power connect to house

Santa · Guru

RE: power connect to house

T1 Terry · Guru

Mike Harding wrote:
I think this is a case of... if you know what you are doing it's not an issue.
If you have to ask about it on a forum then you should probably stick to the rules.

Certainly a case of not recommending it to be done by all or giving a cheater lead to someone thinking you are doing them a favour. Better they gauge their own knowledge level and situation and make a decision from there, then the blame sits squarely on their shoulders if anything goes wrong because they were informed of the risks and chose to ignore them anyway.

T1 Terry

-- Edited by T1 Terry on Saturday 17th of March 2018 07:18:07 PM

Daryl620 · Veteran Member

As the plugs within your vehicle are 240v 10amp, whats wrong wirh passing a 10amp extension cord through a window and plugin say the fridge, wouldn't try to run all appliances at once.....

Jaahn · Guru

Hi smile

There cannot be much more to say on this subject.

My only comment is that after having a real story told about the consquences of doing the simple illegal plug change and then trying to justify it, is some people never learn.

I would also say publicly announcing to the world, on a forum, that you are doing something illegal and promoting it seems just stupid in itself.

Jaahn

PeterD · Guru

T1 Terry wrote:
As far as the Amphibian goes, isn't there something in the standards about multiple extension cords not being legal for a transportable premises? I'll leave that to the standards police to add the "Shall" and "Shall not" where applicable and explain the logic and how this gets around the legalities

Yes there are standards prohibiting joining power leads supplying power to a caravan. However the Amphibian is considered to be a power supply board and not an extension lead. It must be plugged into a power point and you are only permitted to connect your van to it via one power lead.

PeterD · Guru

Dick0 wrote:
A suitable cable, 15A socket & 10A plug does the job well. Why are these parts sold in the first place? As far as I know there are no restrictions making up your own extension leads. My electrician mate has done the same!

The parts are sold to construct devices that comply with the law. Not to jury rig any Heath Robinson device that anyone conceives.

As to restrictions in making up your leads, there are certainly restrictions in NSW. Only licensed tradesmen are permitted to construct leads. I suggest this is the case in most states.

If your mate has been constructing these devices he is leaving himself open to loosing his licence.

Dick0 · Guru

biggrin biggrin biggrin

Lotsa naughty farmers are going to get their wrists smacked. lol

smile smile smile

Ron-D · Guru

Jaahn wrote:
Hi
There cannot be much more to say on this subject.
My only comment is that after having a real story told about the consquences of doing the simple illegal plug change and then trying to justify it, is some people never learn.
I would also say publicly announcing to the world, on a forum, that you are doing something illegal and promoting it seems just stupid in itself.
Jaahn

There must be hundreds of stupid people out there with this set but were on the internet and so you can get away with stuff you would not dare say to an individual to there face...

oldbloke · Guru

If you only need to charge the battery just use a normal battery charger direct to the battery with a 10 and lead.

aussie_paul · Guru

Dick0 wrote:
Lotsa naughty farmers are going to get their wrists smacked. lol

Me included Dick0 many years ago. You just have to make do most of the time. biggrin

Aussie Paul. smile

oldtrack123 · Guru

chugger wrote:
I hope someone might clarify something. I've heard that I shouldn't connect my motorhome power source to our house power source with a standard extension cord, without an adaptor, due to differences in amps (10amps in van, 15amps in house). Is this correct? If so, do I need one of these adaptors to plug in at a caravan park? Thanks in advance.

How would your 15A extension lead plug fit into the house 10A socket biggrin [It will not fit], so you do need an "APPROVED" !0 to 15A adapter such as an" Ampfibian"

It shall be plugged directly into the 10A house socket then 15A extension lead to van

But ALL cps should have 15A outlets ,so the normal 15A extension lead is ok

Santa · Guru

oldtrack123 wrote:
chugger wrote:
I hope someone might clarify something. I've heard that I shouldn't connect my motorhome power source to our house power source with a standard extension cord, without an adaptor, due to differences in amps (10amps in van, 15amps in house). Is this correct? If so, do I need one of these adaptors to plug in at a caravan park? Thanks in advance.
How would your 15A extension lead plug fit into the house 10A socket [It will not fit], so you do need an "APPROVED" !0 to 15A adapter such as an" Ampfibian"
It shall be plugged directly into the 10A house socket then 15A extension lead to van
But ALL cps should have 15A outlets ,so the normal 15A extension lead is ok

The logical and legal/safe way of going about it is to have an electrician install a 15 amp power outlet, problem solved. smile

oldtrack123 · Guru

PeterD wrote:
T1 Terry wrote:
As far as the Amphibian goes, isn't there something in the standards about multiple extension cords not being legal for a transportable premises? I'll leave that to the standards police to add the "Shall" and "Shall not" where applicable and explain the logic and how this gets around the legalities
Yes there are standards prohibiting joining power leads supplying power to a caravan. However the Amphibian is considered to be a power supply board and not an extension lead. It must be plugged into a power point and you are only permitted to connect your van to it via one power lead.

Ditto

Such device have a specific Aus Standard that they must comply with ,[NOT CLASSED AS AN EXTENSION LEAD]

They SHALL be connected direct to the power supply socket

Any one with an understanding of basic electrics should understand the differences & why that location is specified.

Best for those who do not understand ,due to lack knowledge, to just follow / comply with the rules & regulations drawn up by those who have real working knowledge of the reasons biggrin

Those with the knowledge would understand how factors such as ,voltage drop ,fault loop impedance, current overload protection, IP rating, need to be met.!!

Note, the multi outlet power boards such as Clipsal , Arlec , etc, do not comply for such use & are covered by a different standard.[in fact are specifically referred to as not being approved for use with "transportable structures"]

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Monday 19th of March 2018 11:24:14 AM

oldtrack123 · Guru

Santa wrote:
oldtrack123 wrote:
chugger wrote:
I hope someone might clarify something. I've heard that I shouldn't connect my motorhome power source to our house power source with a standard extension cord, without an adaptor, due to differences in amps (10amps in van, 15amps in house). Is this correct? If so, do I need one of these adaptors to plug in at a caravan park? Thanks in advance.
How would your 15A extension lead plug fit into the house 10A socket [It will not fit], so you do need an "APPROVED" !0 to 15A adapter such as an" Ampfibian"
It shall be plugged directly into the 10A house socket then 15A extension lead to van
But ALL cps should have 15A outlets ,so the normal 15A extension lead is ok
The logical and legal/safe way of going about it is to have an electrician install a 15 amp power outlet, problem solved.

Using the correct "Approved "Ampfibian" for the situation is fully acceptable[legal & safe]

But best to get the weatherproof model that can be used in all situations [under cover or exposed to weather]

It also has the advantage that it can be used anywhere where only a 10A outlet is available

Take it with you if staying at friends places or some show grounds ,etc

Anyone changing or making up a 10A plug 15A socket EXTENSION lead is breaking the electrical regulations of EVERY Australian state

Could be in deep s*^t if caught plus insurance void

It also has the advantage

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Monday 19th of March 2018 11:20:49 AM

oldtrack123 · Guru

aussie_paul wrote:
Dick0 wrote:
Lotsa naughty farmers are going to get their wrists smacked. lol
Me included Dick0 many years ago. You just have to make do most of the time.
Aussie Paul.

Hmm

Making do ,while deliberately ignoring rules & regulation can have nasty consequences ,especially where insurance or injury occurs traceable to that "make do"

oldtrack123 · Guru

PeterD wrote:
Dick0 wrote:
A suitable cable, 15A socket & 10A plug does the job well. Why are these parts sold in the first place? As far as I know there are no restrictions making up your own extension leads. My electrician mate has done the same!
[1] The parts are sold to construct devices that comply with the law. Not to jury rig any Heath Robinson device that anyone conceives.
[2]As to restrictions in making up your leads, there are certainly restrictions in NSW. Only licensed tradesmen are permitted to construct leads. I suggest this is the case in most states.
[3]If your mate has been constructing these devices he is leaving himself open to loosing his licence.

DITTO to

[1] Dicko, Have you seen the warning in many stores ,especially Bunnings , regarding using such components[pointing out it is work for qualified persons]

[2] Ditto ,in ALL states electrical regulations

[3] Yes ,& deserves to suffer severe penalties for KNOWINGLY breaking the regulations or is he plain stupid,& does not understand the basic reasons why such SHALL NOT Be made up /available???

But always some who will do anything for a $$

An instance of such ,a northern rivers electrician running a solar & electrical business was openly advertising,on line, the components in kit form with instruction on how to make it up [with a nice big $ markup]

Some one tipped of the NSW Authorities

Within in 3 weeks the advert disappeared & that business can no longer be found

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Monday 19th of March 2018 11:45:06 AM

wasn_me · Guru

aussie_paul wrote:
Dick0 wrote:
Lotsa naughty farmers are going to get their wrists smacked. lol
Me included Dick0 many years ago. You just have to make do most of the time.
Aussie Paul.

Some 10 years ago, farming was second on the list of most likely to be killed at work occupations. ( short cuts & she'll be right might have a lot to do with that )

Cheers Pete

oldtrack123 · Guru

Ron-D wrote:
[1]Just one final note this lead connects to a single 240 outlet in my garage when needed its never in the weather ,its only needed rarely to top the battery up,
[2]the house is fused with safety switches the caravan has its own trip switch
[3],how the Hell could this thing give any trouble its been in use for ten years three caravans,my fingers when connecting only touch the switch after the cable is connected , when disconnecting the switch has been turned off before fingers even touch the cable. Illegal maybe?
[4]Unsafe no way....

-- Edited by Ron-D on Saturday 17th of March 2018 03:21:20 PM

Unsafe , because overloading the 10A wall socket can /has lead to fires

One of the reasons that all those small multi outlet boards NOW must have an inbuilt 10 AMP circuit breaker

[1]The possible misuse of such a lead & overloading it & the 10A outlet is the problem.

Fire, electric shock possible!!!

[2]totally irrelevant !! they only give overload protection to the circuit wiring

No protection to the 10A outlet

[3]That has no relevance, the risk is fire at the 10A outlet!!!

[4] Totally incorrect

Very good reasons why such set ups cannot be bought. ,anyone selling one would be in real trouble for selling something that is not/cannot be approved

Any electrician ,even making one up for a friend ,could / would be in big trouble if found out

Good reasons for having standards are :

[a]protect innocent parties from other's stupidity. [fire , shock,electrocution]

protection of property, Electricity,misused is the source of many ,many house fires

then there is an overriding reason why such should not be available,even IF the current user "thinks" they understand the risks, & that is that someone else could get their hands on & be totally unaware of the risks

eg those kind people, who leave it with their van when they dispose of/sell it!

For a time ,,had just such a know it all son in law

Multiple double adapters off the kitchen power point , running multiple high current appliances @ the same time

I explained the dangers to my daughter who understood & did not use them ,but smart A knew better until he found the outlet smoking & worse the switch no longer worked

He had to rush outside & turn the main switch off

I wonder where their house would have been if he had not come in when he did.

PLEASE ALL ,understand that the rules ,regulation ,& Standards are there primarily to protect lives & property.

They are not drawn up by fools, but have wide input from people knowledgeable in the respective fields.

They they go through a rigorous process of examination & comments before they become official Standards.

They are regularly revised, or amendments issued ,if the need/ circumstances arises

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Monday 19th of March 2018 01:51:09 PM

Dick0 · Guru

Amazed how this SHOCKING blog just keeps going...lol... confuse

The POWER of the forum is to ENERGISE an ELECTRIFYING discussion and CHARGE thoughts to JOLT and STUN those WIRED to a POINT in avoiding a ZAP.

biggrin biggrin biggrin

-- Edited by Dick0 on Monday 19th of March 2018 02:16:53 PM

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Yep never hertz .

oldtrack123 · Guru

Daryl620 wrote:
As the plugs within your vehicle are 240v 10amp, whats wrong wirh passing a 10amp extension cord through a window and plugin say the fridge, wouldn't try to run all appliances at once.....

Hi Daryl

I think you are saying plug the fridge directly into the extension lead socket??

That is not illegal [ just plugging in ONE item] ,but has some risks, if the cable is not well protected from mechanical damage, such as the door or window being closed on it & pinching/ deforming / damaging the insulation.[both outer & inner cable insulation]

That damage may not show up immediately

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Oh please ^^^ This is an issue with any lead !! Elect drill , vacuum cleaner .

oldtrack123 · Guru

Aus-Kiwi wrote:
Oh please ^^^ This is an issue with any lead !! Elect drill , vacuum cleaner .

What a stupid statement blankstare

Suggest you reconsider what you are saying.

YOU claim to be an "electrician" confuse

Exactly what are your "qualifications"???

IF you cannot see there is a difference ,GOD help anyone you do electrical work for, or give advice to

To other readers , watch out, ask any one who claims to be an electrician to show you what he is qualified to do.!

There are quite a few classes of "electricians"

Each class has limits on the type of work they are allowed to do

[a]limited electrical licenses licensed to only do very specific tasks .

Like connecting & disconnect fixed wired appliances .

electrical lines man.

[c]meter & mains connecting etc

[d]up to fully licensed ,they are allowed to do all classes of low voltage electrical work

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Monday 19th of March 2018 04:59:15 PM

Dick0 · Guru

oldtrack123 wrote:
Aus-Kiwi wrote:
Oh please ^^^ This is an issue with any lead !! Elect drill , vacuum cleaner .
What a stupid statement
Suggest you reconsider what you are saying.
YOU claim to be an "electrician"
Exactly what are your "qualifications"???
IF you cannot see there is a difference ,GOD help anyone you do electrical work for, or give advice to
To other readers , watch out, ask any one who claims to be an electrician to show you what he is qualified to do.!
There are quite a few classes of "electricians"
Each class has limits on the type of work they are allowed to do
[a]limited electrical licenses licensed to only do very specific tasks .
Like connecting & disconnect fixed wired appliances .
electrical lines man.
[c]meter & mains connecting etc
[d]up to fully licensed ,they are allowed to do all classes of low voltage electrical work

Oh man, oh man, oh man...where is this going?
Why the abuse?
Don't upset yourself unnecessarily over triviality.
We are just giving personal opinions.
Any more sparky cops out there? lol