lithium batteries

jimricho · Guru

lithium batteries

mr glassies · Guru

just want to know if anyone uses luthium batteries and do you charg it with solar . theres a huge diference in weight so ofer time should sve on fuel.

Beth54 · Guru

Hi Graeme. I use Lithium batteries in the camera only, but they're not rechargable.

beiffe · Guru

Mr Glassies.

Not sure what to say as on most forums this causes a bum fight. The technology falls outside the thought concept of many of the experts of normal batteries and they have stifled any discussion on other forums.

But I will give basic and no more at the moment.

YES you can get Lithium batteries for you RV but they are not the same as in cameras etc.

YES you can charge them with solar and chargers etc and in fact the equipment needed is cheaper etc.

They are smaller, lighter and able to be charged and used harder but there is a lot of wrong information being spread about them needing battery management etc.

I have had my batteries for about 9 months and my bus is all 240v appliances and I exist with out external power. There are others doing the same but we all prefer to keep quiet because of the harassment we have received.

If you are really thinking of following this track PM me and I can let you know more but not prepared to give details in open forum.

Regards
Brian

beiffe · Guru

"Perhaps in 5years time we may know how those systems maintain the battery life

I would think that any poster who curently has them would have to say IT HAS been for LESS than 12months." Quote taken from above post.

I rest my case, and it will be in 5 years that we MAY give out some information not before. I have had this thrown at me on several forums so not prepared to answer any questions except for how I did this time.

We have many people who are experts but have never seen or held a battery and many don't even have the right type. None have done any testing.

When we were doing the original test we were harassed about whether we should test in Watts or Volts and that we were not capable etc so we eventually stopped publishing the data. We were supplying graphs from data logger etc for them to make their own assumptions but nit picked them as well. The threads were filled with SH*T do disguise any info.

In five years many will have replace their batteries TWICE and we expect to only have another 9 years before we MIGHT need to replace ours.

I love mine and so do the other users so you non believers can just keep replacing your batteries whilst I enjoy my aircon and Coffee perculator and vacuum cleaner and other 240v appliances. Check the price between a 240v fridge compared to a 12v one of the same size, and can you get a 12v fridge at any out of way town in any electrical store.

Any way lets leave it at that, Mr Glassies will contact if interested.

Regards
Brian

mr glassies · Guru

thanks beiffe

just sent you a blank page so you can tell me everything you can. im only after 12 volt and the odd inverter drain but be able to solar charge .

await your response

dibs

scotia59 · Senior Member

I have sent you a pm Beiffe.

dogbox · Guru

lithum batteries isn't that what they use in the electric cars an bikes the technoligy is just getting started an it is going places fast

-- Edited by dogbox on Sunday 19th of February 2012 04:18:09 PM

BobnBev · Senior Member

Hi People, I run a 200 amph LiFePo4 battery in our van ,and would never go back to LA. And have know idea why people are so against them when its all possitive .....A small ( getting used to) yes but thats all....
Do we talk on another forum Brian?
Bob n Bev

T1 Terry · Guru

Hi Bob and Brian, you people sure get around :lol:
To save a whole heap of angst, if anybody is genuinely interested send me a PM and I'll try to guide you through the smoke screen that surrounds this subject. I have about 5 yrs worth of research on these batteries and 9mths of full on hands on testing for house battery acceptability, what they can do has even surprised me. Some of the limitation I was lead to believe were set in concrete I have found to be false by doing actual testing, some of it unintentional. The misinformation and straight out untruths regarding these batteries is astounding, a lot spread by backyard BMS system manufacturers as scare tactics to make people buy their product, something not needed in a house battery application.

T1 Terry

BobnBev · Senior Member

Hello Terry, and welcome to a "quite " forum.. Nice people here and well informed, not so "in your face"
Good to have you here .. look forward to your input..
Hi Brian thought it was you, smile.......
Bob n Bev

T1 Terry · Guru

The lithium batteries best suited for RV house batteries are lithium iron phosphate chemistry (LiFeP04). There are other chemical compound lithium batteries, the most common is the lithium polymer batteries used by model plane enthusiasts. These batteries are highly unstable and I would recommend not even considering them for house batteries. These lithium polymer batteries are the ones that catch fire at the drop of a hat, self discharge when you least expect it but produce very high power for their weight, for a short period of time.
LiFeP04 cells can be discharged repeatedly to 80% flat (80Ah from a 100Ah battery) they will do that for more than 3,000 cycles, they can be flattened down to 100% discharged but with 2v per cell still and they will recharge again, they wouldn't give 3,000 cycles doing that though. In the electric vehicles these cells are used in they regularly flatten them like that and most are still working fine 2yrs later. Sometimes they completely flatten a cell to zero volts while still pulling amps out of the other cells, this makes the current run backwards through the cell, this kills them.
This is not something that can happen in a house battery really, if a cell was to go flat the battery voltage would drop to 10v and everything would stop anyway. They are very stable cells, they can be over charged or completely flattened and remain in one piece, they don't explode, they will puff up though and look pregnant. They can be recovered from this state, maybe not to 100% but they still will work after they are squeezed flat again.
Very powerful, very light, a 100Ah battery weighs about 15kg, a 100Ah AGM battery weights about 32kg. They recharge very fast and waste very little of the power charged into them unlike AGM batteries that waste quite a bit of their charge power by getting hot, wasted energy.
liFeP04 batteries will accept a fast charge right up to around 98% charged making recharging while driving a reality, not only partly charged like AGM batteries.
The down side;
In equal capacity, 100Ah to 100Ah they are about 2/3rd as dear again than AGM batteries but for useable capacity the cost is very close.
At the moment it is really a DIY thing, anything from a manufacturer ready to go is outrageously expensive because they want to add on things you don't really need.
These batteries need a good quality charger, the $20 cheapie charger will wreck them just like they wreck AGM batteries. A good solar regulator that has adjustable voltage settings like the plasmatronic PL20 will work fine.
These batteries really need to have the voltage of each cell monitored, not a big issue and the unit is only around $28, but you have to connect up the wires yourself.
They don't like to be held at a charge higher than 13.8v for long periods, it cooks them and shortens their life.
As I mention before, anyone who is seriously interested in using these batteries, send me a PM and I can tell you more like where to buy them, how to look after them and put you in contact with other users so you can all share experiences.

hope this helped

T1 Terry