Caravan Merges Into Truck

Long Weekend · Guru

Caravan Merges Into Truck

Tony Bev · Guru

UTUBE below

I have found while travelling, that regardless of who is at fault in any accidents, it is better to be safe than sorry

Accidents are not much fun, when you are too far away to walk home

-- Edited by Tony Bev on Monday 1st of May 2023 03:41:00 PM

Possum3 · Guru

No wide view mirrors + no indicator = no insurance.

Craig1 · Guru

goodness

vince56 · Senior Member

Yes the car was at fault and is obviously not a good driver, a goose would be an apt description, however, if you look at the footage that truck could have slowed to avoid contact but didn't. No airhorn warning either.

Are We Lost · Guru

vince56 wrote:
..... that truck could have slowed to avoid contact but didn't. No airhorn warning either.

Agree. If the police saw the dashcam footage they should charge the truck driver as well because he could have avoided the accident by slowing a little. Even when on the wrong side of the road and with oncoming traffic there is no evidence of him slowing at all until the ute goes sideways. The speed of the overtake attempt is constant. The audio showsat least 5 seconds from "You've got to give way dickhead" to the time of impact.

yobarr · Guru

Are We Lost wrote:
vince56 wrote:
..... that truck could have slowed to avoid contact but didn't. No airhorn warning either.
Agree. If the police saw the dashcam footage they should charge the truck driver as well because he could have avoided the accident by slowing a little. Even when on the wrong side of the road and with oncoming traffic there is no evidence of him slowing at all until the ute goes sideways. The speed of the overtake attempt is constant. The audio showsat least 5 seconds from "You've got to give way dickhead" to the time of impact.

Whilst there is little doubt that the truck driver could have avoided this collision, trying to block trucks is an all too frequent occurence with caravanners. There was absolutely no need for this car driver to change lanes, other than to block the truckies's path. If we slowed to give way every time one of these clowns did this to us we'd never get anywhere.

Trucks simply don't accelerate at anwhere near the rate that cars and caravans are capable of. Seems few people understand this.

Modern towing cars are often in the 150kw (200HP) range and may have a GCM of 6000kg, which is power to weight of 25kw per ton. (33hp per ton) while a Roadtrain may weigh up to 160 ton (sometimes more) and usually has around 600hp engine (450kw) although some have engines up to 700hp. (525kw). Power to weight ratio is thus 600hp divided by 160=3.75hp/ton.

Car and van=33 horsepower per ton.

Roadtrain=3.75 horsepower per ton.

No contest in an acceleration race!

Thus the car has over 9 times the power per ton, so the truck has zero chance of accelerating as a car can.

Momentum is our friend, and we need to maintain momentum to get anywhere.

Car drivers speeding up in overtaking lanes is frustrating for truckies, many of whom drive trucks that are speed-limited to 100kmh, as these dipstick car drivers are likely to then slow to 85kmh as soon as the overtaking lanes end. Why?

To avoid upsetting the blinkered, more sensitive souls on the forum I will not tell of incidents involving caravans and trucks that I've personally witnessed, except to say that the results were not pretty for the caravans!

Please don't play games with the Big Boys. Cheers

Warren-Pat_01 · Guru

I agree Vince but like some drivers of caravan rigs, there are some mongrel truck drivers too - often chatter on Ch 40 proves that - what they think of caravans & what they'd like to do with them.

On our current return to home trip (at Dubbo tonight), it has amazed me that there are many drivers who do not have towing mirrors fitted. They are mainly driving Toyota LandCruisers, Prados & one GU Patrol. Yes their mirrors are "wide" but they don't show down the side of the van.

Hitting the road · Senior Member

"Car drivers speeding up in overtaking lanes is frustrating for truckies, many of whom drive trucks that are speed-limited to 100kmh, as these dipstick car drivers are likely to then slow to 85kmh as soon as the overtaking lanes end. Why?"

This would have to be the most frustrating and dangerous behavior...see it all the time. Dad cruising along at 85 - 90 kmh until the overtaking lane appears...then speeds up to 100 kmh so that they lesson the chances of being overtaken...then back to 85kmh.

The next is the brain dead fool who can plainly see you coming as they are about to enter a road, maybe 5 - 10 seconds before you arrive at that point...and they pull out in front of you...nothing behind you of course, just open road,...why? Does their small brain not cope with the option of waiting a few seconds to allow a vehicle traveling at 100kmh to go by?

Then there is loser who does not give a damn about the growing queue of traffic behind them...mindlessly driving along in their own little world at 80kmh, passing truck bays and pull off areas...but the thought of pulling over and letting the traffic go by does not enter their pea sized brain at all...no siree...it is all about them!

There is no shortage of absolute dullards on our roads that are a danger to themselves and their passengers...as well as we other road users...

-- Edited by Hitting the road on Tuesday 2nd of May 2023 10:00:49 AM

Kebbin · Guru

As I see it both drivers should have been charged with negligent driving and let the insurance companies fight out the damages.

This was clearly stupidity on both their parts, I would have liked to see the previous 10-15 minutes of dash cam it would have told the story about these two imbeciles.

Bill B · Guru

yobarr wrote:
To avoid upsetting the blinkered, more sensitive souls on the forum I will not tell of incidents involving caravans and trucks that I've personally witnessed, except to say that the results were not pretty for the caravans!

And truck drivers are supposed to be professionals, professional bullies

Dougwe · Chief one feather

Probably why there is more truck accidents than caravan accidents Bill. Nearly every day I see or read on the news yet another semi or similar has rolled or crashed somewhere along the Hume Freeway.

The truck drivers all have a special licence though. I have had one for 45 years.

Magnarc · Guru

I have managed to have one for 55yrs and like to think that I know what I'm doing on the road but, like you guys I see it all the time. These idiots have barely got time to S--t.

They can't all be on a promise surely??????

-- Edited by Magnarc on Tuesday 2nd of May 2023 01:58:05 PM

Derek Barnes · Senior Member

"Two things are apparent watching the video: one, the ute was relying on the standard door mirrors and would not be able to see what was alongside him; and two..."

-- Edited by Long Weekend on Monday 1st of May 2023 03:23:10 PM

It depends on the width of the car and the width of the caravan. Our car (Patrol Y62) is fairly wide, and our caravan fairly narrow, so we can see down both sides of the caravan using our standard mirrors.

Derek Barnes · Senior Member

Are We Lost wrote:
vince56 wrote:
..... that truck could have slowed to avoid contact but didn't. No airhorn warning either.
Agree. If the police saw the dashcam footage they should charge the truck driver as well because he could have avoided the accident by slowing a little. Even when on the wrong side of the road and with oncoming traffic there is no evidence of him slowing at all until the ute goes sideways. The speed of the overtake attempt is constant. The audio showsat least 5 seconds from "You've got to give way dickhead" to the time of impact.

But don't you know from the adverts on TV that truck drivers cannot see any object to their left, right, ahead of them or behind them, and its up to us car drivers to avoid them!

yobarr · Guru

Bill B wrote:
yobarr wrote:
To avoid upsetting the blinkered, more sensitive souls on the forum I will not tell of incidents involving caravans and trucks that I've personally witnessed, except to say that the results were not pretty for the caravans!

And truck drivers are supposed to be professionals, professional bullies

Thankyou Bill, for another well considered post. Cheers

-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 2nd of May 2023 10:28:44 PM

Kebbin · Guru

Why even post that garbage Yobarr , you bring up the behaviour of fellow Truck Drivers and say your not talking about it? You should not have posted that in the first place, just trying to big note yourself, wake up!

yobarr · Guru

Dougwe wrote:
Probably why there is more truck accidents than caravan accidents. Bill. Nearly every day I see or read on the news yet another semi or similar has rolled or crashed somewhere along the Hume Freeway.

The truck drivers all have a special licence though. I have had one for 45 years.

Interesting comment Doug, but you no doubt are aware that there are many more trucks in Australia than there are caravans?

And how far would the avarage caravan be towed in a year?

No statistics on hand, but I would doubt that the total AVERAGE distance travelled would exceed 2000km/annum. When I was running interstate I travelled 1000km/day for 6 days every week, as did all the drivers at the companies I drove for.

And that distance is nothing out of the ordinary, with many long distance truckie friends travelling even further.

So we have thousands of trucks each travelling 300,000km/year, while we have a much smaller number of caravans travelling a miserable couple of thousand kilometres/year. No comparison.

Many of these caravanners have never before towed heavy trailers, and are so far out of their depth that it is dangerous.

Reminds me of an old fella I met years ago. "Been driving 70 years boy, and never had an accident. Probably caused a few, but never been involved son".

So, as you can see, or should be able to see, with huge numbers of trucks each travelling huge kilometres each day, compared with a much smaller number of caravans travelling negligible distances it should be obvious that there will be more accidents involving trucks. Simple logic here! Cheers.

-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 2nd of May 2023 09:47:06 PM

yobarr · Guru

Kebbin wrote:
Why even post that garbage Yobarr , you bring up the behaviour of fellow Truck Drivers and say your not talking about it? You should not have posted that in the first place, just trying to big note yourself, wake up!

Hi Kebbin. It appears that you've misinterpreted my comment as it was not the truck drivers' behaviour that I was referring to, rather the caravanners lack of driving skills that caused the two vehicles to come together, with the results not pretty to see!

Hope this clears things up for you? Cheers.

Are We Lost · Guru

Yobarr, I was going to let your earlier comment slide without comment, but it seems you are still supporting the cavalier attitude of the truck driver and justifying his actions.

You said "If we slowed to give way every time one of these clowns did this to us we'd never get anywhere."

I believe the ute driver made a mistake and drifted across the lanes unintentionally ... perhaps even fallen asleep. Watching the video in slow motion I can't believe his actions were intentional. However the truck driver's actions were far more serious because he was fully aware of the potential for an accident, had the ability to easily prevent it, and chose to continue with the overtake anyway, even on the wrong side of the road with constant oncoming traffice. He made a judgement call that it was better to allow the accident to happen than give way. Had he simply blown the horn it may never have happened.

On Youtube, one of the comments was along the lines of .... "If the truck driver was in a Barina would he have made the same decision?"

-- Edited by Are We Lost on Tuesday 2nd of May 2023 11:41:04 PM

shakey55 · Senior Member

Really nothing to say here other than the caravan driver incorrectly changed lanes and unfortunately has to suffer the consequences. There is no cause whatsoever to partially blame the truck driver.

Police action (if any) will be simple.

Van driver should thank his luck stars that this did not end up way worse

-- Edited by shakey55 on Wednesday 3rd of May 2023 07:32:32 AM

Dougwe · Chief one feather

yobarr wrote:
Dougwe wrote:
Probably why there is more truck accidents than caravan accidents. Bill. Nearly every day I see or read on the news yet another semi or similar has rolled or crashed somewhere along the Hume Freeway.

The truck drivers all have a special licence though. I have had one for 45 years.
Interesting comment Doug, but you no doubt are aware that there are many more trucks in Australia than there are caravans?
And how far would the avarage caravan be towed in a year?
No statistics on hand, but I would doubt that the total AVERAGE distance travelled would exceed 2000km/annum. When I was running interstate I travelled 1000km/day for 6 days every week, as did all the drivers at the companies I drove for.
And that distance is nothing out of the ordinary, with many long distance truckie friends travelling even further.
So we have thousands of trucks each travelling 300,000km/year, while we have a much smaller number of caravans travelling a miserable couple of thousand kilometres/year. No comparison.
Many of these caravanners have never before towed heavy trailers, and are so far out of their depth that it is dangerous.
Reminds me of an old fella I met years ago. "Been driving 70 years boy, and never had an accident. Probably caused a few, but never been involved son".
So, as you can see, or should be able to see, with huge numbers of trucks each travelling huge kilometres each day, compared with a much smaller number of caravans travelling negligible distances it should be obvious that there will be more accidents involving trucks. Simple logic here! Cheers.

-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 2nd of May 2023 09:47:06 PM

Gee, I'm impressed. Not only did you say all that dribble in 8 paragraphs, you never once mentioned weights

-- Edited by Dougwe on Thursday 4th of May 2023 02:32:29 AM

Kebbin · Guru

yobarr wrote:
Kebbin wrote:
Why even post that garbage Yobarr , you bring up the behaviour of fellow Truck Drivers and say your not talking about it? You should not have posted that in the first place, just trying to big note yourself, wake up!
Hi Kebbin. It appears that you've misinterpreted my comment as it was not the truck drivers' behaviour that I was referring to, rather the caravanners lack of driving skills that caused the two vehicles to come together, with the results not pretty to see!
Hope this clears things up for you? Cheers.

Then what's this dribble!

"To avoid upsetting the blinkered, more sensitive souls on the forum I will not tell of incidents involving caravans and trucks that I've personally witnessed, except to say that the results were not pretty for the caravans!"

RickJ · Senior Member

This forum never ceases to amaze.

The argument of what the caravan driver should do or what the truck driver should do is mute.

The fact is that the caravan driver did the wrong thing.

Obviously there are many members on here with truck driving experience and that cant be a bad thing however it is the level of skill that is in question here.

Out in the real world away from those perfect people from both camps there exists a huge number of people with caravans who just dont have a clue or worse, they have *happy hour theories* which from what I have heard, the truck driver is always in the wrong.

This huge number of drivers who have slipped through any net where training in their ability to be able to drive an articulated vehicle weighing 6 plus tonnes is real.
Many of these have driven nothing bigger than the family Holden for 50 years then when the big payout comes they sink upwards of maybe 150000 dollars into something of which they have no experience or worse still, no training with its correct operation.

These same people then venture out onto the highways with no bloody idea.

The sooner anyone has to prove their ability in correctly operating the caravan combination before venturing onto the road, the safer we will all be.

The industry is at fault as are the respective governments for turning a blind eye for fear of upsetting someone who has no intention of getting proper authorised training and have the skill to operate the combination safely and with regard to others.

diggerop · Senior Member

This video was done to death a couple of years ago on different forums. Apparently it was the result of an ongoing road rage incident between these two. So throw that in your equations and see what you come up with.

-- Edited by diggerop on Wednesday 3rd of May 2023 10:03:16 AM

RickJ · Senior Member

The last three words the driver of the heavy vehicle said to the caravanner sums it up completely.

BarneyBDB · Senior Member

Can you tell us the percentage of road accidents / incidents that actually involve caravans? Instead of crusading for a caravan licence how about addressing the big picture...
Far too many drivers on the road are not competent, ignorant of road rules and in many cases not even licensed.

yobarr · Guru

Kebbin wrote:
yobarr wrote:
Kebbin wrote:
Why even post that garbage Yobarr , you bring up the behaviour of fellow Truck Drivers and say your not talking about it? You should not have posted that in the first place, just trying to big note yourself, wake up!
Hi Kebbin. It appears that you've misinterpreted my comment as it was not the truck drivers' behaviour that I was referring to, rather the caravanners lack of driving skills that caused the two vehicles to come together, with the results not pretty to see!
Hope this clears things up for you? Cheers.
Then what's this dribble!

"To avoid upsetting the blinkered, more sensitive souls on the forum I will not tell of incidents involving caravans and trucks that I've personally witnessed, except to say that the results were not pretty for the caravans!"

With respect, your ability to translate what I've written into something you can understand is questionable. Again I will write the relevant part of my post, for your benefit.

". I will not tell of incidents involving caravans and trucks that I've personally witnessed ."

What part of that sentence do you find offensive? I have not commented on which party was at fault, simply saying that the results were "not pretty for the caravans".

If this simple statement challenges your analytical skills, so be it, but you seem have reached an absolutely baseless conclusion, and seem to be getting yourself all wound up about nothing.

Settle back, chill out, and perhaps consult a good dictionary to find the meaning of the word "dribble". Have a good day. Cheers

yobarr · Guru

RickJ wrote:
This forum never ceases to amaze.

The argument of what the caravan driver should do or what the truck driver should do is mute.

The fact is that the caravan driver did the wrong thing.

Obviously there are many members on here with truck driving experience and that cant be a bad thing however it is the level of skill that is in question here.

Out in the real world away from those perfect people from both camps there exists a huge number of people with caravans who just don't have a clue or worse, they have *happy hour theories* which from what I have heard, the truck driver is always in the wrong.

This huge number of drivers who have slipped through any net where training in their ability to be able to drive an articulated vehicle weighing 6 plus tonnes is real.
Many of these have driven nothing bigger than the family Holden for 50 years then when the big payout comes they sink upwards of maybe $150,000 into something of which they have no experience or worse still, no traing with its correct operation.

These same people then venture out onto the highways with no bloody idea.

The sooner anyone has to prove their ability in correctly operating the caravan combination before venturing onto the road, the safer we will all be.

The industry is at fault as are the respective governments for turning a blind eye for fear of upsetting someone who has no intention of getting proper authorised training and have the skill to operate the combination safely and with regard to others.
END OF RICK'S Post and start of mine. Accidentally deleted dividing line!
Geez Rick, experience tells me you'll rock the boat posting truths like those above, as many members simply don't want to know, hence my referral above to the "blinkered, more sensitive souls on the forum".
Vast numbers simply have no bloody idea, and only today I was involved in an incident involving one of them.
Ma and Pa Kettle were meandering along in their pretty, new, Triton towing a van that was clearly too big for that car, at 60km/hr in an 80km/hr area, followed by two other motorists, then my 125 ton Roadtrain. All of a sudden, with no prior indication, Pa Kettle decided he'd like to turn right into a sideroad, so it's "full brakes" time .
Fortunately the two motorists ahead of me each had the presence of mind to take to the scrub on the left side of the road, to go around Pa and Ma, thus leaving sufficient room for me to slow down enough so that Pa Kettle was out of my way down the sideroad blissfully unaware of the mayhem he'd caused behind him.
Many years ago I heard the term "No brain, and happy without one" which is likely applicable here? Cheers
In the video this thread refers to, no matter how obvious it is that the caravanner is at fault, from both the legal aspect and the moral aspect, still we will get those who waffle on about things they clearly do not understand.
Shakey55, who I believe is a retired policeman, summed it up nicely in his post at 7.30 May 3. (Today). May I suggest that you Read it. Cheers

-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 3rd of May 2023 09:53:24 PM

yobarr · Guru

Dougwe wrote:
yobarr wrote:
Dougwe wrote:
Probably why there is more truck accidents than caravan accidents. Bill. Nearly every day I see or read on the news yet another semi or similar has rolled or crashed somewhere along the Hume Freeway.

The truck drivers all have a special licence though. I have had one for 45 years.
Interesting comment Doug, but you no doubt are aware that there are many more trucks in Australia than there are caravans?
And how far would the avarage caravan be towed in a year?
No statistics on hand, but I would doubt that the total AVERAGE distance travelled would exceed 2000km/annum. When I was running interstate I travelled 1000km/day for 6 days every week, as did all the drivers at the companies I drove for.
And that distance is nothing out of the ordinary, with many long distance truckie friends travelling even further.
So we have thousands of trucks each travelling 300,000km/year, while we have a much smaller number of caravans travelling a miserable couple of thousand kilometres/year. No comparison.
Many of these caravanners have never before towed heavy trailers, and are so far out of their depth that it is dangerous.
Reminds me of an old fella I met years ago. "Been driving 70 years boy, and never had an accident. Probably caused a few, but never been involved son".
So, as you can see, or should be able to see, with huge numbers of trucks each travelling huge kilometres each day, compared with a much smaller number of caravans travelling negligible distances it should be obvious that there will be more accidents involving trucks. Simple logic here! Cheers.

Gee, I'm impressed. Not only did you say all that dribble in 8 sentences, you never once mentioned weights

I'm happy that you're impressed Doug, and I'd be even happier if you actually read those 8 sentences and absorbed the information they deliver.

As I said above, to get the benefit of the information within you must actually read the post, not simply look at it.
It all is simple logic which you no doubt will appreciate. Cheers.

-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 3rd of May 2023 09:48:57 PM