appliances which draw a total of 20A?
Just wondering: what happens if you have made a 10A/15A lead for your caravan and it's plugged into a 10A outlet and you switch on appliances which draw 15A?
PeterD said
02:03 PM Sep 17, 2018
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
pinballpat wrote:
This totally a waste of time, ..
I don't think so.
I agree. Whilst there are newcomers repeating the question it needs to be answered. Some replies tell them to use the forum aearchfunction but it is fairly useless as too many members do not provide a subject heading that is meaningful. Members seem to like making their heading cryptic which is useless for searching on particular subjects. Newcomers do not know how to use the search function, they can not find any instructions on how to use the forum and thus feel the need to ask the question again.
New members continually ask the reasons for our replies. Rather than await their questions as to why things must or can not be done many of us include the regulations and other sources when we reply. We do that as it shows there is a basis for our reply.
There are many who continually but in with shortcuts and workarounds that are not of sound techniques or legality. If they would but out after being told that their ideas were not safe or not a good idea these threads would not turn into bun fights. Just because they have got away with what they are doing for many years does not make them safe or acceptable.
The laws and regulations do not come about because we have a team of bureaucrats thinking them up. They are introduced because of problems that have occurred in the past. With things electrical, most of those incidents are from failures in the system or deaths. There are not many of the deaths that occur that we are aware of as extremely few of them are reported in the press. Most of those are simply not spectacular for the press to report them. That does not mean that those deaths do not occur just because you do not hear of them. The bodies that formulate the acts, standards and regulations do not consist of shiny bum clerical bureaucrats. The members come from practical people who are employed by electrical companies, the power industry electrical manufacturing companies and the like. As a result, the electrical standards are well thought out and provide a guide for safe working procedures. We should be following them and not aiding or abetting others to not follow them
Jaahn said
05:41 PM Sep 17, 2018
Mike Harding wrote:
pinballpat wrote:
I say what a lot of MALARKY
I agree.
But, look on the positive side, it gives a few people the opportunity to pontificate and they do *so* enjoy that :)
Just wondering: what happens if your caravan is plugged into a 15A outlet in a caravan park but you switch on appliances which draw a total of 20A?
Just wondering: what happens if you have made a 10A/15A lead for your caravan and it's plugged into a 10A outlet and you switch on appliances which draw 15A?
Hi
If you find the topic is a waste of your time then move on !! No compulsion to read it.
I consider that some people less "expert" than yourselves might like to know what is safe and up to the relevent standard ? Others take the attitude f***k you I have always done it with a cheater lead and I always will and will die doing so. Your choice really for you and yours. Perhaps you would like to do a writeup for the OP on how to make a cheater lead ?
Seems reasonable that a couple of people here can say something usefull in a easy read. Others have offered a commercial site to get a alternative item. OK IMHO. Some people do not restrict themselves to a simple easy explanation. That's life on the forums
Cheers jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Monday 17th of September 2018 06:04:41 PM
pinballpat said
06:44 PM Sep 17, 2018
Do you see what I mean these sort of posts just get people to start pounding their keyboards , the old guys beat their chests and try to do one better than the previous post, as I said very entertaining, so here is my attempt all you Guys in Quoting this and Quoting that seem to have lost track of the original Question
" if we stay at friends just want to be able to plug into mains for the night" Well G n E in my opinion The house your plugging into will have a current limit of 16Amps due to the Circuit Breaker installed in the switchboard which will feed your Camper and anything else on that line in the house , it should also have a RCD fitted to the switchboard for added protection (depending on how your van is wired) so my thoughts are if you know that you are sharing power with the home owner then you will limit the amount of current you draw for fear of popping his Circuit Breaker You will not have the 3.5Kw air con on and the 2.5Kw heater and the full size Oven and the Electric Jug all on together or else you will destroy the guys Lawn walking backwards and forwards to the house switchboard resetting his constantly tripping Circuit Breaker . In saying that I would suggest you get a cheaper "Cheater Adapter" which probably should not cost you more than 20 Buckos and be mindful of the power you draw during your short Stay at your friends Place.
Bush walker said
07:40 PM Sep 17, 2018
Just do what I have done buy a 10amp male plug and a 25amp female plug and put them together on a short lead and make your own adapter
Blues Man said
07:02 AM Sep 18, 2018
Is that legal !!!
PeterD said
07:22 AM Sep 18, 2018
No!
Aus-Kiwi said
09:24 AM Sep 18, 2018
Two 15 amp with adapted filled earth to fit in 10 amp plug . Is it legal . No ! There should be a 15 amp power point . That SHOULD be on its own circuit . Dont use toaster , elect frying pan and elect jug all at the same time .. There are RCD power points if theres no residual current device in house or on that circuit .,
oldtrack123 said
10:19 PM Sep 19, 2018
Bush walker wrote:
Just do what I have done buy a 10amp male plug and a 25amp female plug and put them together on a short lead and make your own adapter
OOoh , you are a really clever man
Hope that you wake up before you burn something down Obviously you have the same disregard for road rules & all other regulations
oldtrack123 said
10:46 PM Sep 19, 2018
pinballpat wrote:
" you see what I mean these sort of posts just get people to start pounding their keyboards , the old guys beat their chests and try to do one better than the previous post, as I said very entertaining, so here is my attempt all you Guys in Quoting this and Quoting that seem to have lost track of the original Question"
Obviously not electrically qualified & just spouting an opinion, not based on facts
The Standards are there to protect people from fools & would be experts
Fact 1 the so-called cheater leads are not allowed, no electrician who valued his license would make one up because:
[a] He knows that they can easily be misused by people who have no understanding of the limitations of a 10A switch & outlet
He knows that if he was found to have made one up for someone, his licence could be suspended & fines imposed
[c]Any shop selling such could be heavily fined for selling non approved electrical equipment
Yet despite all that you think it is all just a joke
oldtrack123 said
10:47 PM Sep 19, 2018
Blues Man wrote:
Is that legal !!!
No No No
oldtrack123 said
10:50 PM Sep 19, 2018
Mike Harding wrote:
No, you can't buy one... but they are easy to make.... :)
Irresponsible answer!!!
Mike Harding said
09:56 AM Sep 20, 2018
oldtrack123 wrote:
Mike Harding wrote:
No, you can't buy one... but they are easy to make.... :)
Irresponsible answer!!!
No it isn't.
Peter_n_Margaret said
11:27 AM Sep 20, 2018
Yes it is. I wonder if people promoting illegal and unsafe practices are happy to take legal and moral responsibility for their ill considered advise, because some day that might need to. Cheers, Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Thursday 20th of September 2018 11:28:06 AM
Mike Harding said
02:16 PM Sep 20, 2018
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Yes it is.
No it isn't.
Aus-Kiwi said
02:32 PM Sep 20, 2018
Here we go again . There is a product to allow this ., If it is at your home ? Best to fit 15 amp power point in your meter board . With RCD, breaker etc
Just wondering if you can buy an electric lead which has 15 amp pin plug one end and 10amp pin plug the other...
We have a Palamino backpack slide on camper and if we stay at friends just want to be able to plug into mains for the night.
Thankyou
They are illegal, and for very good safety reasons.
You need an approved adaptor.
ampfibian.com.au/product/rv-plus-15a-caravan-power-adaptor/
Cheers,
Peter
No, you can't buy one... but they are easy to make.... :)
Just don't.
If your van catches fire while plugged into one.............good bye insurance. Soon as I found out, got a proper adaptor (Amfibian)
Nev
Regards EJP
I get some mixed advice from that page. In one place it says
and further down it says:
They only seem to have the 10 A to 10 A lead available.
At any rate you already have the power leads available. You only need the Ampfibian, available from Bunnings at a little over $100. Why pay $275 for a new lead? You can get the Ampfibian plus a 20 metrelead from Bunnings and still have plenty of change.
An ampfibian is only an RCD it doesn't convert 10 amp to 15 amp
Hi mezza56
Lets be clear about what these so called "adapters" do. The problem that the OP asked about is the incompatability of the 15A socket/plug and the ordinary 10A socket/plug. This is done for a good reason, and is in the electricity safety standards for our protection. The reason is to prevent the 10A socket being overloaded by the 15A plug and load. It is illegal to construct a device or lead that will allow this safety feature to be overcome.
There are some units made like the Ampfibian that will allow the 15A plug/lead to be used in a 10A socket leagally because they have a current limiter built in to it that protects the 10A socket. So they will 'trip out' if you use more current than 10Aand will never supply 15A. So if you want to use all the power in your caravan like in a caravan park, you cannot use a 10A power socket. But you can carefully use items without any problem possibly except the aircon.
There is no adapter which can plug into a 10A socket and supply 15A to the load. That cannot be done anywhere by any adapter.
An RVD may increase the general safety of using the power but it does not in itself comply with the law if it does not have a 10A overload trip. I am not sure what that site is actually advertising either.
Jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Monday 17th of September 2018 08:47:55 AM
Really! None of those devices "convert 10 amp to 15 amp." The current that you draw through them depsnds upon the load you have on the end of the lead.
The Ampfibians that we commonly use have a 10 A plug to connect to the mains and 15 A socket within them. That 15 A socket allows you to connect your van to a 10 A mains power point with the 15 A power cable that you normally use to connect your van to the mains when you are in a caravan park.
Edit - looks like Jaahn posted whilst I was typing.
-- Edited by PeterD on Monday 17th of September 2018 08:47:35 AM
This totally a waste of time, this type of conversation pops up now and then and is frequented by the multitudes with several conflicting answers and I feel that this type of question has more entertainment value than actual Facts and good advice, people quoting Aus Standards, Old Retired Sparkies thinking back to the days when they were in the workforce and quoting Legislations, tips and tricks, possibility of doomsday events like Caravans and Motorhomes burning to the ground, people being Electrocuted and Deaths. I say what a lot of MALARKY my experience has been pulling into a Caravan Park and finding the Rcd Or Circuit breaker Damaged 3 Pin Sockets where they have lost their tension and evidence of severe Arcing that has been going on for a long time and personally having to use the one next door to get some power to my humble mobile abode , Power poles rocking in the ground, other Caravanners with their Power leads all coiled up and submerged in rain pools it goes on and on, The other thing is I am not sure what you people are using in your vehicle that would even Draw 15 Amps like 3.5KW Air Cons or Huge Electric Heaters or Full Size Ovens on for 5Hours producing the Sunday Roast to feed the rest of the Caravan Park ??? I would be very WORRIED if I was drawing 15 amps constant from a 15amp power point EVEN in a Home Environment for any length of time that's a lot of Power. Not Doubt I will Get shot to pieces from my post but I don't mind I am an old bloke a have been around a long time involved in Electronics and I have no fear of Electricity it is your Friend you will find that only people who know Nothing about Electricity Fear it the Rest Use exactly the same as Water out of a Tap, the other interesting thing is that if a person had some Enquiry about some Purported Life Threatening Demon like Electricity WHY would they go to a Forum to Seek Answers? Anyhow I will go Please be Gentle with Me
I don't think so.
There are real safety issues involved for reasons that many don't understand (and some irresponsible don't care).
If these discussions can save one life or one insurance claim by the simple act of educating someone, then they are totally worth while.
On that basis if this exact conversation happens every single week, that is fine.
Those that think they know better or know it all need not bother reading.
Cheers,
Peter
There are several options available, just follow the drop down. The page text isn't saying they only have 10/10+RVD, it's saying only they have 10/10+RVD.
The leads they sell are superior to an amfibian+lead, offer greater protection and don't interfere with RCD/RCBO.
Watch their videos and email the company questions if you are interested. I'm not selling them, just providing info on options.
Cost isn't everything but it is the reason people opt to illegally use leads with an earth pin that's been filed down.
I agree.
But, look on the positive side, it gives a few people the opportunity to pontificate and they do *so* enjoy that :)
Just wondering: what happens if your caravan is plugged into a 15A outlet in a caravan park but you switch on appliances which draw a total of 20A?
Just wondering: what happens if you have made a 10A/15A lead for your caravan and it's plugged into a 10A outlet and you switch on appliances which draw 15A?
I agree. Whilst there are newcomers repeating the question it needs to be answered. Some replies tell them to use the forum aearchfunction but it is fairly useless as too many members do not provide a subject heading that is meaningful. Members seem to like making their heading cryptic which is useless for searching on particular subjects. Newcomers do not know how to use the search function, they can not find any instructions on how to use the forum and thus feel the need to ask the question again.
New members continually ask the reasons for our replies. Rather than await their questions as to why things must or can not be done many of us include the regulations and other sources when we reply. We do that as it shows there is a basis for our reply.
There are many who continually but in with shortcuts and workarounds that are not of sound techniques or legality. If they would but out after being told that their ideas were not safe or not a good idea these threads would not turn into bun fights. Just because they have got away with what they are doing for many years does not make them safe or acceptable.
The laws and regulations do not come about because we have a team of bureaucrats thinking them up. They are introduced because of problems that have occurred in the past. With things electrical, most of those incidents are from failures in the system or deaths. There are not many of the deaths that occur that we are aware of as extremely few of them are reported in the press. Most of those are simply not spectacular for the press to report them. That does not mean that those deaths do not occur just because you do not hear of them. The bodies that formulate the acts, standards and regulations do not consist of shiny bum clerical bureaucrats. The members come from practical people who are employed by electrical companies, the power industry electrical manufacturing companies and the like. As a result, the electrical standards are well thought out and provide a guide for safe working procedures. We should be following them and not aiding or abetting others to not follow them
Hi
If you find the topic is a waste of your time then move on !! No compulsion to read it.
I consider that some people less "expert" than yourselves might like to know what is safe and up to the relevent standard ? Others take the attitude f***k you I have always done it with a cheater lead and I always will and will die doing so. Your choice really for you and yours.
Perhaps you would like to do a writeup for the OP on how to make a cheater lead ?
Seems reasonable that a couple of people here can say something usefull in a easy read. Others have offered a commercial site to get a alternative item. OK IMHO. Some people do not restrict themselves to a simple easy explanation. That's life on the forums
Cheers jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Monday 17th of September 2018 06:04:41 PM
Do you see what I mean these sort of posts just get people to start pounding their keyboards , the old guys beat their chests and try to do one better than the previous post, as I said very entertaining, so here is my attempt all you Guys in Quoting this and Quoting that seem to have lost track of the original Question
" if we stay at friends just want to be able to plug into mains for the night" Well G n E in my opinion The house your plugging into will have a current limit of 16Amps due to the Circuit Breaker installed in the switchboard which will feed your Camper and anything else on that line in the house , it should also have a RCD fitted to the switchboard for added protection (depending on how your van is wired) so my thoughts are if you know that you are sharing power with the home owner then you will limit the amount of current you draw for fear of popping his Circuit Breaker You will not have the 3.5Kw air con on and the 2.5Kw heater and the full size Oven and the Electric Jug all on together or else you will destroy the guys Lawn walking backwards and forwards to the house switchboard resetting his constantly tripping Circuit Breaker . In saying that I would suggest you get a cheaper "Cheater Adapter" which probably should not cost you more than 20 Buckos and be mindful of the power you draw during your short Stay at your friends Place.
Just do what I have done buy a 10amp male plug and a 25amp female plug and put them together on a short lead and make your own adapter
Is that legal !!!
OOoh , you are a really clever man
Hope that you wake up before you burn something down Obviously you have the same disregard for road rules & all other regulations
Obviously not electrically qualified & just spouting an opinion, not based on facts
The Standards are there to protect people from fools & would be experts
Fact 1 the so-called cheater leads are not allowed, no electrician who valued his license would make one up because:
[a] He knows that they can easily be misused by people who have no understanding of the limitations of a 10A switch & outlet
He knows that if he was found to have made one up for someone, his licence could be suspended & fines imposed
[c]Any shop selling such could be heavily fined for selling non approved electrical equipment
Yet despite all that you think it is all just a joke
No No No
Irresponsible answer!!!
No it isn't.
Yes it is.
I wonder if people promoting illegal and unsafe practices are happy to take legal and moral responsibility for their ill considered advise, because some day that might need to.
Cheers,
Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Thursday 20th of September 2018 11:28:06 AM
No it isn't.