Looking at purchasing an Inverter. The items that will be powered from it are: A 150w coffee grinder, a battery charger for a Dyson portable vacuum cleaner, a battery charger for an Olympus Stylus camera (both lithium), and a Surface Pro Computer.
Will a modified sine wave do, or should I go for a pure sine wave.
outlaw40 said
10:44 AM Dec 31, 2018
definitely pure sine wave for the computer .
Leshill said
10:58 AM Dec 31, 2018
And all other batteries will be better on pure sine wave.
markf said
11:50 AM Dec 31, 2018
We use a 500W pure sine wave inverter and it meets all our needs which are similar to yours.
Some switch mode power supplies and battery chargers object to modified sine wave inverters and let you know by going belly up.
Looking at purchasing an Inverter. The items that will be powered from it are: A 150w coffee grinder, a battery charger for a Dyson portable vacuum cleaner, a battery charger for an Olympus Stylus camera (both lithium), and a Surface Pro Computer.
Will a modified sine wave do, or should I go for a pure sine wave.
Hi Iana
I spent nearly 2 years reading, asking, trying to learn what I needed in the way of what size inverter to purchase. I was told all sorts of things, sounded really so hard, to small, to big.
Then one day I was sitting up in the bush in the sun wringing the clothes out by hand and my hands were hurting, old age, a thought come to me, the washing machine down the back of the caravan doing nothing, to spin these clothes. Bingo a real plan.
It needed 320 watts to run the spinner, simple we will buy a 500 watt that was on special at a spare part place, spoke with a techie, showed him the add, for $35 more I could have a 1000 watt pure swine inverter. The accountant wife said buy the larger one, "you always buy under size and regrett".
It is now wired in to the batteries, fixed to the wallmof the caravan out of hams way and a no brainer to use. Why didn'tbI do it sooner?????
Our 1000 watt inverter is about 4 times heavier then my original now redundant 15 year old 150 watt inverter that I been using to change the lap top and small appliances.
I am away from home to check but I think 1000 watt was $275 from Repco on special. I do have a friend who has a 750 and a 1500 square ones which he has been casually using now for 8 from the same outlet. Happy chappie.
We have done only one wash and half a dozen spin dries so far, it works a treat. Best money spent.
I agree with Terry here. You should buy a quality unit like a Victron and if you look at the specs it has a max output of double the rated power to get things started. And it has very low standby power when not being used. The sine wave output will suit any use you might need. With a quality well self protected unit you do not need a much bigger one that uses more power. That one should last you well for that use most likely.
Jaahn
iana said
10:12 PM Dec 31, 2018
Thanks Guys, that information is exactly what I wanted.
Roy E said
11:24 PM Jan 2, 2019
Ian,
I have fitted in my van, a Giandel 300w pure sine wave inverter.
It works perfectly and has for 2 years. My friends have same one in their van working perfectly for 18 months.
If you have money to throw away, go for the Victron at 4 to 5 times the cost of the Giandel.
I'll put the Giandel, E-Bay URL below.
Cheers,
Roy.
My suggestion would be to look at the 12V wiring for your inverter also. The cheap ones usually have smaller than optimum(crap !) 12V wires supplied and the cig socket plugs are hopeless. So get some good wire, double the copper gauge size and proper crimp connections and wire it close to the battery. This will give excellent long term results and trouble free for life.
Jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Thursday 3rd of January 2019 01:27:40 PM
iana said
07:19 PM Jan 3, 2019
Question time, just wait while I don my flak jacket and steel helmet! is it OK to use an extension cord from the inverter into the 15A socket outside the van, so 240v is available at the 240v outlets, provided one, only uses the low amperage / wattage appliances not beyond the inverters capacity?
I am running for my fox hole noooooooooow
Radar said
08:13 PM Jan 3, 2019
iana wrote:
Question time, just wait while I don my flak jacket and steel helmet! is it OK to use an extension cord from the inverter into the 15A socket outside the van, so 240v is available at the 240v outlets, provided one, only uses the low amperage / wattage appliances not beyond the inverters capacity?
I am running for my fox hole noooooooooow
I have previously asked this question on this forum and found the general answer was no.
But like you I wear a flak jacket also. One or two answers I got from working licensed electricians was there really is not anything stopping you really but the lrules state not recommended.
-- Edited by Radar on Friday 4th of January 2019 04:34:21 PM
Baz421 said
08:50 PM Jan 3, 2019
iana wrote:
Question time, just wait while I don my flak jacket and steel helmet! is it OK to use an extension cord from the inverter into the 15A socket outside the van, so 240v is available at the 240v outlets, provided one, only uses the low amperage / wattage appliances not beyond the inverters capacity?
I am running for my fox hole noooooooooow
Yes it is. Been doing this for 10 years, only problem is you can only connect 1 Class one elec appliance (ie 3 pin plug earthed) at a time otherwise is dangerous.
IF like me you fit an RVD as well as the standard RCD you are fully protected.
Oldtrack knows more on this and was up to date with regs etc,,, but above is the guts of the argument.
Eaglemax said
12:17 PM Jan 4, 2019
An inverters capacity is important. I purchased a 300W one. I only wanted to plug in a 12amp smart charger. 12amps x 12 volts = 240 Watts. But since then I wanted to buy a 20 or 25 amp smart charger. 12volts x 25 amps = 300 watts...on the limit. Better to pay for a 1000W inverter in the first place imo. Hope I'm right with my calculations :)
T1 Terry said
12:45 PM Jan 4, 2019
Baz421 wrote:
iana wrote:
Question time, just wait while I don my flak jacket and steel helmet! is it OK to use an extension cord from the inverter into the 15A socket outside the van, so 240v is available at the 240v outlets, provided one, only uses the low amperage / wattage appliances not beyond the inverters capacity?
I am running for my fox hole noooooooooow
Yes it is. Been doing this for 10 years, only problem is you can only connect 1 Class one elec appliance (ie 3 pin plug earthed) at a time otherwise is dangerous.
IF like me you fit an RVD as well as the standard RCD you are fully protected.
Oldtrack knows more on this and was up to date with regs etc,,, but above is the guts of the argument.
The only other thing to add is the RV itself is the class 1 appliance because it has the earth pin connected to the metal body. This means without either a method of linking the neutral to the earth after the socket on the side of the van so the already installed RCD becomes operational, or, an RVD is also installed so voltage is sensed on the earth circuit rather than current, you have no protection against an accidental connection across the two live wires coming from the inverter. The inverter would just see you as another appliance and attempt to power you up.
It gets even more tricky, if one of the live wires from the inverter makes a circuit with the metal body anywhere that the whole body is a part of that live wire circuit. Now you only need to come into contact with the other live wire and any part of the metal body and you become an appliance.
The news had been flooded recently with the $1m payout by the Qld govt to the victim who became an appliance when she touched a water pipe/tap that was connected to the other live wire, the ground she was standing on was already connect to one live wire via the earth/neutral link.
T1 Terry
oldtrack123 said
05:25 PM Jan 5, 2019
JUst to clarify some points in Terry's excellent post
There is nothing that can protect you from an electrical shock/electrocution,if you make contact between both lines of a double insulated supply source[Standards approved generator or inverter] or active to neutral of mains supply.
As Terry has nicely said, it will just see you as an appliance & give you all that your body can take
The other point to understand is that full RCD protection of all circuits in new houses has only been a mandatory requirement since Dec 2018 [ New Standard came into force] & many /most older houses will not have any RCD protection. [in Qld it is estimated to be around 33% of all houses]
As an indication of how the Standards are revised due to incidents the case of the woman mentioned in T1 post has now been covered by a Standards revision/Amendment
All such taps etc that are isolated from the main earthing system[ supplied by non metallic water piping] must now be individually electrically bonded to the mains earthing system for effective rcd operation..
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 5th of January 2019 05:48:49 PM
Looking at purchasing an Inverter. The items that will be powered from it are: A 150w coffee grinder, a battery charger for a Dyson portable vacuum cleaner, a battery charger for an Olympus Stylus camera (both lithium), and a Surface Pro Computer.
Will a modified sine wave do, or should I go for a pure sine wave.
We use a 500W pure sine wave inverter and it meets all our needs which are similar to yours.
Some switch mode power supplies and battery chargers object to modified sine wave inverters and let you know by going belly up.
www.ebay.com.au/itm/Victron-12V-375VA-Pure-Sine-Wave-Phoenix-Inverter-5-YEAR-WARRANTY/271874512522~d:rk:14:pf:0
T1 Terry
Hi Iana
I spent nearly 2 years reading, asking, trying to learn what I needed in the way of what size inverter to purchase. I was told all sorts of things, sounded really so hard, to small, to big.
Then one day I was sitting up in the bush in the sun wringing the clothes out by hand and my hands were hurting, old age, a thought come to me, the washing machine down the back of the caravan doing nothing, to spin these clothes. Bingo a real plan.
It needed 320 watts to run the spinner, simple we will buy a 500 watt that was on special at a spare part place, spoke with a techie, showed him the add, for $35 more I could have a 1000 watt pure swine inverter. The accountant wife said buy the larger one, "you always buy under size and regrett".
It is now wired in to the batteries, fixed to the wallmof the caravan out of hams way and a no brainer to use. Why didn'tbI do it sooner?????
Our 1000 watt inverter is about 4 times heavier then my original now redundant 15 year old 150 watt inverter that I been using to change the lap top and small appliances.
I am away from home to check but I think 1000 watt was $275 from Repco on special. I do have a friend who has a 750 and a 1500 square ones which he has been casually using now for 8 from the same outlet. Happy chappie.
We have done only one wash and half a dozen spin dries so far, it works a treat. Best money spent.
I hope this is of some help. Ralph.
Hi Iana
I agree with Terry here. You should buy a quality unit like a Victron and if you look at the specs it has a max output of double the rated power to get things started. And it has very low standby power when not being used. The sine wave output will suit any use you might need. With a quality well self protected unit you do not need a much bigger one that uses more power. That one should last you well for that use most likely.
Jaahn
I have fitted in my van, a Giandel 300w pure sine wave inverter.
It works perfectly and has for 2 years. My friends have same one in their van working perfectly for 18 months.
If you have money to throw away, go for the Victron at 4 to 5 times the cost of the Giandel.
I'll put the Giandel, E-Bay URL below.
Cheers,
Roy.
www.ebay.com.au/itm/GIANDEL-Pure-Sine-Wave-Power-Inverter-300W-600W-12VDC-240VAC-CARAVAN-BOAT/331279407166~1Z9sGT:rk:1:pf:0
Hi Iana
My suggestion would be to look at the 12V wiring for your inverter also. The cheap ones usually have smaller than optimum(crap !) 12V wires supplied and the cig socket plugs are hopeless. So get some good wire, double the copper gauge size and proper crimp connections and wire it close to the battery. This will give excellent long term results and trouble free for life.
Jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Thursday 3rd of January 2019 01:27:40 PM
I am running for my fox hole noooooooooow
I have previously asked this question on this forum and found the general answer was no.
But like you I wear a flak jacket also. One or two answers I got from working licensed electricians was there really is not anything stopping you really but the lrules state not recommended.
-- Edited by Radar on Friday 4th of January 2019 04:34:21 PM
Yes it is. Been doing this for 10 years, only problem is you can only connect 1 Class one elec appliance (ie 3 pin plug earthed) at a time otherwise is dangerous.
IF like me you fit an RVD as well as the standard RCD you are fully protected.
Oldtrack knows more on this and was up to date with regs etc,,, but above is the guts of the argument.
The only other thing to add is the RV itself is the class 1 appliance because it has the earth pin connected to the metal body. This means without either a method of linking the neutral to the earth after the socket on the side of the van so the already installed RCD becomes operational, or, an RVD is also installed so voltage is sensed on the earth circuit rather than current, you have no protection against an accidental connection across the two live wires coming from the inverter. The inverter would just see you as another appliance and attempt to power you up.
It gets even more tricky, if one of the live wires from the inverter makes a circuit with the metal body anywhere that the whole body is a part of that live wire circuit. Now you only need to come into contact with the other live wire and any part of the metal body and you become an appliance.
The news had been flooded recently with the $1m payout by the Qld govt to the victim who became an appliance when she touched a water pipe/tap that was connected to the other live wire, the ground she was standing on was already connect to one live wire via the earth/neutral link.
T1 Terry
JUst to clarify some points in Terry's excellent post
There is nothing that can protect you from an electrical shock/electrocution,if you make contact between both lines of a double insulated supply source[Standards approved generator or inverter] or active to neutral of mains supply.
As Terry has nicely said, it will just see you as an appliance & give you all that your body can take
The other point to understand is that full RCD protection of all circuits in new houses has only been a mandatory requirement since Dec 2018 [ New Standard came into force] & many /most older houses will not have any RCD protection. [in Qld it is estimated to be around 33% of all houses]
As an indication of how the Standards are revised due to incidents the case of the woman mentioned in T1 post has now been covered by a Standards revision/Amendment
All such taps etc that are isolated from the main earthing system[ supplied by non metallic water piping] must now be individually electrically bonded to the mains earthing system for effective rcd operation..
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 5th of January 2019 05:48:49 PM