It look as though NSW has made changes for GVM upgrades as of the 20th of April, it looks as though the maximum upgrade is limited to the sum total of the axle weights regardless of suspension modifications, unless the axles are upgraded to a higher rate. The other catch is if you want to register an interstate registered vehicle, with a GVM upgrade from interstate in NSW, that upgrade would be null and void and the GVM would be limited to the mass of the axle weights.
Greg 1 said
08:19 PM May 10, 2020
Well it has suprised me that these so called upgrades do not seem to take into consideration the axle capacity of the vehicle. The manufacturer fits an axle to provide for the maximum load capacities that the manufacturer has calculated the vehicle can safely carry, and then along comes some suspension joint that thinks they know better, bolts new springs etc to the thing and says it can carry a heap more.
I can understand if the after market joint upgrades the axles as well, but that seems to be the exception to the rule.
The move by NSW seems logical to me and may force some of these upgrades to be done properly with larger capacity axles.
DMaxer said
09:43 AM May 11, 2020
Just use a WDH and problem solved.
-- Edited by DMaxer on Monday 11th of May 2020 12:27:53 PM
Greg 1 said
10:16 AM May 11, 2020
A WDH doesn't allow you to carry more. You are still restricted to what limits are placed on your rig by the manufacturers of the car and van.
All a WDH does is redistrubutes a small amount of the weight off the back axle of the car.
yobarr said
10:21 AM May 11, 2020
Gundog wrote:
It look as though NSW has made changes for GVM upgrades as of the 20th of April, it looks as though the maximum upgrade is limited to the sum total of the axle weights regardless of suspension modifications, unless the axles are upgraded to a higher rate. The other catch is if you want to register an interstate registered vehicle, with a GVM upgrade from interstate in NSW, that upgrade would be null and void and the GVM would be limited to the mass of the axle weights.
Yay...at last a bit of common sense is introduced! As Greg says,adding new bolts and springs etc to allow the carrying of a heavier load seems pointless without upgrading axles too? Luckily the 79 series Cruiser has good axle ratings from new,so easy to get a 3780kg GVM upgrade,but if Graham's posts above is indeed true,there are going to be many vehicles, including the ubiquitous LC200,that are ineligible for GVM upgrades in NSW.At least now their owners,who don't really understand weights,will no longer be spending thousands of dollars to gain a miserable 50kg carrying capacity on the rear axle.And a WDH won't help either,as until it is tensioned,it adds even more weight to the rear axle,as well as increasing towball overhang.But that's a different story.....Cheers
yobarr said
10:22 AM May 11, 2020
Greg 1 wrote:
A WDH doesn't allow you to carry more. You are still restricted to what limits are placed on your rig by the manufacturers of the car and van. All a WDH does is redistrubutes a small amount of the weight off the back axle of the car.
Absolutely true....good post Greg.Cheers
DMaxer said
12:27 PM May 11, 2020
It was a joke Greg. Sorry you took it seriously.
Gundog said
02:41 PM May 11, 2020
My Ranger has a GVM of 2951kg, using the new NSW rules I could get an upgrade without changing anything as to the sum total of the GAWR [1430 & 1850] 3280kg.
But the pitfall here is the GCM dosn't change, and the ball weight must not exceed 10% of the towed load, and if the ball weight is higher than 180kg a WDH must be ued, thus the whole exercise would be a waste of time and money.
Dougwe said
03:11 PM May 11, 2020
DMaxer wrote:
It was a joke Greg. Sorry you took it seriously.
You stirrer you, DM.
I can smell popcorn popping.
-- Edited by Dougwe on Monday 11th of May 2020 03:11:50 PM
DMaxer said
04:23 PM May 11, 2020
Yes Doug, good idea.
I will get the generator revved up and make some myself.
iana said
04:44 PM May 11, 2020
I'm outta town, and don't have any pop corn !!
yobarr said
05:04 PM May 11, 2020
DMaxer wrote:
It was a joke Greg. Sorry you took it seriously.
Don't worry....I quickly recognised it as a 'stir',so I decided to play along with it too! Cheers
Greg 1 said
08:07 PM May 11, 2020
Well I had a feeling you maybe stirring the pot, but if some new chum read that they could well run off believing that a WDH was their saviour to a weight problem, so I felt compelled to reply.
Old and Grey said
08:38 PM May 11, 2020
Answer. Sell your toys and Man UP!
Buy a second hand Kenworth K108 Big Cab.
26000kg GVM / 90000kg GCM 600HP.
Take your van, Car and boat, Quad bike, Motor bike. Push Bike for wife.
Grey.
And still have room for the Wife.
oldbloke said
11:45 PM May 13, 2020
Gundog wrote:
It look as though NSW has made changes for GVM upgrades as of the 20th of April, it looks as though the maximum upgrade is limited to the sum total of the axle weights regardless of suspension modifications, unless the axles are upgraded to a higher rate. The other catch is if you want to register an interstate registered vehicle, with a GVM upgrade from interstate in NSW, that upgrade would be null and void and the GVM would be limited to the mass of the axle weights.
Well, no expert here. But simply amazed that overloading the axle was ever lawfully permitted. Contary to basic engineering principles.
Something else for the equation - the rating of the wheels!
My Patrol - I couldn't find what they were rated at but when I found a cracked wheel on the van, I discovered the wheels were rated at 1000kg MAX! So for a single axled van as mine is, the total safe load is 2000kg.
And to see how Jayco rate things, my ATM is 1950kg
travelyounger said
06:36 AM May 16, 2020
Hi all don't throw your paperwork out just yet NSW RMS have just suspended the suspension on upgrades 'pardon the pun' until a later date maybe the RMS and superannuation are the same dept they change the rules just when you have things sorted popcorn anyone
deverall11 said
04:41 PM May 17, 2020
Gundog wrote:
It look as though NSW has made changes for GVM upgrades as of the 20th of April, it looks as though the maximum upgrade is limited to the sum total of the axle weights regardless of suspension modifications, unless the axles are upgraded to a higher rate. The other catch is if you want to register an interstate registered vehicle, with a GVM upgrade from interstate in NSW, that upgrade would be null and void and the GVM would be limited to the mass of the axle weights.
Does this mean that if you have an interstate registered vehicle with such an upgrade, you are illegal in NSW?
When we have a national system, given that we can go in and out of any states or territory, this will have more credibility.
Whilst I agree with some of the comments, this NSW ruling sounds like some bureaucrat with too much time on his/her had to
justify their emplyoment.
Larry
Peter_n_Margaret said
05:41 PM May 17, 2020
deverall11 wrote:
Does this mean that if you have an interstate registered vehicle with such an upgrade, you are illegal in NSW?
You can drive in NSW, but if you sell the vehicle to someone who lives there it may not get approval for the upgrade. Then it will revert to the original GVM.
But even that may not be the case. It depends when your upgrade was dated and if NSW accept interstate approvals prior to the April introduction of the new regs, or not.
Cheers,
Peter
Greg 1 said
05:44 PM May 17, 2020
Good luck getting a national system. The various States won't relinquish control for that.
We have wanted a national system for Individually Constructed Vehicles such as that shown in my avatar. The system for that is a complete mess with every State being different in their rules, NSW being the worst. No State is willing to give up their power for a federally run system which is the only way you can get consistency across the board. They brought out what was supposed to be a set of rules nationally but each State interpretation of them is wildly different and with their own additions and subtractions.
If you think that it will be any different for GVM upgrades you are dreaming.
travelyounger said
06:25 PM May 17, 2020
NSW registered vehicles with upgrades are legal in all states of Australia . If you sell to some one interstate under second stage manufacturer the upgrade would have to re engineered to be registered in the new state .Every state or territory has there own allowances for gvm and some do not allow gvm or gcm or both just to make it more confusing
BruDi said
04:38 PM May 18, 2020
Below is from Lovells.
FEDERAL COMPLIANCE: New vehicles must be fitted prior to registration. They are simply then registered with a revised GVM as per the new compliance plate.
Vehicles which are already registered cannot be fitted with a kit under this Federal Approval.
STATE COMPLIANCE: GVM Upgrades can be fitted to already registered vehicles in NSW, ACT, Victoria, Queensland, South Australia, Northern Territory and Western Australia only, and after modification, will have to be inspected by a Lovells nominated State Engineering Signatory. Extra Cost for Inspection and documents will be incurred.
We had our 200 Series upgraded before we took delivery and before registration.
Di
Cyclops said
10:06 AM May 27, 2020
Had our NSW registered 200 series Lovells GVM upgrade a week ago at Wodonga Spring works. Took the vehicle to The Engineer in Melbourne. They did a thorough inspection, took photos, and issued a compliance plate for GVM of 3800 kg and GCM of 7300kg. Took the paperwork to Roads and was issued with a new registration certificate stating the new maximum GVM.
Just use a WDH and problem solved.
-- Edited by DMaxer on Monday 11th of May 2020 12:27:53 PM
Yay...at last a bit of common sense is introduced! As Greg says,adding new bolts and springs etc to allow the carrying of a heavier load seems pointless without upgrading axles too? Luckily the 79 series Cruiser has good axle ratings from new,so easy to get a 3780kg GVM upgrade,but if Graham's posts above is indeed true,there are going to be many vehicles, including the ubiquitous LC200,that are ineligible for GVM upgrades in NSW.At least now their owners,who don't really understand weights,will no longer be spending thousands of dollars to gain a miserable 50kg carrying capacity on the rear axle.And a WDH won't help either,as until it is tensioned,it adds even more weight to the rear axle,as well as increasing towball overhang.But that's a different story.....Cheers
Absolutely true....good post Greg.Cheers
It was a joke Greg. Sorry you took it seriously.
But the pitfall here is the GCM dosn't change, and the ball weight must not exceed 10% of the towed load, and if the ball weight is higher than 180kg a WDH must be ued, thus the whole exercise would be a waste of time and money.
You stirrer you, DM.
I can smell popcorn popping.
-- Edited by Dougwe on Monday 11th of May 2020 03:11:50 PM
Don't worry....I quickly recognised it as a 'stir',so I decided to play along with it too! Cheers
Answer. Sell your toys and Man UP!
Buy a second hand Kenworth K108 Big Cab.
26000kg GVM / 90000kg GCM 600HP.
Take your van, Car and boat, Quad bike, Motor bike. Push Bike for wife.
Grey.
And still have room for the Wife.
Well, no expert here. But simply amazed that overloading the axle was ever lawfully permitted. Contary to basic engineering principles.
My Patrol - I couldn't find what they were rated at but when I found a cracked wheel on the van, I discovered the wheels were rated at 1000kg MAX! So for a single axled van as mine is, the total safe load is 2000kg.
And to see how Jayco rate things, my ATM is 1950kg
Hi all don't throw your paperwork out just yet NSW RMS have just suspended the suspension on upgrades 'pardon the pun' until a later date maybe the RMS and superannuation are the same dept they change the rules just when you have things sorted popcorn anyone
Does this mean that if you have an interstate registered vehicle with such an upgrade, you are illegal in NSW?
When we have a national system, given that we can go in and out of any states or territory, this will have more credibility.
Whilst I agree with some of the comments, this NSW ruling sounds like some bureaucrat with too much time on his/her had to
justify their emplyoment.
Larry
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No it does not mean that.
You can drive in NSW, but if you sell the vehicle to someone who lives there it may not get approval for the upgrade. Then it will revert to the original GVM.
But even that may not be the case. It depends when your upgrade was dated and if NSW accept interstate approvals prior to the April introduction of the new regs, or not.
Cheers,
Peter
NSW registered vehicles with upgrades are legal in all states of Australia . If you sell to some one interstate under second stage manufacturer the upgrade would have to re engineered to be registered in the new state .Every state or territory has there own allowances for gvm and some do not allow gvm or gcm or both just to make it more confusing
FEDERAL COMPLIANCE: New vehicles must be fitted prior to registration. They are simply then registered with a revised GVM as per the new compliance plate.
Vehicles which are already registered cannot be fitted with a kit under this Federal Approval.
STATE COMPLIANCE: GVM Upgrades can be fitted to already registered vehicles in NSW, ACT, Victoria, Queensland, South Australia, Northern Territory and Western Australia only, and after modification, will have to be inspected by a Lovells nominated State Engineering Signatory. Extra Cost for Inspection and documents will be incurred.
We had our 200 Series upgraded before we took delivery and before registration.
Di