Australia Day, The Day we All Became Australians (not Invasion Day)

Craig1 · Guru

Australia Day, The Day we All Became Australians (not Invasion Day)

Greystone · Senior Member

So true!

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Before that special date of 26 January, all people living in Australia, including Aborigines born after 1921, were called British Subjects and forced to travel on British Passports and fight in British wars.
We all became Australians on the same day!
This is why we celebrate Australia Day on the 26th of January!
This was the day Australians became free to make our own decisions about how our citizens would be treated. It was the day Aborigines were declared Australians.

Well, not exactly....

Aboriginal peoples in this country did not have any voting rights until 1962 and not until 1965 in Queensland.

Then of course they did not exist in the census until 1971. That is 50 years after your "magic" date in 1921.

Cheers,

Peter

Brownie 64 · Veteran Member

G`day Craig,

There seems to be a some conjecture as to when the First Fleet arrived, I believe they started arriving on the 20/1/1788 & by the 24/1/1788 the entire fleet had arrived at Botany Bay.

My 5th Great Grandfather was a convict on the convict ship the Scarborough & was chosen as part of the landing party boat crew
and they went ashore on the 26/1/1788

And the rest is history as we know it and this date should always remain known as AUSTRALIA DAY

Craig1 · Guru

I did the most" fact checks "I could find prior to the post, but as always here and a good thing too, someone will find a query. Long live " I digress"

dogbox · Guru

the british could have a lot to answer for. the irish ,scotts, welsh, indians(both asian and north american), africans aboriginal, kiwis and lot of others who they mixed with in their travels and how it affected their lives

Daryl620 · Veteran Member

Rather than do alot of typing refer......

https://www.australiaday.org.au/about-australia-day/history/

Mobi Condo · Guru

Very interesting - thanks. You have given me some more research to do here.
Cheers - Ian

dorian · Guru

There will never be reconciliation with the indigenous peoples of this country until the old bigots and racists are long gone.

To me the problem has some easy and painless solutions. Move Australia Day to January 01, 1901, the date of federation, and replace the Union Jack with aboriginal insignia. And of course it goes without saying that this country should become a republic.

DMaxer · Guru

I imagine that the aboriginal insignia to which you refer is the yellow, red and black one. This is privately owned and subject to copyright.

How much do you think the taxpayers should pay for this to appease the whinging masses who like to claim aboriginality?

-- Edited by DMaxer on Thursday 6th of August 2020 09:07:03 AM

dorian · Guru

It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.

Rob Driver · Guru

dorian wrote:
It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.

I take offence to your comments Dorian.

Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.

Note I said the word OUR.

My thoughts are strong in this area and in my observation it is people with views like yourself are actually the problem and not, as you may think, the solution.

Concilliation works both ways and not all one way.....you leave our flag alone and explain to those who may think that they are hard done by in this country to stop getting tax payers Centrelink support and all the other EXTRA benefits that the select group receives.

In this country we are all Australians. Stop this continual attempt to divide us.

Regards

Angie

Craig1 · Guru

Look at all the Republics of the world and then look at us. No contest. Peace and mostly harmony within our borders. Republics either cut off your head, have mass slaughter in whole continents, breed dictators, or ignore Corona Virus in one large chunk of the world.

Grandad5 · Senior Member

Where did this assumption come from that 26th Jan was anything to do with Captain Cook?
I know my memory is fading but I was taught back in school that the date was the day that Governer Phillip raised the British flag declaring Australia a British colony. And a picture of that raising is prominate every Australia Day since.

I totally agree that the date of the Nationality and Citizenship Act of 1948 being enacted is also a very important point, and much more appropriate, but since to the bulk of Australians (I believe) associate the day to be a remembrance of the earlier event, is it now too late to try to change the significance of why the date was chosen?

History is never rewritten once it has been successfully taught for a long period of time, regardless of what new information comes to hand.

Who discovered Australia? Captain Cook! No, there were several others before him.
Who discovered North America? Christopher Columbus! Except the Vikings were there a couple of hundred years earlier.

I personally can't see much success likely in now trying to change the original significance of the date. I personally can't see any alternative other than changing the date. Regardless of how appropriate the date may be as has been described here.

Jim

the rocket · Guru

bentaxlebabe wrote:
dorian wrote:
It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.
I take offence to your comments Dorian.
Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.
Note I said the word OUR.
My thoughts are strong in this area and in my observation it is people with views like yourself are actually the problem and not, as you may think, the solution.
Concilliation works both ways and not all one way.....you leave our flag alone and explain to those who may think that they are hard done by in this country to stop getting tax payers Centrelink support and all the other EXTRA benefits that the select group receives.
In this country we are all Australians. Stop this continual attempt to divide us.
Regards
Angie

Hi angie, can you tell us what EXTRA benefits that the select group receive? And what select group are you referring to?

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Time this was locked. It is never going to change the set views.
Cheers,
Peter

Rob Driver · Guru

the rocket wrote:
bentaxlebabe wrote:
dorian wrote:
It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.
I take offence to your comments Dorian.
Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.
Note I said the word OUR.
My thoughts are strong in this area and in my observation it is people with views like yourself are actually the problem and not, as you may think, the solution.
Concilliation works both ways and not all one way.....you leave our flag alone and explain to those who may think that they are hard done by in this country to stop getting tax payers Centrelink support and all the other EXTRA benefits that the select group receives.
In this country we are all Australians. Stop this continual attempt to divide us.
Regards
Angie
Hi angie, can you tell us what EXTRA benefits that the select group receive? And what select group are you referring to?

The list is large but one very simple one is that in many regional towns our indigenous folk have children picked up by taxis before school taken to a venue and given breakfast and then transported to school. A similar thing happens in reverse at the end of each day.

We had a guy employed by us whose female partner ran one of these centres and just prior to the end of a financial year she was called upon to spend the money which was not used but had been allocated to the centre. Both her and her staff went to the local KMart and spent the money of well over $1000.00 on toys which were then given to the children.

This taxi and breakfast service, toys and other government financed benefits are not available to non indigenous folk.

It should be noted that non indigenous folk arent selected for employment in these areas, so lets just reverse the situation and listen to the cries of racist, discriminatory etc etc

I will repeat, We are all Australians

Regards

Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 09:58:22 AM

Mike Harding · Guru

Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Time this was locked. It is never going to change the set views.

It may or it may not, one never knows.

After listening to debate I changed my view about the "Sorry" issue which Kevin Rudd delivered.

Be they set or not I enjoy reading the views of others and they often make me reconsider my own views and that has to be a good thing.

Don't be so eager to close down debate, far too much of that going on currently.

Rob Driver · Guru

Back to Dorians views.

Many of the English settlers were originally sent here as convicts. Very few had money. We have all had 250 years to make things better for us all and that on the whole has happened.
There are indigenous and non indigenous that have failed.
Anyone who does fail gets a hand up but to enjoy the advantages of being Australian in this modern day we must be prepared to help ourselves.
Changing flags, changing dates of celebrations changing our the way we administer government wont change a thing....well at least not for the better.

The decisions made around many things in Aus favour indigenous. A simple example was the BLM rallies that were permit Ed to go in in major cities but we had to cancel ANZAC DAY. Anzac Day is about Australians and Kiwis. BLM movement is about somethings that have been happening half a world away.

Dorian you are not helping with any reconciliation while you have your attitude.

We are all Australians

Regards

Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 11:19:19 AM

Rob Driver · Guru

Mike Harding wrote:
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Time this was locked. It is never going to change the set views.
It may or it may not, one never knows.
After listening to debate I changed my view about the "Sorry" issue which Kevin Rudd delivered.
Be they set or not I enjoy reading the views of others and they often make me reconsider my own views and that has to be a good thing.
Don't be so eager to close down debate, far too much of that going on currently.

Well said Mike Harding sensible debate can be quite productive and at the least informing.

Regards

Angie

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

First you say....

bentaxlebabe wrote:
Well said Mike Harding sensible debate can be quite productive and at the least informing.

Then you get personal.

Dorian you are not helping with any reconciliation while you have your attitude.

That is not "sensible debate".

Cheers,

Peter

dorian · Guru

bentaxlebabe wrote:
I take offence to your comments Dorian.
Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.

I'm so tired of this old argument. Nobody lays down their life for a flag. They fight for their country, irrespective of whatever flag is flown.

And don't for one minute think that I don't respect the armed services and the sacrifices that they have made. In fact I resent your implication. In my opinion, there is never enough that any country can do for them, and I have said so elsewhere in this forum. In fact they will get a share of my estate.

As for bludging on the taxpayer, I agree that this is all too prevalent, and that many programs targeted at indigenous peoples are pointless and wasteful. But what does that have to do with Australia Day? If you're fixated on cost, then ask yourself how much would it cost to move Australia Day to a mutually acceptable date, and change the flag to better reflect the nation as it is today? Howard vacillated for a decade, but Rudd delivered an apology as soon as he got into office. What did that cost the country? My aboriginal friend tells me that Rudd's apology was extremely well received and did a great deal of good.

the rocket · Guru

bentaxlebabe wrote:
the rocket wrote:
bentaxlebabe wrote:
dorian wrote:
It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.
I take offence to your comments Dorian.
Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.
Note I said the word OUR.
My thoughts are strong in this area and in my observation it is people with views like yourself are actually the problem and not, as you may think, the solution.
Concilliation works both ways and not all one way.....you leave our flag alone and explain to those who may think that they are hard done by in this country to stop getting tax payers Centrelink support and all the other EXTRA benefits that the select group receives.
In this country we are all Australians. Stop this continual attempt to divide us.
Regards
Angie
Hi angie, can you tell us what EXTRA benefits that the select group receive? And what select group are you referring to?
The list is large but one very simple one is that in many regional towns our indigenous folk have children picked up by taxis before school taken to a venue and given breakfast and then transported to school. A similar thing happens in reverse at the end of each day.
We had a guy employed by us whose female partner ran one of these centres and just prior to the end of a financial year she was called upon to spend the money which was not used but had been allocated to the centre. Both her and her staff went to the local KMart and spent the money of well over $1000.00 on toys which were then given to the children.
This taxi and breakfast service, toys and other government financed benefits are not available to non indigenous folk.
It should be noted that non indigenous folk arent selected for employment in these areas, so lets just reverse the situation and listen to the cries of racist, discriminatory etc etc
I will repeat, We are all Australians
Regards
Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 09:58:22 AM

hi angie, so you are saying there are only programs in australia, for children who are indigenous that get picked up, fed and dropped off daily. Surely there are programs similar for non indigenous children. Thinking of children that go to special schools, do some get picked up and dropped off. I dont know. Does anyone know on here? What about child care centres picking up and dropping off. What about money for kids playing sport? Quite honestly if thats what it takes to educate children, then im all for it.

dogbox · Guru

does the flag not represent the country

i'm no history buff . but what day would be suitable to have australia day. as the 26 of january seems to offend some even though it is not the day cpt cook landed in australia in 1770

Brownie 64 · Veteran Member

Dayrl620 you got it 100% right, this is why we celebrate Australia Day on the date that it is!

As for you Dorian, Your just a smart arsed antagonist, people with ideals about changing the date of Australia day, changing the flag & going republic dont deserve to call themselves Australian, you are repulsive!

Youve made an enemy in me!

Rob Driver · Guru

Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
First you say....
bentaxlebabe wrote:
Well said Mike Harding sensible debate can be quite productive and at the least informing.

Then you get personal.
Dorian you are not helping with any reconciliation while you have your attitude.
That is not "sensible debate".
Cheers,
Peter

Well it appears that it is when it is the other way.

Regards

Angie

Rob Driver · Guru

the rocket wrote:
bentaxlebabe wrote:
the rocket wrote:
bentaxlebabe wrote:
dorian wrote:
It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.
I take offence to your comments Dorian.
Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.
Note I said the word OUR.
My thoughts are strong in this area and in my observation it is people with views like yourself are actually the problem and not, as you may think, the solution.
Concilliation works both ways and not all one way.....you leave our flag alone and explain to those who may think that they are hard done by in this country to stop getting tax payers Centrelink support and all the other EXTRA benefits that the select group receives.
In this country we are all Australians. Stop this continual attempt to divide us.
Regards
Angie
Hi angie, can you tell us what EXTRA benefits that the select group receive? And what select group are you referring to?
The list is large but one very simple one is that in many regional towns our indigenous folk have children picked up by taxis before school taken to a venue and given breakfast and then transported to school. A similar thing happens in reverse at the end of each day.
We had a guy employed by us whose female partner ran one of these centres and just prior to the end of a financial year she was called upon to spend the money which was not used but had been allocated to the centre. Both her and her staff went to the local KMart and spent the money of well over $1000.00 on toys which were then given to the children.
This taxi and breakfast service, toys and other government financed benefits are not available to non indigenous folk.
It should be noted that non indigenous folk arent selected for employment in these areas, so lets just reverse the situation and listen to the cries of racist, discriminatory etc etc
I will repeat, We are all Australians
Regards
Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 09:58:22 AM
hi angie, so you are saying there are only programs in australia, for children who are indigenous that get picked up, fed and dropped off daily. Surely there are programs similar for non indigenous children. Thinking of children that go to special schools, do some get picked up and dropped off. I dont know. Does anyone know on here? What about child care centres picking up and dropping off. What about money for kids playing sport? Quite honestly if thats what it takes to educate children, then im all for it.

Hi Rocket,

You asked me for an example and I gave you one.

Try dropping off a non indigenous child into the situation I quoted above.

When children are being cared for in what we may refer to as the open market then there is no discrimination in the system between indigenous and non indigenous, but, and a big but, if there were, there would be hell to pay.

You and some others miss my point, We Are All Australians.

Regards

Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 11:25:01 AM

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 11:26:21 AM

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

After the end of the wars, Germany was required (and agreed) to pay reparations to those countries and peoples that were damaged by their actions.
They are still paying.
Are there any here that believe that it would have been OK for Germany to simply say "Sorry, we will stop doing those bad things and go home now"?

There are also those who seem to think that all of this Aboriginal persecution (including land theft, discrimination, exploitation, and genocide) happened a long time ago and is all forgotten about, or should be forgotten about.
Well we live near what was a home in Adelaide for Aboriginal children that were forcibly removed from their families. Most of these kids came form the far north of SA, hundreds of km away. www.southaustralianhistory.com.au/colebrook.htm
This home was not closed until 1972.
Most of us know what happened to many kids in homes like this and many of those kids are still about (and many are still younger than most on this forum), except those who were so badly affected that they finished up in jail or committed suicide.

We are all Australians? We are certainly not EQUAL Australians.
Cheers,
Peter

dogbox · Guru

Brownie 64 wrote:

Dayrl620 you got it 100% right, this is why we celebrate Australia Day on the date that it is!

As for you Dorian, Your just a smart arsed antagonist, people with ideals about changing the date of Australia day, changing the flag & going republic dont deserve to call themselves Australian, you are repulsive!

Youve made an enemy in me!

why because he has a different opinion to yours?

if we all thought the same wouldn't life be like a flock of sheep all moving along same speed eating same grass

the rocket · Guru

bentaxlebabe wrote:
the rocket wrote:
bentaxlebabe wrote:
the rocket wrote:
bentaxlebabe wrote:
dorian wrote:
It would be easy to commission a royalty free insignia.
I take offence to your comments Dorian.
Some of my family have died defending our flag and our country.
Note I said the word OUR.
My thoughts are strong in this area and in my observation it is people with views like yourself are actually the problem and not, as you may think, the solution.
Concilliation works both ways and not all one way.....you leave our flag alone and explain to those who may think that they are hard done by in this country to stop getting tax payers Centrelink support and all the other EXTRA benefits that the select group receives.
In this country we are all Australians. Stop this continual attempt to divide us.
Regards
Angie
Hi angie, can you tell us what EXTRA benefits that the select group receive? And what select group are you referring to?
The list is large but one very simple one is that in many regional towns our indigenous folk have children picked up by taxis before school taken to a venue and given breakfast and then transported to school. A similar thing happens in reverse at the end of each day.
We had a guy employed by us whose female partner ran one of these centres and just prior to the end of a financial year she was called upon to spend the money which was not used but had been allocated to the centre. Both her and her staff went to the local KMart and spent the money of well over $1000.00 on toys which were then given to the children.
This taxi and breakfast service, toys and other government financed benefits are not available to non indigenous folk.
It should be noted that non indigenous folk arent selected for employment in these areas, so lets just reverse the situation and listen to the cries of racist, discriminatory etc etc
I will repeat, We are all Australians
Regards
Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 09:58:22 AM
hi angie, so you are saying there are only programs in australia, for children who are indigenous that get picked up, fed and dropped off daily. Surely there are programs similar for non indigenous children. Thinking of children that go to special schools, do some get picked up and dropped off. I dont know. Does anyone know on here? What about child care centres picking up and dropping off. What about money for kids playing sport? Quite honestly if thats what it takes to educate children, then im all for it.
Hi Rocket,
You asked me for an example and I gave you one.
Try dropping off a non indigenous child into the situation I quoted above.
When children are being cared for in what we may refer to as the open market then there is no discrimination in the system between indigenous and non indigenous, but, and a big but, if there were, there would be hell to pay.
You and some others miss my point, We Are All Australians.
Regards
Angie

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 11:25:01 AM

-- Edited by bentaxlebabe on Thursday 6th of August 2020 11:26:21 AM

Yes we are and different people and groups get different things depending on their needs. Ie. subsidised childcare, subsidised housing, cheaper courses, subsidised rail, bus, ferry, to and from hospital transport subsidies, taxi subsidies, electricity discounts, rates discounts, rego. Discounts, chemist discounts, rent subsidies, sporting subsidies, and the list goes on. you may be missing my point, they are not the only ones getting things needed from the government. we pay taxes for all in australia to benefit, Be it schools, hospitals, infrastructure, and even helping those that need help to access education And food. If the government deems it necessary, then its necessary. i for one want to see aboriginal people educated and uplifted.