Out to pick the brains of the many experienced travelers on here and the odd expert!!
Last Wednesday I bought a camping ute canopy (2nd hand) and it sits proudly on top of my new Isuzu ute, all designed for pending travel adventures.
Did a few months pre canopy investigations and knew additional weight would be an issue.
Now I have dropped 3 cm at the rear and the ute is up slightly at the front.
Previously I had investigated air bags but a few mates (and the bloke I bought it off) suggested I simply put one additional leaf into my rear ute springs, (assuming nothing would affect my new ute warranty)?
Does anyone have any input into such a suggestion and move please?
My phone rang while driving a few days ago so I pulled over and lo and behold it was slap bang out the front of a Tyre and Suspension specialist.
So thought - I will wander in and get a quote. The bloke was very rude and arrogant (later my mate said he won't deal with them as the boss bloke there is up himself - funny that, I was immediately not at ease either). He started to write me in the diary for mid January when I asked, hey mate, how much is that likely to cost.
So, with much chagrin, he managed to sigh and move himself to the computer "$760 mate". I said, that is more than I expected and he replied in his droll, couldn't care less manner "There is two hours labour in that mate".
So I rain checked that and decided to research a bit more, so here I am, researching!!!
From what I understand air bags and leaf springs are not a good combination. Breakages and damage because the air bags apply forces in different places on the chassis to where the leaf springs are designed to act.
How about trying your question on an Isuzu forum, like OZISUZU? It is a pretty active forum.
From what I understand air bags and leaf springs are not a good combination. Breakages and damage because the air bags apply forces in different places on the chassis to where the leaf springs are designed to act.
How about trying your question on an Isuzu forum, like OZISUZU? It is a pretty active forum.
That is most cerainly correct Ted as airbags give point-loading in areas of the chassis not designed for it.
Heavier springs will simply make the car more level, but will not improve carrying capacity.
First off, Ronald should load his ute with ALL the gear he plans to carry, and visit a weighbridge.
Weigh front axle, then weigh whole car. Deduct front axle weight from total to get rear axle weight, which cannot exceed 1910kg , from memory. Front is good for 1450kg, but GVM is 3100kg..
IF the rear axle is overloaded a GVM upgrade to 3600kg may be needed, which gives new 2150kg rear and still 1450kg front.
There is another GVM upgrade that someone does, but I don't have details at present. Maybe Pedders? (Thanks Possum)Cheers
P.S If rear axle carrying capacity is not exceeded a spring upgrade may work. About $800 I seem to recall, but a quick question to Mr Google will give many options. Good luck to Ronald.
-- Edited by yobarr on Sunday 24th of December 2023 04:53:52 PM
I have a 2014 model Isuzu DMax and a few years back I received some advice about adding an additional leaf to the rear. My ute was not sagging but I had spoken to a number of people who suggested it. When I was having my car serviced at the dealer I spoke to him about it and he informed me that they had an Isuzu Dmax as the NRMA road car and because they carried car batteries in the tub, they added an additional leaf.
I looked around and then a fellow forum member recommended Green Bros at South Grafton. They have a family history of suspension going back about 90 years or more. They gave me the full rundown on how it worked and they made their own. Really good blokes. Anyway, they did the work for me and I think it cost about $500-$600 and took about two hours. It certainly made a lot of difference, A bit firmer ride but nothing dramatic.
Last year I was talking to Pedders and they did a check on my suspension and said it was good. I asked about how to improve it without going the whole hog on their towing kit, which was about $4500 from memory. They fitted their foam cooled shocks all around and told me to also keep the additional leaf in the rear. That was the smartest purchase I have made in a while. The improvement when towing is fantastic. Everything rides perfectly flat. I still use a WDH hitch but not cranked up, on about number 7 link usually.
The cost from Pedders with parts and labour was about $2K but worth every cent. The branch of Pedders I used was in South Australia but they do have branches nationwide, one in Dubbo too I think.
The factory suspension in new utes is designed to be cost efficient and is not great for heavy loads.
I suspect an extra leaf will give a harsher ride.
I installed aftermarket springs and shock absorbers in my BT50 and the difference was massive. I used to cringe at every bump because of the noise and jarring. Now it's much more comfortable & quiet plus hardly sags with heavy loads/towing. A while after my suspension upgrade I travelled a long distance in my Sis/BIL's shiny brand new Ranger & its was a much harsher & noisy ride on the standard suspension - my back was painful afterwards.
It's all about compromise really - cost vs ride quality and load carrying ability.
BTW, I think my new springs & shock absorbers were in the region of $2k for Tough Dog brand. They have about 150k km of harsh use and still going well.
I have found on farm Ute (in working days) and now motor home, I installed progessive rubber bump stop replacements. Very simple to fit. Addiiond spring leaf makes unloaded ride rougher.
I use Pedders as they can advise what is best suited to your situation
Springs are only a part of the system.....they carry the load . To increase the "comfort" of the ride matching shock absorbers are a must - shock absorbers control the rate (speed) of compression and rebound of the spring. With worn, mismatched or as with some caravans, no shock absorbers, the suspension can act similar to a "pogo stick" - uncontrolled compression and rebound.
One thing I did find when I was thinking about upgrading the suspension was with whom you dealt. I found that if I made enquiries with a place that was an agent for one of the suspension people they did not seem too interested, Usually, the reply would be something along the lines of "we will have to order the parts in" followed by "won't be able to do it for about six weeks, fully booked out".
I found that when I approached an actual franchise the response was just the opposite. I was out in Broken Hill and having made enquiries along the way found the first response prevailed. When in Broken Hill I rang a franchise in Adelaide and it was completely different. I booked in for two days later and the service was fantastic. They did a preliminary inspection of tyres, steering, brakes and suspension which cost about $25. I was informed everything was fine and that the car operated as it was supposed to. I then asked the bloke how I could improve it and he went through all the options. He informed me that as my van was not heavy a full towing kit was not necessary and put me onto the option I went with. When I decided to go with that option I asked to make a booking for later in the week and as it turned out, they had time that day and the rest is history. Best move I ever made with the car.
If you have a search under "Suspension Upgrade" I think, I made similar enquiries on this forum about a year ago. There is some helpful advice there. I know Doug added the extra leaf to his Collie and I followed his recommendation.
Thanks for all of the replies. Knew there would be some experienced and knowledgeable responses from the GN forum!!! Apologies for not responding sooner, was away over Christmas (Orange) and no access to a computer to respond. Home now and looking to make adjustments to the suspension in the coming weeks. I have done an online enquiry on the Pedders website (Orange branch) for advice and a quote for a single leaf spring to be added. Hopefully get a response after the festive season break. I think that will do it and a lot of the comments on here seem to confirm that. I have a payload on the Isuzu ute of 1390 KG and the canopy is an older heavy steel one and must be somewhere between 400 to 500 KG. The heaviest items that will go in there will be one of my two Engel fridges (heavy), solar panels and a heavy duty long life battery. If I am not staying off grid, those items will not be required and hence weigh down the suspension even more.
I was not really considering air bags and have got varying reports on their effectiveness. Interesting to note the air bags are not necessarily complimentary to the leaf spring suspension as commented on this thread. Accompanied a friend to Sydney to pick up her new Millard van in November and on the way home to Canberra the van bounced a lot and her DMax was down at the back. She is soon having air bags fitted to level the load. From what I can gather it is horses for courses. One added leaf spring should go a long way to assisting my load, lift it a bit and add some stability and support.
If I am not camping off grid then I reckon I would barely have 150 to 200 KG in the canopy with just some fishing gear and assorted stuff.
Thanks to all for the valued input.
Out to pick the brains of the many experienced travelers on here and the odd expert!!
Last Wednesday I bought a camping ute canopy (2nd hand) and it sits proudly on top of my new Isuzu ute, all designed for pending travel adventures.
Did a few months pre canopy investigations and knew additional weight would be an issue.
Now I have dropped 3 cm at the rear and the ute is up slightly at the front.
Previously I had investigated air bags but a few mates (and the bloke I bought it off) suggested I simply put one additional leaf into my rear ute springs, (assuming nothing would affect my new ute warranty)?
Does anyone have any input into such a suggestion and move please?
My phone rang while driving a few days ago so I pulled over and lo and behold it was slap bang out the front of a Tyre and Suspension specialist.
So thought - I will wander in and get a quote. The bloke was very rude and arrogant (later my mate said he won't deal with them as the boss bloke there is up himself - funny that, I was immediately not at ease either). He started to write me in the diary for mid January when I asked, hey mate, how much is that likely to cost.
So, with much chagrin, he managed to sigh and move himself to the computer "$760 mate". I said, that is more than I expected and he replied in his droll, couldn't care less manner "There is two hours labour in that mate".
So I rain checked that and decided to research a bit more, so here I am, researching!!!
Assistance please 'O wise grey scribes !!!!
G'day Ron,
I am sorry for the lateness and hope not too late, given time of year, maybe not.
A good GN friend suggested I fit an extra leaf both sides of rear springs prior to buying my 2014 Collie. The first thing I did after getting the Collie was get Pedders to do said work.
Best thing I did. It raised the rear 50mm and I wanted that. It also legally added 200kg carrying capacity to rear axle. I don't use that 200kg but a handy thing to have in back of mind for a couple of reasons. Pedders arranged all the necessary paperwork etc needed to change rego details.
The Collie is nearly 10 years old and still tows level and all weights are well under maxes.
I don't listen to people that make out they know everything that have not done what you ask. I have and know it works. WELL. I have mentioned what I did to a few GN's over the years and those that have done it are just as happy as me.
Keep Safe on the roads and out there.
__________________
Live Life On Your Terms
DOUGChief One Feather (Losing feathers with age)
TUG.......2014 Holden LT Colorado Twin Cab Ute with Canopy
DEN....... 2014 "Chief" Arrow CV (with some changes)
Thanks Dougwe.
I have used the Pedders (Orange) online web query form to raise the question and ask for a quote.
No response as yet, as it was over Christmas/New Year break and they are probably just returning to work with a skeleton staff I guess.
A few knowledgeable people have suggested an extra leaf will do what I need it to do.
I was not too concerned with the extra payload, more so leveling and supporting the new weight on the back of the ute to "normalise" it again.
Was not too bad, dropped 3 cm at the back, a lot of tradies utes I see are the same and I guess I won't know much more until I see the little 11 foot Roadstar on the back for a distance tow?
Raised my eyebrows when I read the bit about Pedders raising the paperwork for the Rego details, I am glad you mentioned that as I will take it up with them also.
The ute is new so is free of Rego inspections for 5 years.
It has raised a bit at the front end but it is not particularly noticeable other than the ride in the ute has improved with the extra weight on the back.
Finished detailing the canopy yesterday, was a big job with the sugar soap and repainted the internal BBQ stand and off to Bunnings today to get some Barbie refurbisher.
Was going to ditch the Barbie unit until I saw how well it was constructed and the quality old BBQ plate.
Like EVERYTHING from our G.N. era, the quality of construction is so much better than so much comes off the (China) shelf these days!!!!!!
Thanks Dougwe. I have used the Pedders (Orange) online web query form to raise the question and ask for a quote. No response as yet, as it was over Christmas/New Year break and they are probably just returning to work with a skeleton staff I guess. A few knowledgeable people have suggested an extra leaf will do what I need it to do. I was not too concerned with the extra payload, more so leveling and supporting the new weight on the back of the ute to "normalise" it again. Was not too bad, dropped 3 cm at the back, a lot of tradies utes I see are the same and I guess I won't know much more until I see the little 11 foot Roadstar on the back for a distance tow? Raised my eyebrows when I read the bit about Pedders raising the paperwork for the Rego details, I am glad you mentioned that as I will take it up with them also. The ute is new so is free of Rego inspections for 5 years. It has raised a bit at the front end but it is not particularly noticeable other than the ride in the ute has improved with the extra weight on the back. Finished detailing the canopy yesterday, was a big job with the sugar soap and repainted the internal BBQ stand and off to Bunnings today to get some Barbie refurbisher. Was going to ditch the Barbie unit until I saw how well it was constructed and the quality old BBQ plate. Like EVERYTHING from our G.N. era, the quality of construction is so much better than so much comes off the (China) shelf these days!!!!!!
Hi Ronald, Just to clarify things for you, an increase in rear axle carrying capacity does not increase your GVM, but simply allows more weight to be carried on that axle, at the expense of the front axle.
Quite handy when towing, as when towball weight is applied weight obviously is removed from the front axle and transferred to the rear axle, usually at around 45% of the towball weight, dependent on many things, but mainly the towball overhang (distance from rear axle to hitchpoint) and the car's wheelbase.
Good luck, and please let us know of your results. Cheers
-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 3rd of January 2024 01:19:58 PM
