240v electrical wiring help

Hylda&Jon · Guru

240v electrical wiring help

Phil C · Guru

24v electrical wiring help

Hylda&Jon · Guru

Phil C wrote:
Gday Hilda

Im going to suggest that you get a sparky to do it for you. Reason: I wont advise you is that there are a number of 240V connections and they are VERY dangerous if you get them wrong, could even burn down your caravan or worse kill you.

Im so sorry I wont help, its best for your safety.

Thanks anyway, Your choice but a sparkie is not an option as I can't afford one. I'll keep looking.
BTW not for inside the caravan it's actually for a Biltong drying machine and if I could afford a sparkie I'd buy the whole machine new from eBay

Cheers.

oldtrack123 · Guru

Phil C wrote:
Gday Hilda

Im going to suggest that you get a sparky to do it for you. Reason: I wont advise you is that there are a number of 240V connections and they are VERY dangerous if you get them wrong, could even burn down your caravan or worse kill you.

Im so sorry I wont help, its best for your safety.

A BIG DITTO

Get a qualified electrician to do it.

We do not want to give advice, which maybe misunderstood & result in a serious accident or worse death

oldtrack123 · Guru

RE: 240v electrical wiring help

Hylda&Jon · Guru

Thanks for the lecture people.

oldtrack123 · Guru

Hylda&Jon wrote:
Thanks for the lecture people.

No problem

A bit of friendly advise that could avoid serious consequences biggrin

madaboutled · Guru

I'm not an Electrician and do know what the symbols are and what wires would go where,

but 100% agree with PhilC & Oldtrack123, get an electrician, any life is just not worth the risk.

Greater than 50 Volts the law states you must use a licensed electrcian, anybody giving you advice I think would be technically breaking the law.

Hylda&Jon · Guru

madaboutled wrote:
I'm not an Electrician and do know what the symbols are and what wires would go where,
but 100% agree with PhilC & Oldtrack123, get an electrician, any life is just not worth the risk.
Greater than 50 Volts the law states you must use a licensed electrcian, anybody giving you advice I think would be technically breaking the law.

Telling me what the symbols are would not be classified as advice but thanks anyway.

DeBe · Guru

Try Google Electronic Symbols. If you lived near by I would check it out for free. It look like a basic lamp dimmer.

-- Edited by DeBe on Thursday 23rd of March 2017 06:53:55 PM

Mike Harding · Guru

Left to right:

Neutral - Neutral - Earth - Unused - xxx - Live (Active) - Lamp

The xxx symbol confuses me as the silk screen shows the neutral going to one side and nothing to the other.

Before you attempt to connect anything tell us more about the unit you are trying to control.

Your controller looks like a simple phase controller and should work satisfactorily with the lamp but perhaps less so with the fan. Are you intending to put both the fan and lamp in parallel and control them with this unit?

Hylda&Jon · Guru

Mike Harding wrote:
Left to right:
Neutral - Neutral - Earth - Unused - xxx - Live (Active) - Lamp
The xxx symbol confuses me as the silk screen shows the neutral going to one side and nothing to the other.
Before you attempt to connect anything tell us more about the unit you are trying to control.
Your controller looks like a simple phase controller and should work satisfactorily with the lamp but perhaps less so with the fan. Are you intending to put both the fan and lamp in parallel and control them with this unit?

Thank you for your help Mike it is much appreciated. Hopefully I can work it out from the symbols. I won't ask more as I wouldn't want you to incur the wrath of the previous posters for helping me (though, between you and me, I bet like most other people on these forums they have all changed a plug on an electrical lead without paying $75 for a qualified electrician to do it but.....shhh..... don't tell anyone. :)

Cheers.

CC Bear · Senior Member

Mate take it to a lecy and tell him you are broke and can he advise you. Can you afford to buy him a couple of beers after work may help. They can only say yes or no but asking 240 v questions here will only get you put over the rack.

Would be nice to know so I will load up the pop corn and wine on ice and await the late comers. Cheers

Hylda&Jon · Guru

CC Bear wrote:
Mate take it to a lecy and tell him you are broke and can he advise you. Can you afford to buy him a couple of beers after work may help. They can only say yes or no but asking 240 v questions here will only get you put over the rack.

Would be nice to know so I will load up the pop corn and wine on ice and await the late comers. Cheers

Thanks. Good advice. I'll join you for a drink if it keeps going.

Mike Harding · Guru

>Hopefully I can work it out from the symbols.

The extreme right hand terminal appears to be the output of the phase control so your lamp should be connected between that and neutral.

NB. Incandescent lamps work well with phase control but the modern compact fluorescent types often wont and may suffer damage from such a system.

In your case I guess the 60W lamp is used for drying purposes? so it would have to be incandescent.

>I won't ask more as I wouldn't want you to incur the wrath of the previous posters

My skin is thick :)

Clearly you're going to try using your controller so it's far better you receive help than are left floundering around in the dark.

Although your controller has made an attempt at RF suppression (the blue capacitor and large coil in the photograph) it is likely that it will produce a lot of RF noise, especially when it's at half power, it probably won't affect your TV but it may well wipe out AM and maybe FM radio.

MH

T1 Terry · Guru

Mike Harding wrote:
Left to right:
Neutral - Neutral - Earth - Unused - xxx - Live (Active) - Lamp
The xxx symbol confuses me as the silk screen shows the neutral going to one side and nothing to the other.
Before you attempt to connect anything tell us more about the unit you are trying to control.
Your controller looks like a simple phase controller and should work satisfactorily with the lamp but perhaps less so with the fan. Are you intending to put both the fan and lamp in parallel and control them with this unit?

I think the one that looks like an image of the sun is actually for the light active wire, the far right looks like it is the on/off switch judging by the open switch symbol at the very top of it.

Now, I think the advice given to at least take the thing to the local and find a sparkie in need of a beer in exchange for a small and simple job for a trades person is probably the best advice you have received so far.

Simply telling someone they shouldn't do it is a red flag to the average Aussie, the country was built by people doing stuff they probably shouldn't have, but guide the same person on how to get the problem sorted over a nice cool drink fits in well with the Aussie spirit of mates helping mates biggrin

T1 Terry

Phil C · Guru

Hylda... please dont. If you were closer I would do the job for free and SAFE.. There has got to be a decent sparky close by.. It just aint worth the risk.

Please...

oldtrack123 · Guru

Phil C wrote:
Please...

Ditto !!!!

Possum3 · Guru

Take your rheostat to local JayCar and show/ask technician, I think I understand what you are wanting to do but, I don't think the fan and light will be compatible through same unit - But as others have said it is illegal to do unless signed off by qualified person prior to putting on to live power.

Our local Salvo's has a retired electrician checking the donated electricals - maybe your's does too.

Hylda&Jon · Guru

T1 Terry wrote:
Mike Harding wrote:
Left to right:
Neutral - Neutral - Earth - Unused - xxx - Live (Active) - Lamp
The xxx symbol confuses me as the silk screen shows the neutral going to one side and nothing to the other.
Before you attempt to connect anything tell us more about the unit you are trying to control.
Your controller looks like a simple phase controller and should work satisfactorily with the lamp but perhaps less so with the fan. Are you intending to put both the fan and lamp in parallel and control them with this unit?
I think the one that looks like an image of the sun is actually for the light active wire, the far right looks like it is the on/off switch judging by the open switch symbol at the very top of it.
Now, I think the advice given to at least take the thing to the local and find a sparkie in need of a beer in exchange for a small and simple job for a trades person is probably the best advice you have received so far.
Simply telling someone they shouldn't do it is a red flag to the average Aussie, the country was built by people doing stuff they probably shouldn't have, but guide the same person on how to get the problem sorted over a nice cool drink fits in well with the Aussie spirit of mates helping mates

T1 Terry

Thanks Terry (and others) I think I have it sorted now.

BTW That last 'open switch' one isn't used at all by the look of it but I drew a diagram of how it all goes from advice given here and had came across a sparkie online who look at it and he agrees with the result of the advice given here so thanks to those that were willing to advice me of what the symbols mean.

And as you helpful people would probably agree to is, 'what I choose to do with that info is my business'.

Thanks again and Cheers.

End of thread.

CC Bear · Senior Member

Dam just put a new lot of pop corn in the microwave,

oldtrack123 · Guru

To those who believe it is a good idea to give advice to someone who does not even KNOW the meaning of the electrical symbols& those who think experimenting with 240V when the recipient has little knowledge of the subject is a good idea,I would like to suggest they consider the following:

[a]Such work is strongly regulated & classed as work that only correctly trained /qualified persons should carry out ,for very good reasons .

It is very easy to do something that may not have immediate consequences ,but some thing that should be minor problem at a later date [if ALL done completely correct], could have serious implications .

The unit appearing to" work" correctly can mean very little .Something that some experimenters find hard to understand

[c]No questions have been asked by those posting of the actual intended set up!!

The unit is intended to be hard [fixed] wired into the supply, which means correct polarity can be maintained

Is THAT how the op intends to use it or is it via a plug & socket??? where correct polarity cannot be assured!!

[d]A factor to be considered with [C]is why does the unit have It's own earthing requirement????

[e]If an accident should occur with the whole set up, the OP could be in serious trouble , as could /should be those offering such advise!!!

[f]one other point that ALL the do gooders should remember is that what is posted on this or any forum is not restricted to the OP asking the question

.It is out there for every Tom Dick & harry to read & think he has been given ALL the answerst

I am glad that the OP did seek the help of a qualified electrician ,as suggested by some who really understand

& suggest to anyone seeking such advise to be very wary of what NON qualified people including experimenters post .

Note, the above comments do not just apply to the product in the OP's request . but to ALL products desighed for HARD /FIXED wiring.

Keep the popcorn handy ,Bear

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 25th of March 2017 03:13:30 PM

Mike Harding · Guru

>[c]No questions have been asked by those posting of the actual
>intended set up!!

You are wrong.

I refer you to my post of the 23rd March.

Australia has an infantile approach to domestic electrical
maintenance and installation. Virtually all of this has been
engendered as a job protection system by the trades unions.
Unfortunately the Australian public has swallowed it hook, line and
sinker and is now, in the main, in awe of their domestic electrical
system often to the point of irrational fear.

This situation is encouraged by electricians who, despite having only
a low level of trade training and little to no theoretical
understanding of electrical systems glory in passing themselves off
as all knowing gurus of all things electrical.

Indeed this thread has reacted in a panic stricken way almost begging
the OP not to go ahead with his intentions - one would have thought
he was, at the least, assembling a small nuclear device.

One of the downsides of living in Australia is that we are very far
removed from the rest of the Western world and that has lead us to
think that our way is the only way. We are not confronted by another
country and culture perhaps just a few kilometres across the border
who are doing something quite differently to us and more
successfully. In addition to electrical work our traffic ethos comes
to mind. So we continue in our isolated arrogance assuming ours is
"The One True Way".

Consider the UK which permits, more or less, unregulated work on
domestic installation and has done for 100 years and more - the
streets are not littered with the charred bodies of inept electrical
home handymen and, as far as I'm aware, the incidence of
electrocution is no higher in the UK than Australia. Certainly the
road deaths per capita are much lower in the UK.

It is also important to keep in mind that single phase low voltage
domestic electricity is not complicated and can be readily understood
by anyone who is prepared to put in a few hours of reading similar,
shall we say, to the knowledge required to do basic maintenance on a
car or caravan? Do you also call for these tasks to be restricted to
tradesmen only?

Do try not to be so irrational about electricity - it's not going to
come and stalk you in the night.

Phil C · Guru

Popcorn anyone?

This situation is encouraged by electricians who, despite having only
a low level of trade training and little to no theoretical
understanding of electrical systems glory in passing themselves off
as all knowing gurus of all things electrical.

Mike, thats VERY offensive to all electrical tradespeople who spend 4 years learning their craft.

I daresay your comments will open a can of worms.

Cold beer and popcorn in hand.. This should be good!

-- Edited by Phil C on Saturday 25th of March 2017 04:29:07 PM

oldtrack123 · Guru

Phil C wrote:
Popcorn anyone?
This situation is encouraged by electricians who, despite having only
a low level of trade training and little to no theoretical
understanding of electrical systems glory in passing themselves off
as all knowing gurus of all things electrical.
Mike, thats VERY offensive to all electrical tradespeople who spend 4 years learning their craft.
I daresay your comments will open a can of worms.
Cold beer and popcorn in hand.. This should be good!

-- Edited by Phil C on Saturday 25th of March 2017 04:29:07 PM

Hi Phil

Actually 5 years of apprenticeship in my time & many many years of further experience over a wide range of electrical /electronic work . Backed by a Diploma in "Industrial Electronics"some 48 years ago

3years of a Qld Electrical & Mechanical engineering diploma[ Could not finish fourth for personal reasons]

Head Electrician [& Contacting license holder ]over some 30 electricians spread over the Co's many different engineering workshops

Ran the Co's Agency service division as head technician & that from a time when many new products including RCDs ,Electronic controls ,all sorts of equipment was coming from overseas & non English speaking country, so manuals where often useless except for diagrams .!!

Done a lot more than just reading /learning smile out of a few books

AND have seen the many serious mistakes made by even qualified people..

From son ,who is a foreman electrician & main Tester for a large electrical contracting co [NOT house wiring]those serious mistakes are still taking place

The evidence of that does show up by the information supplied by the Electrical Authorities Aus wide [ includes the many heavy fines& loss of licenses imposed for breaches]

For all those who think the regulations are a joke, why not start a petition to have them repealed,& let every dick & harry have an open go.???

New Zealand has the same standards as Aus ie AS/NZS XXXXXX

& allows limited electrical work by the owner on their OWN premises ,BUT that work MUST be tested by a licensed tester BEFORE connection to the supply!

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 25th of March 2017 05:07:15 PM

Mike Harding · Guru

>Mike, thats VERY offensive to all electrical tradespeople who spend
>4 years learning their craft.

PhilC - Give me their addresses and I'll send flowers.

----

OldTrack - I'm not interested in your campaign medals, deal with the
points I made in regard to the comparisons of Australia with other
countries in this area.

----

Popcorn!? What is it with you people? Should this be renamed the
"Young Children's Forum"?

MH

Phil C · Guru

Irrespective of your views Mike, the law is the law..

And thats game set and match.. OH and please dont treat people like idiots. There are some fine teachers and trades people on here only too willing to help when called upon. I work for free.. to caravaners and campers

Popcorn anyone?

-- Edited by Phil C on Saturday 25th of March 2017 06:37:09 PM

Dougwe · Chief one feather

Settle down people or these will come out of the drawer sooner than soon. Personal attacks are coming thick and fast.

Think of all the people that could have their homes wrecked or worse still lose their life with pending a Cyclone brewing.

Phil C · Guru

Agree Dougwe, I have a few mates up that way who tell me the sky is getting very dark.

Hope you are well old mate.

Dougwe · Chief one feather

Well as I can be 'OLD' mate smile

Sitting back keeping an eye on things as I move slowy north myself. I don't intend being in Nth QLD until early May all being equal.