Two tourists raped in Alice

johnq · Guru

Two tourists raped in Alice

Kaid · Guru

Our 28 yr old daughter lives in Alice.Tourists have been harrassed in the Mall at night. Sadly it was only a matter of time before the problem escalated to this level. Some Indiginous behaviour is absolutely disgusting. The people of the town are afraid people will be too scared to visit Alice.

Landfall · Guru

You can definetely count us as one of those "too afraid to go there."

Getting there, staying there and returning.

Forget it, a bit like Wilcannia.

Dusty

Kaid · Guru

I love Alice Springs . It is not all bad. But, if the problems of the town are not addressed sadly it will die

pricey43 · Guru

I agree Kaid. We love going to Alice and spend quite a bit of time there on our trips.

This story could be anywhere. Sleeping in your car in Palm Circuit is not the smartest thing to do. It would cost them $10-$15 per person for a powered site in a secure camp ground.

You simply need to use some common sense. If you travel to a country or town you don't know, you go carefully , you do your home work and you get advise.

bill12 · Guru

This sort of thing happens in many towns around australia. Townsville has problems , and I would not walk around certain areas at night. Anywhere there are drunks living on the fringes of towns with no respect for the law or themselves, there is going to be problems. The police just turn a blind eye as they can,t do a lot. The courts give the drunks a smack on the wrist, and they think they are immune to prosecution.Pretty sad reflection on our society and laws. Bill

Weedy Pigeon · Senior Member

Cairns is nearly as bad. Don't wander the streets here after dark and definitely don't try sleeping on the streets. Backpackers have also been involved in quite a lot of violent crime as well.
The days of safely travelling Australia and sleeping in your car are long gone. I've camped on practically every beach in Queensland, but that was back in the 70's. I'd need a german shepherd and an auto 12g to do that now.
I was accosted for money in broad daylight, 10 feet from a security camera at our local IGA store a week ago. Lots of Pacific Isalnders as well as Indigenous causing problems.

_wombat_ · Master (of Mischief)

pricey43 wrote:
I agree Kaid. We love going to Alice and spend quite a bit of time there on our trips.
This story could be anywhere. Sleeping in your car in Palm Circuit is not the smartest thing to do. It would cost them $10-$15 per person for a powered site in a secure camp ground.
You simply need to use some common sense. If you travel to a country or town you don't know, you go carefully , you do your home work and you get advise.

sorry to disagree with you pricey43, we were in our van in a caravan park (in Vic) asleep at 1230 am when somebody tried to break into our van, they pulled the struts of the window and broke it, so being in a camp ground is NOT ALWAYS that secure.

beiffe · Guru

If you need to sleep / rest go 10kms out of town and you should be save as most low life's don't have a car or are too lazy to travel far. Plus most need their mates close as they are not that game when it comes to a crunch.

Always park so you are pointed outwards so you can start up and drive away.

Bit harder for a van but I feel a lot more secure in the bush than in caravan jail or in the main areas of a street especially near pubs or in areas with a known problem.

Regards
Brian

Clyde Camel · Veteran Member

It is easy to blame "indigenous" people or "middle eastern" people or any other group, but when you think about it, any group who is living in low socio economic circumstances will display similar antisocial behaviour. So let us not label people along racial profiling lines. Let us instead address removing inequity and injustice from our society and we will then reduce the incidence of crime, particularly violent crime.

johnq · Guru

Clyde Camel wrote:
It is easy to blame "indigenous" people or "middle eastern" people or any other group, but when you think about it, any group who is living in low socio economic circumstances will display similar antisocial behaviour. So let us not label people along racial profiling lines. Let us instead address removing inequity and injustice from our society and we will then reduce the incidence of crime, particularly violent crime.

It is not about race it is about serious crime and security.

There was no profiling or labelling. Through incredible luck the victims are alive and gave descriptions of their assailants.

What description do you think the police should have used instead?

Low socio-economic status is no excuse for crime, world-wide there are millions living in abject poverty without social welfare who are happy and do not commit serious crimes like breaking and entry, rape and robbery with violence. These offenders exercised choice and I would be happy if life meant life for them when caught. However the stiff sentence is perhaps an unlikelihood and that is another problem.

Nicholstones · Guru

Johnq, Clyde wasn't referring to the original report, but to the several other posts who made comments implying that the only people who cause such problems are dark skinned of some sort. I'm with Clyde on this, I've felt uncomfortable around all sorts of nasties who come in the entire range of possible ancestries.

johnq · Guru

Travellers and especially women should be able to travel without constant fear of robbery, assault and worse.

In the Sixties young women hitched around Australia. As a poor student (most are) I hitchhiked to the shops or across the country, sleeping in a small hikers tent. There has been a degradation of country towns. Alice has become notorious over recent years.

What prevents those country towns from remaining as peaceful and welcoming as they previously were? Remembering that there always were poor families living in and on the outskirts of country towns, but most of them have also been caused to flee.

However, quite apart from that and now that the subject has come up, there is a common feature in the country towns that I now avoid but once enjoyed. If I was to give young tourists advice that factor would not escape mention. But what might others say instead?

wendyv · Guru

We have stayed in Alice Springs several times. It - and the surrounding areas - have lots of great places to see and things to do. It should not be left off the itinerary for caravanners. We stay in a good, secure caravan park, stick to the main areas when walking around - and only in daylight.

Sheba · Guru

Just heard on the news, that one arrest has been made so far.

Cheers,

Sheba.

Sheba · Guru

johnq wrote:
These offenders exercised choice and I would be happy if life meant life for them when caught. However the stiff sentence is perhaps an unlikelihood and that is another problem.

Gotta agree here. The Justice system badly needs a thorough overhaul as far as I'm concerned. These days, Punishment rarely fits the Crime worse luck.

Cheers,

Sheba.

Kaid · Guru

Unfortunately I do know what I am talking about as far as this problem goes. My daughters flat mate is a lawyer in this town. The "locals" know that as far as the law is concerned they are pretty much untouchable and their behaviour reflects this. The Police and the whole Justice System needs the proverbial.

Cruising Granny · Guru

The jails are already full of drunk drivers who offend and even kill people, and every crime known to society.
Respect is missing.
Somewhere between my childhood and the current children discipline has gone, respect and manners are no longer taught.
Everything has gone feral in some neighbourhoods. Poverty is no excuse for bad behaviour and crime should be dealt with severely.
Everyone has the right to live in peace and harmony, and no one has the right to take that away.

pricey43 · Guru

_wombat_ wrote:
pricey43 wrote:
I agree Kaid. We love going to Alice and spend quite a bit of time there on our trips.
This story could be anywhere. Sleeping in your car in Palm Circuit is not the smartest thing to do. It would cost them $10-$15 per person for a powered site in a secure camp ground.
You simply need to use some common sense. If you travel to a country or town you don't know, you go carefully , you do your home work and you get advise.
sorry to disagree with you pricey43, we were in our van in a caravan park (in Vic) asleep at 1230 am when somebody tried to break into our van, they pulled the struts of the window and broke it, so being in a camp ground is NOT ALWAYS that secure.

I agree that things do happen in Caravan Parks Wombat but at least there are people close by with very thin walls who can come if you scream out. Especially in this case, 2 girls travelling alone.

jimricho · Guru

pricey43 wrote:
_wombat_ wrote:
pricey43 wrote:
I agree Kaid. We love going to Alice and spend quite a bit of time there on our trips.
This story could be anywhere. Sleeping in your car in Palm Circuit is not the smartest thing to do. It would cost them $10-$15 per person for a powered site in a secure camp ground.
You simply need to use some common sense. If you travel to a country or town you don't know, you go carefully , you do your home work and you get advise.
sorry to disagree with you pricey43, we were in our van in a caravan park (in Vic) asleep at 1230 am when somebody tried to break into our van, they pulled the struts of the window and broke it, so being in a camp ground is NOT ALWAYS that secure.
I agree that things do happen in Caravan Parks Wombat but at least there are people close by with very thin walls who can come if you scream out. Especially in this case, 2 girls travelling alone.

I think a caravan park anywhere would be much less risky than sleeping in a car/RV in downtown Alice Springs!

I'd like to know where the hell one could get a "powered site in a secure camp ground" in Alice Springs for $10-$15 per night!

Last year I stayed in caravan park in Townsville that was allegedly the pick of the Townsville parks. While I was there there was a robbery in a van only about six sites away from mine. I learnt that this wasn't unusual for this particular park (which was full of "ferals"). For that and other reasons I won't be staying in that park again.

jimricho · Guru

Landfall wrote:
You can definetely count us as one of those "too afraid to go there."
Getting there, staying there and returning.
Forget it, a bit like Wilcannia.
Dusty

In my view comparing Alice Springs to Wilcannia is very "wide of the mark" to say the least. Alice, and the Red Centre generally, is well worth a visit. Just make sure you budget for staying in a caravan park and don't consider free camping. I've stayed at both the "G'day Mate" and "Macdonnell Range" caravan parks in the Heavitree Gap area without any problems.

Jim

Sheba · Guru

At least they've arrested all 3.

Cheers,

Sheba.

pricey43 · Guru

I'd like to know where the hell one could get a "powered site in a secure camp ground" in Alice Springs for $10-$15 per night!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2 years ago, Dave at G'day Mate was letting backpackers stay on powered sites for $10 perhead per night.

Jimricho, I agree with you. We have stayed at both and in the grounds of Pitchi Richi sanctuary and have felt completely safe, though they had been having some trouble at G'day Mate before we got there.

At Mc Donnell Ranges they do a night check of the park at about 10 p.m.

-- Edited by pricey43 on Saturday 5th of May 2012 07:32:37 PM

johnq · Guru

A case where hindsight is a cruel teacher. The two women wouldn't have free camped had they known the risks in that area. There would not have been any red flags on any tourist information at their disposal.

pricey43 · Guru

johnq wrote:
A case where hindsight is a cruel teacher. The two women wouldn't have free camped had they known the risks in that area. There would not have been any red flags on any tourist information at their disposal.

I'm sure if they had enquired about free camping they would have been told of the dangers in the area.

Cruising Granny · Guru

No matter where camp we must always be alert for the less scrupulous, opportunistic window shoppers.
We carry computers, cameras, mobile phones, food, other electrical goods, car fridges, and the car.
Look, Lock, Leave should always be on your mind. Check around the park to get a feel for the place.
There's a park in Townsville which gave me the creeps as I drove in. Long-term/permanent ferals seem to occupy the place. I pulled out of there fairly quickly. Might be the same park Jim fled from.
I had a similar feeling in a caravan park at Logan on the Gold Coast.
Even when we free camp there are some unwritten rules. Park at least 20 kms out of town. Check for cans and stubbies, wheelie marks and other vandalism. Don't stay there.
Don't free camp alone anywhere, ever!
Stay safe and upright friends.

_wombat_ · Master (of Mischief)

CG I not to sure about you tip saying 'Don't free camp alone anywhere, ever!'

Somebody has to be the first to stop for the night at a free camp, we usually stop our day driving about 1400, just after the lunch crowd has gone, we then have a few hours by ourselves before somebody joins us, if nobody turns up by 1700 we move on to the next spot where somebody has already set up camp for the night.

johnq · Guru

Cruising Granny wrote:
No matter where camp we must always be alert for the less scrupulous, opportunistic window shoppers.
We carry computers, cameras, mobile phones, food, other electrical goods, car fridges, and the car.
Look, Lock, Leave should always be on your mind. Check around the park to get a feel for the place.
There's a park in Townsville which gave me the creeps as I drove in. Long-term/permanent ferals seem to occupy the place. I pulled out of there fairly quickly. Might be the same park Jim fled from.
I had a similar feeling in a caravan park at Logan on the Gold Coast.
Even when we free camp there are some unwritten rules. Park at least 20 kms out of town. Check for cans and stubbies, wheelie marks and other vandalism. Don't stay there.
Don't free camp alone anywhere, ever!
Stay safe and upright friends.

That is the simple, practical advice that should be a sticky on caravan and camping forums.

I free camp but nowhere within sight of a public road and it would usually require daylight to get there.

The Australian government should be giving the same travel cautionary advice to tourists on entry as it does to its own nationals when departing the country. Either that or fix what is a deteriorating social problem that has lowered our standard of living. The police have been overwhelmed.

As a student I back-packed thousands of miles with a sweetie who was Miss University and we never had a problem. But now there are country towns I wouldn't stop in to buy a loaf of bread and I would drive around where I have the chance.

Gerty Dancer · Guru

I wonder what advice is given to those young travellers from overseas when they arrive and hire their campervans? I'd hate to think that our kids travelling overseas werent warned of simple safety rules about camping in dodgy areas. I just hope this doesnt happen again.

We've met kids from several countries whom we'd have been proud to have as our own. Others who were rude and noisy late at night recently in a caravan park, where at least we could call the manager who brought instant quiet. I've also seen them stealing toilet paper for heavens sake! They are all different, thankfully.