Giant Power 340AH Lithium Ion Batteries should I Buy

Paulp · Member

Giant Power 340AH Lithium Ion Batteries should I Buy

TimTim · Guru

Paulp wrote:
Would like feedback on anybody has the "Giant Power 340AH Lithium Ion Batteries" and how they rate them
aprox $1730

Hi Paul,

I don't think these have been out long for anyone to give a true evaluation but here is a link from another forum.

https://www.caravanersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=91

The supposedly full price is way over the top so ignore that but at that so called discount price if you are not confident of

buying prismatic cells from China and building your own battery then I suppose it is a reasonable price. I built two 280Ah batteries for just on $2000.

Also take a look at the reviews for the company https://www.productreview.com.au/listings/aussie-batteries-solar

I have a Giant 120Ah AGM battery which I have had for 4 years and is still going strong but I should really do a capacity test on it.

The BMS is a Daly BMS which I have two of and which you can monitor on your phone and I have had no issues with them after 8 months.

As I said if you cant build your own then it will be suitable for the majority of people and at least you have an Australian warranty.

It would be nice if someone did a tear down of one of these to see whether they are A grade or B grade cells inside.

-- Edited by TimTim on Sunday 1st of May 2022 09:40:32 AM

yobarr · Guru

Whilst I cannot attest to knowing a lot about Lithium, looking at these specs, I would run away! Firstly, the price is ridiculously low, and secondly, these batteries seem to be very light. What does this tell you? My Victron 90ah batteries weigh 16kg each, as opposed to the batteries being discussed, at 340ah and 36kg. Thus, if I were to have 360ah (4x90ah batteries) I would have around 64kg instead of your 36kg. Yeah, right. And as I said, the price surely is a warning. My Victron 90ah cost more than that EACH, and I have 8 of them! Being a great believer in "You get what you pay for", I would suggest that you put on your running shoes! Remember "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten". Good luck though, as I feel you'll need it. Cheers

-- Edited by yobarr on Sunday 1st of May 2022 07:34:12 PM

Paulp · Member

Thats why I am asking on here hoping to get more opinions or real information from people who have bought so I can make a informed decision on what to do

Paul

TimTim · Guru

Eve 304Ah 3.2V cells weigh 5.4kg each. Four to make a 304Ah battery equals 21.6Kg. Add a BMS and case and call it 25.6 kg.

Listen Lithium 100Ah 3.2V cells weigh 2.3Kg each. Four to make a 100Ah battery equals 9.2 KG.

I have eight of the Eve 280Ah 3.2V cells that weigh the same as the newer 304Ah cells and there are thousands upon thousands of people in the US using these three types of cells. They are certainly not of a lesser quality than what are used in a Victron.

Perhaps the question to be asked is why is the Victron battery so heavy and not why are other batteries so light.

I see a Victron 100Ah battery is selling for $1741.00 which equates to $17.41 per 1Ah.

My 280Ah Eve Cells and Daly BMS averaged out at $1000 shipped to my door and equates to $3.57 per 1Ah. At Victron pricing that would be $4874.80. Sry but you do not always get what you pay for, sometimes you get the same thing in fancy packaging.

Now please dont ask me my thoughts on Miele .

-- Edited by TimTim on Monday 2nd of May 2022 12:14:29 AM

-- Edited by TimTim on Monday 2nd of May 2022 06:14:07 AM

dorian · Guru

"Sry but you do not always get what you pay for, sometimes you get the same thing in fancy packaging."

When you have a government and a society that is founded on corruption and nepotism, it's impossible to trust any brands. That's what is frustrating about buying anything from China. I agree that in many cases we are just paying for a name, but how do we know whether an off-brand product is a genuine article or just plain junk?

According to Wikipedia ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_iron_phosphate_battery

... "CATL's LFP batteries are currently at 125 Wh/kg, up to possibly 160 Wh/kg with improved packing technology, while BYD's LFP batteries are at 150 Wh/kg."

CATL (Contemporary Amperex Technology Co. Limited) and BYD (BYD Co. Ltd) are two of the largest suppliers to the automotive battery market. This would suggest that the current state of the technology is 10Ah/kg, which would make Giant's specs plausible, but at the top of the tree.

TimTim · Guru

Hi Dorian,

Yes I agree with you it is a minefield and that is why with buying cells I followed in the footsteps of others. I did my research on the Diysolar forum beforehand where there are a number of sellers recommended. Some of the people on there are buying 1000s of cells and reselling to make a profit or have their own solar installation companies. Not all Chinese are rip off merchants and that is why when people find a good seller they will spread the word. CATLs cells are one of the popular brands on there.

As for the Giant lithium batteries, it will take time before the quality of the product is known unless someone tears one apart and does a capacity test, but although Yobarr is trying to do the right thing to warn people, we cant just work on on the weight of a battery especially when the technology is changing so fast.

Fortunately, the internet and forums like this, plus the one mentioned above, provide the means for people to share their experiences. At least now when people find a good product at a reasonable price or a rubbish product from a dodgy company they can share that information with others.

dorian · Guru

Is Aussie Batteries a company we can trust?

Here is a 200W solar panel which they are selling:

https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/solar/mounted-panels/200w-solar-panel

Its dimensions are 1480mm x 680mm x 35mm.

That's 1.0064 sq m.

This would mean that their "High Quality A Grade Monocrystalline Cells" have an efficiency of 20%. Can we believe that?

They also sell Victron's panels, eg ...

https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/victron-solar-panel-305w-20v-mono-1640x992x35mm-sm

That's 305W from 1.627 sq m, which implies an efficiency of 18.8%

Something doesn't look right ...

Whenarewethere · Guru

Paulp wrote:
Would like feedback on anybody has the "Giant Power

I have sent you a PM.

dorian · Guru

I went to the Giant Power web site and found no technical information, only an email address and a referral to Aussie Batteries:

https://giantpower.com.au/

I examined the specs for the deep cycle lithium batteries:

130Ah 12.4kg

140Ah 12.4kg

170Ah 14.2kg

260Ah 24.4kg

340Ah 36.3kg

https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/giant-130ah-lithium-deep-cycle-battery-australian-made

https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/giant-170ah-lithium-deep-cycle-battery-australian

https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/giant-170ah-lithium-deep-cycle-battery-australian~394917

I notice that the weight of the 170Ah battery is disproportionately low. Instead of 14.2kg, I would have expected 17 or 18kg.

-- Edited by dorian on Monday 2nd of May 2022 10:43:23 AM

Whenarewethere · Guru

'The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten'

Benjamin Franklin

TimTim · Guru

Aussiebatteries panels do not have a name to them and Victrons panels will just be a rebranded panel made by another manufacturer. It would be interesting to do a side by side comparison under the same conditions and then see how much they degrade over a 12 month period.

Companies are now making panels with 22% efficiency and 20% appears to be the norm. Are Aussiebatteries panels A grade cells i do not know. Can Aussie batteries be trusted? Well all i can say is that I bought a 120Ah battery from them approximately 5 years ago. The price was far less than what other companies were asking. I did a capacity test on it when I first received it and the capacity was as stated. That doesnt mean that other products they sell will be of a similar standard but until others state otherwise I cant knock them.

There was a time when I would buy solar panels on EBay, test them then request a return ticket and a refund. I received a refund in all four cases and was told to keep two of the panels. Some sellers now will state for example up to 200 watts and hide in the description between 150 and 200 watts.

dorian · Guru

TimTim wrote:
Companies are now making panels with 22% efficiency and 20% appears to be the norm.

My calculations did not take into account the actual area of the cells. If you allow 5% - 10% for the frame and other physical aspects, then the claimed efficiency would be 21% - 22% rather than 20%.

I visited the 2016 version of Giant Power's web site at the Wayback Machine. In those days the unadjusted efficiency of their Japanese Kyocera panels was 14%.

https://web.archive.org/web/20160301091741/http://www.giantpower.com.au/solar

-- Edited by dorian on Monday 2nd of May 2022 01:07:36 PM

Mike Harding · Guru

I don't think be giving a company called Giant Power $1730 for a lithium simply because of its name....

dorian · Guru

The company seems to have had a good pedigree, but their current web site is sh1t.

At one time they were selling off grid systems:

https://web.archive.org/web/20160301091600/http://www.giantpower.com.au/off-grid-solar/

Jaahn · Guru

I have bought AGM batteries off them twice all 140Ah. First bought two about 8-10 years ago, and i was satisfied with the delivery and and they performed well, up to my expectations. I sold that MH so I purchased another similar one for for my current HM when I need one some years ago. Again it has been a good deal and still working well.

I have fitted a couple of the same AGMs to another persons camper and it has been good even with substandard solar panels and reg from a well known 4WD supplier.

Jaahn

PS as for "you only get what you pay for" old chestnut. My experience is you often get less than you pay for and sometimes a lot less in the modern world, than you were entitled to. So it does pay to ask around and shop around. hmm

-- Edited by Jaahn on Monday 2nd of May 2022 02:07:25 PM

yobarr · Guru

TimTim wrote:
Aussiebatteries panels do not have a name to them and Victron panels will just be a rebranded panel made by another manufacturer. It would be interesting to do a side by side comparison under the same conditions and then see how much they degrade over a 12 month period.
Companies are now making panels with 22% efficiency and 20% appears to be the norm. Are Aussiebatteries panels A grade cells i do not know. Can Aussie batteries be trusted? Well all i can say is that I bought a 120Ah battery from them approximately 5 years ago. The price was far less than what other companies were asking. I did a capacity test on it when I first received it and the capacity was as stated. That doesnt mean that other products they sell will be of a similar standard but until others state otherwise I cant knock them.
There was a time when I would buy solar panels on EBay, test them then request a return ticket and a refund. I received a refund in all four cases and was told to keep two of the panels. Some sellers now will state for example up to 200 watts and hide in the description between 150 and 200 watts.

Happy to be corrected, but I don't believe that Victron market solar panels? Installers of Victron gear seem to be using Qcells, which are a top-range panel, allegedly German, although they're not. Cheers

Warren-Pat_01 · Guru

Paulp,
Look up T1 Lithium (Mannum, SA) & ask them.

Warren-Pat_01 · Guru

Hi yobarr,
Look up Victron's website. I was pleasantly surprised - and their HQ is not where everyone else is.

Paulp · Member

I think we need somebody do a tear down of one will be much more clear

TimTim · Guru

Paulp wrote:

I think we need somebody do a tear down of one will be much more clear

I would if i could but my wife wouldnt appreciate me spending more money on another battery knowing that I bought cells from China and built two last year. disbelief

TimTim · Guru

Hi Yobarr,

If you look closely at the video in the link that Dorian put up for the Victron Panels sold by Aussiebatteries, you can see a Victron label on the back of the panel with the panel specifications. It may be a Qcell but relabelled with a Victron sticker. Who knows!

Whenarewethere · Guru

dorian wrote:
Is Aussie Batteries a company we can trust?

Here is a 200W solar panel which they are selling:
https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/solar/mounted-panels/200w-solar-panel
Its dimensions are 1480mm x 680mm x 35mm.
That's 1.0064 sq m.
This would mean that their "High Quality A Grade Monocrystalline Cells" have an efficiency of 20%. Can we believe that?
They also sell Victron's panels, eg ...
https://www.aussiebatteries.com.au/victron-solar-panel-305w-20v-mono-1640x992x35mm-sm
That's 305W from 1.627 sq m, which implies an efficiency of 18.8%
Something doesn't look right ...

$580 for the Victron panel.

Their as suggested 200w panel $327 would work out to $498.67 for 305w.

$453.37 here

https://www.outbackmarine.com.au/victron-solar-panel-305w-20v-mono-series-4b

305w 1002 x 1658mm series 4b

$443.00 here

https://www.batteriesdirect.com.au/shop/product/37018/spm043052000.html

305w 992 x 1640mm series 4a

glassies · Guru

Go see terry and margaret in mannum T1 lithium he is a genius and does a realy good set up
We have stayed with them and they are excellent people and great company too. And mannum is so pretty

yobarr · Guru

TimTim wrote:
Hi Yobarr,
If you look closely at the video in the link that Dorian put up for the Victron Panels sold by Aussiebatteries, you can see a Victron label on the back of the panel with the panel specifications. It may be a Qcell but relabelled with a Victron sticker. Who knows!

Only just spotted your post, Tim! Thanks for pointing that out. Cheers

Hylife · Guru

yobarr wrote:
Whilst I cannot attest to knowing a lot about Lithium, looking at these specs, I would run away! Firstly, the price is ridiculously low, and secondly, these batteries seem to be very light. What does this tell you? My Victron 90ah batteries weigh 16kg each, as opposed to the batteries being discussed, at 340ah and 36kg. Thus, if I were to have 360ah (4x90ah batteries) I would have around 64kg instead of your 36kg. Yeah, right. And as I said, the price surely is a warning. My Victron 90ah cost more than that EACH, and I have 8 of them! Being a great believer in "You get what you pay for", I would suggest that you put on your running shoes! Remember "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten". Good luck though, as I feel you'll need it. Cheers

-- Edited by yobarr on Sunday 1st of May 2022 07:34:12 PM

I disagree.

The price is slightly more expensive than I would pay for that capacity.

Also, as it is in a single case the weight is about spot on. Four 100ah cells weigh in at about 11kg with a bms.

bobsa · Senior Member

weight is about right for Lithium ,
Lithium is about 50% weight of an AGM battery
$$ is a good price
I have a Pro Power ( 150 AH at 15.9 Kg ) now for 5 years , best thing I ever did changing over from AGM battery ( 240 AH ) I had 2 at 120 ah each
The Lithium 150 ah does all I need and more
I can not say about Giant brand , but specs look ok and good price
Bob

Rusty W · Veteran Member

I have had a giant 60 litre fridge/freezer for about 8 years, and still going well, was a lot cheaper than the others and so advanced back then with being all fridge or freezer or either compartment as such, high and low speed, adjustable voltage cutout and remote control with temp readout as well.

I did buy a small battery from Aussie batteries about 4/5 years ago , at a good price, still going.
Regards Russell